Talk:Total Drama World Tour/Archive 3: Difference between revisions

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This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Why is the Australian version put up?

It's going to be different in the Canadian version and American version so why did we put the Australian version up? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.118.151.39 (talk) 17:52, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Because it's the only information we have right now. If you read the footnote on the page, we have stated that we'll be replacing the information with what happens in the Canadian version when that becomes available. Twentydragon 20:11, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

You mean the North American version (which both Canadian and American versions are the same).--Mikeymike2001 (talk) 20:30, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Sure, that. I specify "Canadian" because if the U.S. version does happen to be different this time, the Canadian version should still be the one that gets listed, simply because that's where the cartoon comes from. Twentydragon 22:07, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Why can't the two versions both be presented? This is like North America trumps Australia.--Tricia Takanawa (talk) 22:20, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

That's not the case at all. The ending shown in the region from which the cartoon originates will be considered the main ending for the table. Any other endings that may appear elsewhere will be considered alternate endings and will be mentioned in a footnote. If it came from Australia, then Australia's ending would be the main one. It has nothing to do with one region "trumping" another. Twentydragon 00:28, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

A suggestion

For the Total Drama Reloaded ET, we should make it a template too. That seems to stop IPs. But we should semi-protect the template. (RealityShowsRock (talk) 00:35, 28 August 2010 (UTC))

I'd be in favor of this. Twentydragon 01:23, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Can ww semi-protect this one too? And Twentydragon, are you an admin? (RealityShowsRock (talk) 11:57, 28 August 2010 (UTC))

No, I'm not. But I agree that the page would do well to be semi-protected. Twentydragon 19:43, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

1st/2nd/3rd?

Should it be numerical, or should it be WINNER, RUNNER-UP, and THIRD? TDI19 (talk) 23:50, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

It's nice and concise as ordinals. I don't see a need to change them to text. Twentydragon 06:25, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

I like them too, so we are set there. TDI19 (talk) 02:46, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Elimination Table Colors

The elimination table is changing too much which causes some problems. I don't really think the different color "IN" is necessary. If it were to stay, I think it contrasts too much with the other colors and I believe it should be relatively the same color as the regular "IN". The "IN" currently is a darkish teal. I think it should either be a light beige/yellow or the second color should not exist at all.

Secondly, I do not think the "HIGH"s should be included in the table. It really has no significance whatsoever regarding the elimination. The "LOW"s, on the other hand, have somewhat of a purpose since it shows who almost went home. I took the one HIGH that was in the table (for Leshawna) until further consensus.

Lastly, the table does not look eye appealing, which is another reason to get rid of the other IN color. The table looks like a semi-rainbow and colors, such as blue and yellow/red, do not look appealing. Users with IP addresses just keep changing the elimination table's colors without an explanation. --DragonofFire (龙火) 04:29, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Then why don't we agree on a standard set to use on all Total Drama tables? Preferably something that's readable. Black on dark red does not qualify. I suggest white on dark red for eliminations, black on orange for withdrawals, black on yellow for low-placings, white on medium green for winners, and a black on a light green for those who advanced because of a teammate. That should be all we need. Twentydragon (talk) 10:13, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

So far the table looks like this:

Place	Name	Ep 1	Ep 2
TBA	Alejandro	IN	IN
TBA	Bridgette	WIN	IN
TBA	Cody	IN	WIN
TBA	Courtney	IN	WIN
TBA	DJ	WIN	LOW
TBA	Gwen	IN	WIN
TBA	Harold	WIN	IN
TBA	Heather	IN	WIN
TBA	Izzy*	IN	IN
TBA	LeShawna	WIN	IN
TBA	Lindsay	WIN	IN
TBA	Noah	IN	IN
TBA	Owen	IN	IN
TBA	Sierra*	IN	WIN
TBA	Tyler	IN	IN
16	Ezekiel	IN	OUT
17	Duncan	QUIT

Using your suggestions, the table will look something like this:

Place	Name	Ep 1	Ep 2
TBA	Alejandro	IN	IN
TBA	Bridgette	WIN	IN
TBA	Cody	IN	WIN
TBA	Courtney	IN	WIN
TBA	DJ	WIN	LOW
TBA	Gwen	IN	WIN
TBA	Harold	WIN	IN
TBA	Heather	IN	WIN
TBA	Izzy*	IN	IN
TBA	LeShawna	WIN	IN
TBA	Lindsay	WIN	IN
TBA	Noah	IN	IN
TBA	Owen	IN	IN
TBA	Sierra*	IN	WIN
TBA	Tyler	IN	IN
16	Ezekiel	IN	OUT
17	Duncan	QUIT

I'm not so sure on the white on medium green since I think the medium green is light enough. I still do not believe that the second "IN" color needs to contrast that much. It should just be a beige or a light blue color so it will not stand out as much as the teal. --DragonofFire (龙火) 14:42, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

By "medium green", I meant 0-128-0, the same color used already. I don't think we even need a color for "IN". It's already descriptive enough, methinks. But nice job putting this here; 'twas a nice surprise. Twentydragon (talk) 12:06, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

I seriously dont know which one I like better. They're both good, but in a different way. anyone here know what im saying??? (98.231.218.47 (talk) 22:55, 5 July 2010 (UTC)) or RSRC

The point I'm trying to make is that if we have a specific standard set of colors that can easily be read on virtually all monitors, then we can avoid disagreements, unnecessary codes and colors, and confusing notations in the future. Twentydragon (talk) 03:36, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

This is what I'm suggesting:

