Talk:Claddagh ring

A full length artical about the Claddagh Ring and Claddagh village is available under "Claddagh Village" in the encyclopedia.

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I believe much in this article is copyvio -- it's hard to tell, though, since it's been here since August and it's replicated in some parts of the net by virtue of being here. Still, I am sure that some of it is a quote, and I think much of it is lifted from elsewhere. Anyone have a thought on this, or an idea of what to do? I don't know if we should delete and start over, or just assume that having it in the history is a minor offense... Jwrosenzweig 15:59, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)

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A lot of anon additions have seriously confused the significance section. As far as I am aware, the significance section's instructions are now backwards. This may, however, be a difference between claddagh wearers in the US and those in Ireland. Anyone know for sure which way a claddagh ought to point to indicate marriage? If no one does, I'll switch it back to the way it used to be (crown towards fingernail = marriage), and do some research to back up my claim. Jwrosenzweig 09:54, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

Update: This site supports my belief. This site doesn't. I fear we need a carefully worded explanation of the diverse opinions....unless this is cultural as I suggest above. Any help is seriously appreciated. Jwrosenzweig 09:56, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

The way the article is now written is the tradition as I learned it (heart facing body equals married), and as I've seen it done in both Irish and Irish-American families from a variety of locations. I've never heard of the opposite being done. Are you saying that the tradition you learned was of the heart worn facing out to indicate marriage, and in to indicate less-serious relationships? Where is this the tradition? --Kathryn NicDhàna ♫♦♫ 06:42, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

It is definitely heart facing in means taken, facing out means single in Ireland, how the Americans do things i don't know. however the opposite makes very little sense. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nato2101 (talk • contribs) 23:43, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

History

What's the deal with the 'historical details' section? I didn't do any fact checking, but that's not what I'm even concerned about. It just doesn't seem to adhere to the tone and style of other objective entries. It's personal and somewhat weepy. Can anything be done to rectify this? I'm no Claddagh Ring expert.

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I agree the "historical details" section is not objective. Subjective comments such as those referring to the "Irish psyche" or "half history" should be backed by facts or removed.

Citations

Many of these statements are unsourced and quick google searches that I've tried haven't been able to support them. For example "The popularity of the TV show led to an increased popularity of the rings." has no source, and many different keywords didn't locate data to even show escalated sales after episodes airing, and in no way at all made any link between buffy and sales. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bifgis (talk • contribs) 20:23, December 3, 2006

Agreed, this article really needs sourcing. The Buffy thing is true, but possibly not verifiable. My "sources" are catalogs, street vendors, internet vendors and eBay. Whereas before the show the rings were rarely seen outside the Irish community (and diaspora), now they seem to be everywhere. --Kathryn NicDhàna ♫♦♫ 20:53, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

By the way, the Claddagh Ring's symbolism was also explained in the Movie Ladder 49 by actor Joaquin Phoenix. That is how I first heard about the ring. Can anyone add this to the main page, I don't know how to do it and don't want to mess with the article.--132.18.128.6 (talk) 18:38, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

...during the rule of Queen Mary II

From first paragraph, this information is irrelevant to the article. 87.210.35.24 (talk) 13:06, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Design

I think it'd be useful to specify exactly what it means for the design to be 'pointing inwards' - what part is pointing in? Is the point of the heart towards your hand, or is it the crown that's towards your hand? I'd put in the info myself, but I honestly don't know. -Elizabennet | talk 18:24, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, we've had some confusion over how to best describe this. If you look at the picture of the ring, that's the design right side up, with the crown up top and the point of the heart at the bottom. So, "facing outwards" means the point of the heart is away from the body, and the crown closer to the body. The design looks right side up to someone viewing your hand. If the design is "facing inwards" it means that when you look down at your own hand, the design is right side up (crown away from body, point of heart towards body). Does this make sense? I certainly welcome a clearer, more concise way to describe it, as people keep getting confused about this. Slán - Kathryn NicDhàna ♫♦♫ 01:22, 29 February 2008 (UTC)!!!!!!!

Pronunciation

If anyone knows how to pronounce claddagh, and they want to add a pronunciation, that would be awesome. My mom says this word "Claude". I usually say "clad-dag" but I have no idea what the correct pronunciation is. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Maurajbo (talk • contribs) 14:37, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

Its like clad-ah. You silly Americans :P 86.42.12.126 (talk) 14:45, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

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Update: actually claddagh is prounounced "clod-uh" XD- edited by a silly american —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.186.129.199 (talk) 19:10, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

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Within Australia, I hear the word pronounced as 'clad-ah' by those with an Irish accent, and 'clod-ah' by non-Irish, in order to mimic the way the word sounds with an Irish accent.

58.178.148.161 (talk) 13:23, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

If anyone's reading....