Place	Name	Ep 1	Ep 2
TBA	Alejandro	6th	LOST
TBA	Bridgette	5th	IN
TBA	Cody	10th	WIN
TBA	Courtney	13th	WIN
TBA	DJ	2nd	LOW
TBA	Gwen	13th	WIN
TBA	Harold	1st	LOST
TBA	Heather	12th	WIN
TBA	Izzy*	15th	IN
TBA	LeShawna	3rd	LOST
TBA	Lindsay	4th	LOST
TBA	Noah	8th	IN
TBA	Owen	9th	IN
TBA	Sierra*	10th	WIN
TBA	Tyler	7th	IN
16	Ezekiel	15th	OUT
17	Duncan	QUIT

Twentydragon (talk) 03:52, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

I like the WIN, IN, and LOST, but i dont think the number placing is neccesary. If you are to add another color, it should be for the losing team, and not the second place team. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Thomasvisel (talk • contribs) 01:01, 8 July 2010 (UTC)

The numerical placing is only there because there were no defined "winners" and "losers" in the first challenge (Pyramind Over/Under), and no one was actually eliminated. The numerical placings were instead used to form the basis for the team divisions. I also don't think it's necessary to add another color unless it's something light and easy to read text against, like . Twentydragon (talk) 02:12, 8 July 2010 (UTC)

Okay, on the subject of a new standard for all Total Drama contestant tables, here is my new proposal:

Place	Name	Team	Ep 1	Ep 2	Ep 3
TBA	Alejandro	Chris	6th	IN	IN
TBA	Bridgette	Victory	5th	LOSE	LOSE
TBA	Cody	Amazon	10th	WIN	WIN
TBA	Courtney	Amazon	13th	WIN	WIN
TBA	DJ	Victory	2nd	LOW	LOW
TBA	Gwen	Amazon	13th	WIN	WIN
TBA	Heather	Amazon	12th	WIN	WIN
TBA	Izzy*	Chris	15th	IN	IN
TBA	LeShawna	Victory	3rd	LOSE	LOSE
TBA	Lindsay	Victory	4th	LOSE	LOSE
TBA	Noah	Chris	8th	IN	IN
TBA	Owen	Chris	9th	IN	IN
TBA	Sierra*	Amazon	10th	WIN	WIN
TBA	Tyler	Chris	7th	IN	IN
15	Harold	Victory	1st	LOSE	WD
16	Ezekiel	Victory	15th	OUT
17	Duncan	None	WD

Pink Team Amazon | Yellow Team Victory | Sky blue Team Chris

Dark green Direct win | Light green Indirect win | Tan Defeat

Dark red Elimination | Orange Withdrawal | Gainsboro Low placing

Here are the issues I fixed:

The individual challenge (Episode 1) no longer uses ambiguous "win" and "loss" terminology; rather, it uses a clear ranking system.
Readers are no longer relying solely on the background color of a contestant's name to determine team, as per Wikipedia's Color Accessibility Standards.
Teal-backed "IN" spaces denoting the second-place team have been removed, in favor of a lighter, tan-backed space denoting the losing team.
Since yellow is used for Team Victory, gainsboro is used for the low placing.
"QUIT" has been replaced with the more clear, concise, and professional "WD", for "withdrawn".

Any input you guys have for this should help standardize the tables used and make them easier to understand. Thanks. Twentydragon (talk) 18:38, 11 July 2010 (UTC)

I think the team column isn't necessary since it is already shown in the table's key. I still like the yellow color for the "LOW"s, so the team color for team victory can go back to the golden color. I am unsure of the "LOSE"s since it shows the losing team, however, it is not in any of the previous elimination tables. Also, when the teams dissolve, only one or two people will win each challenge, meaning everyone else will "LOSE" and I just think it would be easier just to put IN. Lastly, the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc. placings do not follow the other tables, as well. For example, for TDA episodes 1 and 2, there was a similar format with the placings and I don't think that should change. Other than that, the table is fine and I appreciate the time you took to create the table (if any). --DragonofFire (龙火) 22:08, 11 July 2010 (UTC)

The Team column was added because, according to Wikipedia's Color Accessibility Standards, color should not be the sole means of communicating information. In this case, it was. Can you think of a better word to use than "LOSE" for the last-place team (after teams dissolve, "LOSE" becomes moot unless there's a tie for last place)? I see you suggested using "IN", and while that can work, I don't think we should rely on that. It goes back to using color again. I also understand the concern for the numerical placings, but I believe they're important here, since that's how teams were determined; otherwise there would only be one "WIN" (under the strictest definition) for Harold, while the rest read "IN". In addition, this is a proposal for a new standard that would replace the color schemes of the previous seasons' tables, so whether it follows them is irrelevant. Thanks for inputting, by the way. Twentydragon (talk) 04:38, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

I think most of this table is okay, since it is made so it's better for people that are colorblind. --Ha dg er 04:09, 12 July 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, but I get the sense you want to suggest changes. Please do. Twentydragon (talk) 04:38, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Well, I don't think the "LOSE" part is really necessary. We really only need to put the winning team. However, I also think it is good on the table, since some teams don't win or lose the challenge. --Ha dg er 08:59, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

So if I understand you correctly, you're saying that it's unnecessary but helpful. Is that right? Twentydragon (talk) 00:32, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Yup. That's what I mean. However, now I think that it should be kept on the table. --Ha dg er 08:07, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Okay then. If we're in agreement, I'd like to go ahead an implement this on the page. Twentydragon (talk) 23:48, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Done. The changes we discussed have been made. Twentydragon (talk) 09:57, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

Well, I really like the way it was before. (98.231.218.47 (talk) 02:45, 20 July 2010 (UTC))

Thanks for your input, although the previous version was extremely unfriendly to those with limited vision or color-blindness. Do you have any suggestions to improve the new one? Twentydragon (talk) 03:55, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

If you guys liked it better how it was or feel that the color scheme still needs improvement, please say so here before going off and changing it. Otherwise, I will assume you don't know what you're doing (which may in fact not be the case). So please, please, use the Talk page first. Twentydragon (talk) 15:46, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

I really don't like how this one is almost completly different from the TDI and TDA ones. I mean:

Instead of "IN" for the losing team, it's for the runner-up team. The losing team now gets "LOSE". I do think that instead of "LOSE", the runner-up team should be in the color "LOSE" is in now (tan), tagged "IN", and the losing team should get "IN" colored white.
"LOW" is a different color (gainsboro).
We now have an alternate column describling what team each camper is on, even placing Izzy and Sierra swapped in this section to show that they switched teams. The latter is completly unnecessary, they switched teams nearly in the begining like Izzy and Saide, we can just put it in a footnote. If it's to sort them out via teams, it's bad because Izzy would be grouped with Team Amazon (and Sierra on Chris) even though she was only in for two episodes. Although as of this writing this isn't a problem as the teams are switched back.
The first episode listed who crossed at what place. This is unnecessary and trivial.
The dark "WIN"s and "OUT"s have white text.

I think if this is how an elimination table should be, then at least switch the Total Drama Island and Total Drama Action ones to this style. Great Pikmin Fan (TD) (Talk) 00:00, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

Thank you for your input, but I feel you're protesting the very purpose of the reformat. Yes, it's different. However, this style is intended to be a replacement for those first two, adding more clarity, visibility, and simplicity to the tables.

That might be a valid point, although I don't see a better way to do this. "LOSE" (and the color) is for all players tied for last place, which includes teammates. If it changes in the way you're proposing, then once the teams are dissolved, then the tan background will either apply only to the second-place player or to everyone not tied for last.
Yes. "LOW" has been changed to gainsboro. Yellow was needed for Team Victory, as almost the entire table needed to be lightened. Rather than use the same color for both a team and the low-ranked player, I thought it prudent to use something else.
While Izzy and Sierra did switch early on, they were still assigned to the teams originally shown. No, it's not necessary, but it's there for clarity. You may note that the column reads "Current Team", showing which team they are currently on. This, like the background colors of any other cell, is only used to help communicate information. It's not a replacement for the footnote; it's a supplement.
The contestants' rankings are only shown because that was how teams were determined. It allows you to (mostly) sort the table by original team makeup.
Yes. The text on the dark red and green colors has been changed to white. This was for readability only, as you can see that the background colors have not been changed. I, and many others, had a lot of difficulty distinguishing between the two; I can only imagine someone who's colorblind trying to read it.

The intent is to, once this format has been adequately perfected, replace the other two with this new style. Again, your input is greatly appreciated. Twentydragon (talk) 02:00, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the input twenty. (98.231.218.47 (talk) 23:34, 24 July 2010 (UTC))

I need help maintaining it. Every time I look at it, someone else has come in and taken a wrecking ball to the thing. I cannot keep up with this. In addition, for everyone, before you go ahead and make big new changes to the table, please discuss them here! Twentydragon (talk) 07:26, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Hi! I have had a ton of experience in maintaining the Total Drama articles... and it is reallllly annoying- in the past and as I can see, currently too! I will be in contact with an administrator soon to block the page from IP addresses. Any IP who wants to contribute in a productive way can come to the talk page and suggest ideas, which we can later put up. And on the team issue with the second place team... why not give them the "HIGH" ranking? TDI19 (talk) 23:36, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. "HIGH", as it was used before, was the direct opposite of "LOW", meaning that while the contestant in question was still on the losing team, their name was the first one called. Using "HIGH" in a different meaning alongside "LOW" may just lead to confusion.

At any rate, I've also gone ahead and reverted the table back to our last-discussed version of the colors and undone all vandalism and fallacious edits in one fell swoop. I'm posting this table here as well so that we can further discuss what might need changing. Twentydragon (talk) 00:11, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

Here is the current version of the table. If you have changes you want to make, please discuss them here before you go off and edit it up. Also, don't forget to read this whole section; it's come a long way: Twentydragon (talk) 00:11, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

Place	Name	Current Team	Ep 1²	Ep 2	Ep 3	Ep 4	Ep 5³	Ep 6⁴	Ep 7
—	Alejandro	Chris	6	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN
—	Cody	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN
—	Courtney	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN
—	DJ	Victory	2	LOW	LOW	LOW	IN	IN	LOW
—	Gwen	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN
—	Heather	Amazon	12	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN
—	Izzy¹	Chris	15-16	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN
—	Lindsay	Victory	4	LOSE	LOSE	LOSE	IN	IN	LOSE
—	Noah	Chris	8	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN
—	Owen	Chris	9	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN
—	Sierra¹	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN
—	Tyler	Chris	7	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN
13	LeShawna	Victory	3	LOSE	LOSE	LOSE	IN	IN	OUT
14	Bridgette	Victory	5	LOSE	LOSE	OUT
15	Harold	Victory	1	LOSE	WD
16	Ezekiel	Victory	15-16	OUT
17	Duncan	None	WD

The following have been summarized and condensed to save page space:

¹ Switched teams. // ² Individual challenge. // ³ Reward challenge. // ⁴ Aftermath episode.

Team Amazon. // Team Chris. // Team Victory. // No team.

Direct win. // Indirect win (someone else won it for the team). // Did not win, did not lose.

Last place but still in. // Last place, last called. // Voted out. // Withdrew.