• This article could use some really healthy background, and a paragraph from William Jones' Finger Ring Lore (London, 1890, sorry, I don't have it in front of me now) would do wonders. Jones explains this ring as exclusive to the fishing village of Claddugh [his spelling], is a species of fede ring, owes some design inspiration to the gemell ring (twin, interlocking rings). Furthermore, Jones makes it clear that the native women of the xenophobic village of Claddugh passed a ring from mother to first-wed daughter, as an heirloom. Therefore, Jones says, it was exclusively Claddugh's custom. Finally he says "these rings are still worn... today" [meaning 1890] and that they are "very old." Ideas?

04:00, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

Ideas included in history section.75.21.155.231 (talk) 04:14, 18 July 2009 (UTC)

Some clarification on legends, please

OK, the legends behind the Claddugh have NO known citations in the literature such as it is. Jones is the ultimate authority on ring lore, and he makes no mention of any legends behind Claddugh rings. Can we somehow just put the original reference or citation of where these stories have been reported? Otherwise they should be removed from the article. And I will remove them if the work isn't done. I've tried and cannot justify the presence of these "legends of the Claddugh ring".75.21.146.222 (talk) 10:37, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

This Claddagh piece points out that Hardiman's story about Joyce doesn't include all the 'forging a ring in exile for his Galway girlfriend' stuff. That may be as difficult to pin down as some of the other legends. Lelijg (talk) 16:40, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Info on the Margaret Joyce legend here Lelijg (talk) 17:59, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Actually I question how much "info on the legends" will help this article. We don't need faerie tales, we need actual fact, notes about customs and usage. I was the editor who changed the wording about the orientation because no one seems to know how to express this in writing. I.e. the orientation of the ring-symbol. If it is wearer-oriented that means you see it the right way when you look at it...meaning to another it is seen upside-down. When it is viewer-oriented it means it's worn so that everyone can see what it is, and it looks right-side-up to a viewer. And this has an impact on the symbolism.

If worn on the RIGHT hand top-of-crown oriented toward wearer, it's "right-side-up" and it means there's a boyfriend, whereas upside-down means looking for boyfriend. When an engagement takes place the ring is transferred to the left hand but the point of the heart rather than the crown faces the wearer. It is turned around when the woman is married. That is how I learned it. Why all this fuss about how to write it? Why not just put photos?

Also, stop running to websites! They don't know what the hell they're talking about with website info, which is plagiarized from dummies in the first place.75.21.152.167 (talk) 15:35, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Claddugh, a historical definiens

Something vital about the classification of the Claddugh ring: this article rightfully mentions the fede ring (mani-in-fede). However, Jones and Kunz do NOT classify the Claddugh as a fede ring--it is "an Irish WEDDING/BETROTHAL ring" as these scientists classify it.

A fede ring has clasped hands--the Claddugh does not have clasped hands. So it's inspired by the fede but is not a fede in itself. To say Claddugh is "inspired by" the fede ring is correct. If no one has a heart attack, I'm going to try once again to rectify the rhetoric of the article ref this point.

May I also give another stab at re-writing the orientations of the ring? Can I just say it's a subject that has altered over the years? Though Jones is clear enough, and as he is the oldest and best source, well....75.21.152.167 (talk) 16:06, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Joyce Family details Sorry, but this unverified and frankly ponderous info doesn't belong in an article about Claddugh rings. I have removed it, again. Why not make a link to another page?75.21.152.167 (talk) 16:15, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Simple Minds... and Buffy

Some records by Scottish band Simple Minds have a Claddagh symbol on the cover (Live in the City of Light, Silver box...), maybe someone will want to add it to the "Modern usage and the Claddagh in Folklore and Fiction" section.

... and I don't remember "when worn on the left hand, facing in, in the usual "married" configuration - as meaning, "the wearer is destined to be with his or her love forever." in the TV show Buffy the Vampire Slayer... Maybe the source (the book "Bite Me") is wrong... the dialogue in the show is (season 2 episode 13 "Surprise") :

"It's a Claddagh ring. The hands represent friendship, the crown represents loyalty. The heart, well, you know... Wear it with the heart pointing toward you, it means you belong to somebody."

It's Angel talking to Buffy, while giving her his ring.

Hope this helps,

Megatof (talk) 20:03, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

I'm not good enough in english to correct the page if necessary.

This is good resource material for modern usage in a very limited way. The reference to the band and to "Buffy" apparently must be fitted in someplace. However, you must supply the evidence and be sure no copyright violation is occurring--you can show the band's cover art. As to "Buffy", I think it is MORE THAN ENOUGH that it's even mentioned in the article. We need less garbage, not more.75.21.119.97 (talk) 17:10, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Jumping back in to remind anyone to LOOK HERE 1ST if you want to edit the page. Too much garbage has been added to this in the past, and there is even an admonishment about adding unnecessary material here. I did not add that notation, but I applaud it. If it isn't verifiable Claddagh-ring-related, DON'T ADD IT HERE. Also, let's leave off the "Buffy" references. Just mentioning it with its cited source is more than enough. And I take back anything I said about the band Simple Minds. We can say they often use the ring on their cover art and no more. I don't think it would be wise to use a photo of any of their art here.75.21.119.97 (talk) 17:18, 27 August 2010 (UTC)