Twentydragon (talk) 00:11, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

THREE THINGS! I think that the "current team" column should be deleted at the end of the season. I think that Team Victory's color should be made a darker, golden color, so we can then bring yellow back for the bottom 2 member. Lastly, to solve the three team crisis we can... (a) mark the losing team as "LOW" but with a different color or (b) mark them as IN (-) and the second place team as IN (+) as has been done with Top Chef! Thanks! TDI19 (talk) 02:31, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

The heading may need to be changed from current team, but the team column needs to remain. We cannot rely solely on colour to indicate team assignments. —C.Fred (talk) 02:57, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

There is one problem with using gold ( ) for Team Victory: that color has been set aside for the winner of the season. Granted it could still be used, but even in the show, Team Victory's assigned color has been yellow, not gold. As far as the wording used, I advise against using "LOW" for more than simply indicating an almost-elimination. We want to avoid relying on colors alone to indicate certain information, like the difference between a loss and a near-elimination. Twentydragon (talk) 04:34, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

Check out the elimination table colors in Design Star and Shear Genius. They are very clean and easy to read- I think something similar to them should be done with TDWT, TDA, and TDI, because, let's face it, they all need a re-do. TDI19 (talk) 00:58, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

Not bad, though I'd advise against using similar colors with similar words like they do. Hmm, lemme try something... Twentydragon (talk) 06:33, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

Let's Simplify

Okay, we're once again using way too many colors on the article's table. "Voted off" and simply "eliminated" should not be separate; neither should "last one safe" and "almost eliminated". In fact, gold and silver for the winner and runner-up are pretty much unneeded as well. Additionally, whatever happened to discussing big changes to the table before making them? Twentydragon (talk) 14:49, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Blue-Red Layout

Place	Name	Current Team	Ep 1²	Ep 2	Ep 3	Ep 4	Ep 5³	Ep 6⁴	Ep 7	Ep 8
—	Alejandro	Chris	6	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Cody	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	Courtney	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	DJ	Victory	1-3	LOW	LOW	LOW	IN	IN	LOW	WIN
—	Gwen	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	Heather	Amazon	12	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOW
—	Izzy¹	Chris	15-16	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Lindsay	Victory	4	LOSE	LOSE	LOSE	IN	IN	LOSE	WIN
—	Noah	Chris	8	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Owen	Chris	9	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Sierra¹	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	Tyler	Chris	7	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
13	LeShawna	Victory	1-3	LOSE	LOSE	LOSE	IN	IN	OUT
14	Bridgette	Victory	5	LOSE	LOSE	OUT
15	Harold	Victory	1-3	LOSE	WD
16	Ezekiel	Victory	15-16	OUT
17	Duncan	None	WD

¹ Switched teams. // ² Individual challenge. // ³ Reward challenge. // ⁴ Aftermath episode.

Team Amazon. // Team Chris. // Team Victory. // No team.

Direct win. // Indirect win (someone else won it for the team). // Did not win, did not lose.

Last place but still in. // Last place, last called. // Voted out. // Withdrew.

What do you think? I was going for a clear distinction, with winning cells still blue-tinted and losing cells still red-tinted. Too pastel? Twentydragon (talk) 06:33, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

I honestly love the pastel scheme- it is sooo much easier on the eye than our current theme. However, I think the blue and red is a little too bright... definitely better though... TDI19 (talk) 03:24, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

The colors strike me as a bit team-biased, so I'll try again with green and either brown or purple, closer to the current layout. Twentydragon (talk) 03:39, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

Green-Tan Layout

Place	Name	Current Team	Ep 1²	Ep 2	Ep 3	Ep 4	Ep 5³	Ep 6⁴	Ep 7	Ep 8³
—	Alejandro	Chris	6	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Cody	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	Courtney	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	DJ	Victory	1-3	LOW	LOW	LOW	IN	IN	LOW	WIN
—	Gwen	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	Heather	Amazon	12	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOW
—	Izzy¹	Chris	15-16	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Lindsay	Victory	4	LOSE	LOSE	LOSE	IN	IN	LOSE	WIN
—	Noah	Chris	8	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Owen	Chris	9	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Sierra¹	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	Tyler	Chris	7	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
13	LeShawna	Victory	1-3	LOSE	LOSE	LOSE	IN	IN	OUT
14	Bridgette	Victory	5	LOSE	LOSE	OUT
15	Harold	Victory	1-3	LOSE	WD
16	Ezekiel	Victory	15-16	OUT
17	Duncan	None	WD

¹ Switched teams. // ² Individual challenge. // ³ Reward challenge. // ⁴ Aftermath episode.

Team Amazon. // Team Chris. // Team Victory. // No team.

Direct win. // Indirect win (someone else won it for the team). // Did not win, did not lose.

Last place but still in. // Last place, last called. // Voted out. // Withdrew.

I personally like this one better, but you may feel differently. If that's the case, please provide input here. Twentydragon (talk) 03:57, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

It's definitely lighter... but there is something about the tan that is really... kind of annoying (probably not the best way to put it, but...). Also, I think that episode 7 should be moved to episode 6 because that is what it is on the official map on CN, and the aftermaths are online episodes that are labeled separately (i.e., Aftermath 1). TDI19 (talk) 21:21, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

Hot Color-Cold Color Layout

I think that, on the elimination table, that the team that wins should be in cold colors such as: or in some cases (i guess) And that the losing team and eliminations should have warm colors such as: and for the team in second I think it should be neutral colors such as: So I'd think the elimination table should look like this:

Place	Singer	Current Team	Ep 1²	Ep 2	Ep 3	Ep 4	Ep 5³	Ep 7	Ep 8³
TBA	Alejandro	Chris	4-6	IN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	IN
TBA	Cody	Amazon	10-12	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN
TBA	Courtney	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN
TBA	DJ	Victory	1-3	LOW	LOW⁴	LOW	IN	LOW	WIN
TBA	Gwen	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN
TBA	Heather	Amazon	10-12	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	LOW⁵
TBA	Izzy¹	Chris	15-16	IN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	IN
TBA	Lindsay	Victory	4-6	IN	IN	IN	IN	IN	WIN
TBA	Noah	Chris	8-9	IN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	IN
TBA	Owen	Chris	8-9	IN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	IN
TBA	Sierra¹	Amazon	10-12	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN
TBA	Tyler	Chris	7	IN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	IN
13	LeShawna	Victory	1-3	IN	IN	IN	IN	OUT
14	Bridgette	Victory	4-6	IN	IN	OUT
15	Harold	Victory	1-3	IN	QUIT⁴
16	Ezekiel	Victory	15-16	OUT
17	Duncan	None	QUIT

or like this (I updated it):

Place	Singer	Episodes
Place	Singer	1^In	2	3	4	5^Re	7	8^Re	9	10^Re	11	13	14^Re	15	16	17^Re	19	20
TBA	Alejandro	6	IN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN	IN
TBA	Cody	11	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	IN	IN
TBA	Heather	12	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	LOW	WIN	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	LOW	IN
TBA	Sierra^*	10	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	LOW	WIN^L
5	Duncan	QUIT	Returns in Episode 13									IN	LOW	LOW	WIN	WIN	WIN	IN
6-7	Blaineley	Debuts in Episode 19															IN	OUT
6-7	Courtney	14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	WIN	LOW	LOW	WIN	OUT
8	Owen	9	IN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	OUT
9	Gwen	13	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	WIN	OUT
10	Tyler	7	IN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	OUT
11	Noah	8	IN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	OUT
12	DJ	2	LOW	LOW	LOW	IN	LOW	WIN	LOW	WIN	OUT
13	Izzy^*	15	IN	IN	WIN	IN	IN	IN	IN	WIN	LEFT
14	Lindsay	4	IN	IN	IN	IN	IN	WIN	OUT
15	LeShawna	3	IN	IN	IN	IN	OUT
16	Bridgette	5	IN	IN	OUT
17	Harold	1	IN	QUIT
18	Ezekiel	16^E	OUT

Temperature Layout

Place	Name	Current Team	Ep 1²	Ep 2	Ep 3	Ep 4	Ep 5³	Ep 7	Ep 8³	Ep 9
—	Alejandro	Chris	6	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Cody	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	LOSE	WIN
—	Courtney	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	LOSE	WIN
—	DJ	Victory	1-3	LOW	LOW	LOW	IN	LOW	WIN	LOW
—	Gwen	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	LOSE	WIN
—	Heather	Amazon	12	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	LOW	WIN
—	Izzy¹	Chris	15-16	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Noah	Chris	8	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Owen	Chris	9	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Sierra¹	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	WIN	LOSE	WIN
—	Tyler	Chris	7	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
12	Lindsay	Victory	4	LOSE	LOSE	LOSE	IN	LOSE	WIN	OUT
13	LeShawna	Victory	1-3	LOSE	LOSE	LOSE	IN	OUT
14	Bridgette	Victory	5	LOSE	LOSE	OUT
15	Harold	Victory	1-3	LOSE	WD
16	Ezekiel	Victory	15-16	OUT
17	Duncan	None	WD

¹ Switched teams. // ² Individual challenge. // ³ Reward challenge. // ⁴ Aftermath episode.

Team Amazon. // Team Chris. // Team Victory. // No team.

Direct win. // Indirect win (someone else won it for the team). // Did not win, did not lose.

Last place but still in. // Last place, last called. // Voted out. // Withdrew.

In this color scheme, the "hotter" a cell (the redder), the better for the contestant on that row. Feedback, please. Twentydragon (talk) 19:09, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

Not bad, however, I would suggest the hotter cells should be for losing contestants. I have a new color scheme comin in a few. TDI19 (talk) 00:36, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

New Layout

Place	Contestant	Episodes
		1^In	2	3	4	5^Re	7	8^Re	9	10^Re	11	13	14^Re	15	16	17^Re	19^M

—	Alejandro	6	IN (+)	IN (+)	WIN	IN (-)	IN (+)	IN (+)	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	IN (-)	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	IN
—	Blaineley	Debuts in Episode 19: "Niagara Brawls"⁹															IN
—	Cody	11	WIN	WIN	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	IN (-)	WIN	IN (-)	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	IN
—	Courtney	14	WIN	WIN	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	IN (-)	WIN	IN (-)	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	WIN	LOW⁸	LOW³	WIN
—	Duncan	QUIT	Returns in Episode 13: "I See London..."⁶									IN (-)	LOW⁷	LOW	WIN	WIN	WIN
—	Heather	12	WIN	WIN	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	LOW³	WIN	IN (-)	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	LOW
—	Sierra¹	10	WIN	WIN	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	IN (-)	WIN	IN (-)	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	LOW
8	Owen	9	IN (+)	IN (+)	WIN	IN (-)	IN (+)	IN (+)	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	IN (-)	IN	IN	WIN	WIN	OUT
9	Gwen	13	WIN	WIN	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	IN (-)	WIN	IN (-)	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	WIN	OUT⁸
10	Tyler	7	IN (+)	IN (+)	WIN	IN (-)	IN (+)	IN (+)	IN (+)	WIN⁵	WIN	IN (-)	IN	OUT
11	Noah	8	IN (+)	IN (+)	WIN	IN (-)	IN (+)	IN (+)	IN (+)	WIN	WIN	OUT
12	DJ	2	LOW	LOW²	LOW	IN (+)	LOW	WIN	LOW⁴	WIN⁵	OUT
13	Izzy¹	15	IN (+)	IN (+)	WIN	IN (-)	IN (+)	IN (+)	IN (+)	WIN	LEFT
14	Lindsay	4	IN (-)	IN (-)	IN (-)	IN (+)	IN (-)	WIN	OUT⁴
15	LeShawna	3	IN (-)	IN (-)	IN (-)	IN (+)	OUT
16	Bridgette	5	IN (-)	IN (-)	OUT	Current Hostess of the TDWT Aftermath
17	Harold	1	IN (-)	QUIT²
18	Ezekiel	16^E	OUT

Notes

¹ Izzy switched teams with Sierra (in episode 2) putting Izzy on Team Chris is Really, Really, Really, Hot (Team Chris) and Sierra on Team Amazon.

² This challenge was an individual challenge; shown are the rankings of the contestants, upon which the team assignments were based.

(R) This episode featured a reward challenge, so no contestants were eliminated.

Key

Teams

This contestant was on Team Amazon.

This contestant was on Team Chris.

This contestant was on Team Victory.

This contestant was eliminated before the teams were formed.

Challenge wins/losses

(WIN) This contestant won the challenge for their team (Episodes 2-?, before the teams dissolved).

(WIN) This contestant's team won the challenge (Episodes 2-?, before the teams dissolved).

(IN (+)) This contestant's team placed second in the challenge (Episodes 2-?, before the teams dissolved).

Barf Bag Ceremony recipients

(IN) This contestant advanced to the next challenge (after the merge).

(IN (-)) This contestant's team lost the challenge (Episodes 2-?) and they advanced to the next challenge at the Barfbag Ceremony.

(LOW) This contestant is still competing but was in the bottom two (last contestant awarded a Barf Bag, likely received votes against them).

(OUT) This contestant was voted off of Total Drama World Tour.

(OUT) This contestant was eliminated from Total Drama World Tour.

(WD) This contestant withdrew from the competition.

Honor Places

(RUNNER-UP) This cast-mate was the season's runner-up.

(WINNER) This cast-mate won first place and the C$1 million.

I reworked many things, including the key. TDI19 (talk) 01:24, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

I like the direction you're taking it, but maybe these suggestions will help make it easier to read:

Changing " IN (+)" to " IN".
Changing " IN (-)" to " LOSE".
Merging " OUT" and " OUT" into " OUT".
Losing " WINNER" and " RUNNER-UP" altogether.
Using a different color for "LOW", possibly , , or .
Using white text on dark colors like .
Using , , and for the teams and re-adding the Current Team column.

We've been using too many colors lately, and I think limiting how many we use will only help make the table clearer. Twentydragon (talk) 03:07, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

I don't think that WINNER and RUNNER-UP are of any issue... I am not a fan of "LOSE". I wish there was this like definitive answer to this table! AGH! Oh, and I am really disappointed that no one else is taking part in this discussion anymore! It is very important, as it is the main problem in all THREE articles! So, please, if anyone besides Twentydragon and myself are reading this, contribute to this topic! Thanks! TDI19 (talk) 23:31, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

I understand that using "LOSE" seems pretty harsh, but it is objective and easier to read than two different kinds of "IN", especially with parentheses.

No, the overall first and second aren't much of an issue and won't even come into play until the show's over, but they are pretty useless; if the table's clear in all other respects, it will be obvious who won without the need of a special color code.

Yes, all three articles share the same problems; this needs to get hammered out. Twentydragon (talk) 11:28, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Green-Red Color Scheme

Based on TDI19's color scheme, above, with a few changes applied. Twentydragon (talk) 11:28, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Place	Contestant	Current Team	Episodes
Place	Contestant	Current Team	1^In	2	3	4	5^Re	7	8^Re	9	10^Re	11	13	14	15
—	Alejandro	Chris	6	RU	RU	WIN	IN	RU	RU	RU	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	IN
—	Cody	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	RU	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	RU	WIN	WIN	WIN
—	Courtney	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	RU	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	RU	WIN	WIN	WIN
—	Duncan^Sw	Chris	WD	Returns in episode 13.									IN	LOW	LOW
—	Gwen	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	RU	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	RU	WIN	WIN	WIN
—	Heather	Amazon	12	WIN	WIN	RU	WIN	WIN	LOW	WIN	IN	RU	WIN	WIN	WIN
—	Owen	Chris	9	RU	RU	WIN	IN	RU	RU	RU	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	IN
—	Sierra^Sw	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	RU	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	RU	WIN	WIN	WIN
—	Tyler	Chris	7	RU	RU	WIN	IN	RU	RU	RU	WIN	WIN	IN	IN	OUT
9	Noah	Chris	8	RU	RU	WIN	IN	RU	RU	RU	WIN	WIN	OUT
10	DJ	Victory	1-3	LOW	LOW	LOW	IN	LOW	WIN	LOW	WIN	OUT
11	Izzy^Sw	Chris	15-16	RU	RU	WIN	IN	RU	RU	RU	WIN	WD
12	Lindsay	Victory	4	IN	IN	IN	RU	IN	WIN	OUT
13	LeShawna	Victory	1-3	IN	IN	IN	RU	OUT
14	Bridgette	Victory	5	IN	IN	OUT
15	Harold	Victory	1-3	RU	WD
16	Ezekiel	Victory	15-16	OUT

^Sw Team Switch // ^In Individual Challenge // ^Re Reward Challenge

Amazon // Chris // Victory // None

(WIN) Direct win // (WIN) Indirect win // (RU) Neither first nor last

(IN) Last place, advancing // (LOW) Last safe // (OUT) Involuntary elimination (by vote or otherwise) // (WD) Voluntary elimination or withdrawal

Okay, after working on this for well over an hour and testing many alternatives, I have come to the following changes:

Used lighter colors for teams and wins.

This makes it easier to read the black text by reducing the vibrancy of the colors.

Reinstated the "Current Team" column for those who can't read the colors.

According to WP:COLOR, we can't use color as the sole method for conveying any information, hence this column.

Used "RU" to indicate a runner-up in challenges (not to be used during the two-team part of the game).

People have reacted negatively to "LOSE", perhaps because it was rather harsh, so "RU" (for "runner-up") is a slightly less condescending listing. "RU" is only for players and teams that neither win nor lose a challenge; if there are two teams, don't use it.

"IN" is now reserved for the last-place team members who are safe, and it will likely be used frequently, which is why a light color (misty rose) was chosen.

Limited the non-win shading to only the losing team or player.

This had to be done. Otherwise all but the first- and last-place players and teams would be filled in, and that just hinders clarity if all or most of the cells in a table are colored in.

Limited the number of colors and codes used by providing broader, more understandable distinctions.

Too many colors inhibits understanding, especially if people can't read all of those colors. There are now only two colors for eliminations: crimson and orange.

Changed numerical note codes to letters for easier reference and greater clarity.

Once you know what the letters mean, it's easy to remember. Otherwise, it's just like any other footnote.

Left numerical gaps for the Aftermath episodes.

Cartoon Network is the only channel that's not airing the Aftermaths on TV, but they're not the only channel worldwide showing Total Drama. Wikipedia, as a global website, should reflect this by denoting episodes 6, 12, and others as Aftermaths.

Aftermath episodes have no bearing on the competition itself, so there is no reason to add individual columns to the table unless the table is for the show as a whole and not just the competition.

Please, let me know what you guys think helps and doesn't. Remember, while making the table look nice is all well and good, but what we really should be after is clarity and conciseness. Twentydragon (talk) 11:28, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

I think we might finally have a solution! Three things: 1. I am concerned about the shading of the team who loses- once you are down to two teams, every cell is colored! 2. Izzy was taken out by injury. 3. To reduce the amount of colors, why don't why do something like WIN** for someone who wins for their team? Awesome job! TDI19 (talk) 03:00, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

Thanks! ( 1. Yeah, every cell will be shaded for a few episodes, but it shouldn't last long, nor should it be intrusive since such a light color was chosen. It also won't be used for seasons where there are only two teams. // 2. Izzy left voluntarily with the military, hence "WD"; it's an odd case, but she did leave of her own volition. Either way, it's not worth adding another color. Perhaps she could just be listed as "OUT". // 3. I don't think we need to reduce it further at this point. One slightly darker "WIN" color is probably sufficient. I tried to find another named web-safe color, but no go; this was the best that existed. ) Twentydragon (talk) 05:01, 16 August 2010 (UTC)

Alright... and let's see.... I think the only thing left to be done is answer the question will you use the Key I wrote with the new colors? And then... I guess it can be put up! (seeing as no one else has bothered to take part in this discussion...ahem...) TDI19 (talk) 00:07, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

If you're referring to the addition you made where the code is listed next to the color swatch, the answer's yes; that will be used. If anyone else has anything left to add, this is the chance to do it. I'll be posting the new color scheme on the page tomorrow if nothing is said. Twentydragon (talk) 01:06, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Last thing is I was thinking maybe this should be made into a separate template that is then linked into the article... to avoid vandalism? TDI19 (talk) 01:25, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

You can do that? I'd have no idea how to implement such a thing myself (though I can certainly copy and paste this sucker into the page), but if you know how to do that, it sounds like a great idea! Twentydragon (talk) 02:53, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

I have no idea how to either...but I figure why not try, learn, and get a new skill? Eh? XD TDI19 (talk) 03:43, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Template

Here we go: Template:TDWT Elimination Table

ITS AWESOME. just go here: Template:TDWT Elimination Table to edit and please, can you add the key? Thanks! TDI19 (talk) 03:51, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

All righty. I added the key. Hopefully this move will result in a reduction in vandalism. Thanks. Twentydragon (talk) 07:19, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

An idea (not exaclty mine)

As you see here, the colors for the camper name is not by team but by gender. Instead of a redundant coloring by team then a team column, the "name" place could be colored by gender. However, I'm not sure which colors to use. Possibly like in the character tables: light blue for males, pink for females. Great Pikmin Fan (TD) (Talk) 16:58, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

It's a possibility for sure! TDI19 (talk) 02:19, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

Flags

Place	Contestant	Current Team	Episodes & Locations
			1^In	2	3	4	5^Re	6^Re	7	8^Re	9	10^Re	11	12^Re	13	14

1	Heather	Amazon	12	WIN	WIN	RU	WIN	RU	WIN	LOW	WIN	IN	RU	RU	WIN	WIN
2	Alejandro	Chris	6	RU	RU	WIN	IN	RU	RU	RU	RU	WIN	WIN	RU	IN	IN
3	Cody	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	RU	WIN	RU	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	RU	RU	WIN	WIN
4	Sierra^Sw	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	RU	WIN	RU	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	RU	RU	WIN	WIN
5	Duncan^Sw	Chris	WD	Returns in Episode 13.											IN	LOW
6-7	Courtney	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	RU	WIN	RU	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	RU	RU	WIN	WIN
8	Owen	Chris	9	RU	RU	WIN	IN	RU	RU	RU	RU	WIN	WIN	RU	IN	IN
9	Gwen	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	RU	WIN	RU	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	RU	RU	WIN	WIN
10	Tyler	Chris	7	RU	RU	WIN	IN	RU	RU	RU	RU	WIN	WIN	RU	IN	IN
11	Noah	Chris	8	RU	RU	WIN	IN	RU	RU	RU	RU	WIN	WIN	RU	OUT
12	DJ	Victory	1-3	LOW	LOW	LOW	RU	RU	LOW	WIN	LOW	WIN	OUT
13	Izzy^Sw	Chris	15-16	RU	RU	WIN	IN	RU	RU	RU	RU	WIN	WD
14	Lindsay	Victory	4	IN	IN	IN	RU	RU	IN	WIN	OUT
15	LeShawna	Victory	1-3	IN	IN	IN	RU	RU	OUT
16	Bridgette	Victory	5	IN	IN	OUT	Current Hostess of the TDWT Aftermath.
17	Harold	Victory	1-3	IN	WD
18	Ezekiel	Victory	15-16	OUT

Template deleted?

Just saw the nomination for deletion. WHY? I thought the template was the best idea on here since my joining Wikipedia a year and a half ago as an IP. (RealityShowsRock (talk) 21:45, 30 August 2010 (UTC))

I know....I am disappointed about it- but, to save it, post a defense on the deletion discussion! TDI19 (talk) 01:34, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

YEAH! WHOO! (RealityShowsRock (talk) 20:21, 2 September 2010 (UTC))

Mexico

"Planes, Trains, Hot Air Mobiles" the contestants were in three places, Drumheller, Tijuana in Mexico and Hawaii. Drumheller was the start of that race and had no more importance after they left and Hawaii had no non-Aftermath importance until the last episode. And since both places are prominently represented before ("Awww...Drumheller") and after ("Hawaiian Punch") this episode, shouldn't an area, that was mentioned in the episode that the finalists needed to go to (Tijuana, Mexico) be represented for that episode?

I'm not trying to cause problems for you TDI19, I just want to make sure that the facts about the show are correct. (BackLash (talk) 13:36, 1 September 2010 (UTC))

I am not sure yet... there really was no definitive destination this time around... TDI19 (talk) 02:46, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Drumheller and Hawaii are already mentioned in the flags (for the previous and next episodes), so the only one that would make sense to include would be Mexico's flag with a link to Tijuana. Twentydragon 07:15, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

I agree with Twentydragon, but I just want to make sure that it's okay with the both of you due to how much work you guys put in. (BackLash (talk) 14:04, 2 September 2010 (UTC))

Totally fine with me! TDI19 (talk) 22:21, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

ME 3. (RealityShowsRock (talk) 16:19, 5 September 2010 (UTC)) 16:19, 5 September 2010 (UTC))

|}

Elimination Table Colors

The elimination table is changing too much which causes some problems. I don't really think the different color "IN" is necessary. If it were to stay, I think it contrasts too much with the other colors and I believe it should be relatively the same color as the regular "IN". The "IN" currently is a darkish teal. I think it should either be a light beige/yellow or the second color should not exist at all.

Secondly, I do not think the "HIGH"s should be included in the table. It really has no significance whatsoever regarding the elimination. The "LOW"s, on the other hand, have somewhat of a purpose since it shows who almost went home. I took the one HIGH that was in the table (for Leshawna) until further consensus.

Lastly, the table does not look eye appealing, which is another reason to get rid of the other IN color. The table looks like a semi-rainbow and colors, such as blue and yellow/red, do not look appealing. Users with IP addresses just keep changing the elimination table's colors without an explanation. --DragonofFire (龙火) 04:29, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Then why don't we agree on a standard set to use on all Total Drama tables? Preferably something that's readable. Black on dark red does not qualify. I suggest white on dark red for eliminations, black on orange for withdrawals, black on yellow for low-placings, white on medium green for winners, and a black on a light green for those who advanced because of a teammate. That should be all we need. Twentydragon (talk) 10:13, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

So far the table looks like this:

Place	Name	Ep 1	Ep 2
TBA	Alejandro	IN	IN
TBA	Bridgette	WIN	IN
TBA	Cody	IN	WIN
TBA	Courtney	IN	WIN
TBA	DJ	WIN	LOW
TBA	Gwen	IN	WIN
TBA	Harold	WIN	IN
TBA	Heather	IN	WIN
TBA	Izzy*	IN	IN
TBA	LeShawna	WIN	IN
TBA	Lindsay	WIN	IN
TBA	Noah	IN	IN
TBA	Owen	IN	IN
TBA	Sierra*	IN	WIN
TBA	Tyler	IN	IN
16	Ezekiel	IN	OUT
17	Duncan	QUIT

Using your suggestions, the table will look something like this:

Place	Name	Ep 1	Ep 2
TBA	Alejandro	IN	IN
TBA	Bridgette	WIN	IN
TBA	Cody	IN	WIN
TBA	Courtney	IN	WIN
TBA	DJ	WIN	LOW
TBA	Gwen	IN	WIN
TBA	Harold	WIN	IN
TBA	Heather	IN	WIN
TBA	Izzy*	IN	IN
TBA	LeShawna	WIN	IN
TBA	Lindsay	WIN	IN
TBA	Noah	IN	IN
TBA	Owen	IN	IN
TBA	Sierra*	IN	WIN
TBA	Tyler	IN	IN
16	Ezekiel	IN	OUT
17	Duncan	QUIT

I'm not so sure on the white on medium green since I think the medium green is light enough. I still do not believe that the second "IN" color needs to contrast that much. It should just be a beige or a light blue color so it will not stand out as much as the teal. --DragonofFire (龙火) 14:42, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

By "medium green", I meant 0-128-0, the same color used already. I don't think we even need a color for "IN". It's already descriptive enough, methinks. But nice job putting this here; 'twas a nice surprise. Twentydragon (talk) 12:06, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

I seriously dont know which one I like better. They're both good, but in a different way. anyone here know what im saying??? (98.231.218.47 (talk) 22:55, 5 July 2010 (UTC)) or RSRC

The point I'm trying to make is that if we have a specific standard set of colors that can easily be read on virtually all monitors, then we can avoid disagreements, unnecessary codes and colors, and confusing notations in the future. Twentydragon (talk) 03:36, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

This is what I'm suggesting:

Place	Name	Ep 1	Ep 2
TBA	Alejandro	6th	LOST
TBA	Bridgette	5th	IN
TBA	Cody	10th	WIN
TBA	Courtney	13th	WIN
TBA	DJ	2nd	LOW
TBA	Gwen	13th	WIN
TBA	Harold	1st	LOST
TBA	Heather	12th	WIN
TBA	Izzy*	15th	IN
TBA	LeShawna	3rd	LOST
TBA	Lindsay	4th	LOST
TBA	Noah	8th	IN
TBA	Owen	9th	IN
TBA	Sierra*	10th	WIN
TBA	Tyler	7th	IN
16	Ezekiel	15th	OUT
17	Duncan	QUIT

Twentydragon (talk) 03:52, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

I like the WIN, IN, and LOST, but i dont think the number placing is neccesary. If you are to add another color, it should be for the losing team, and not the second place team. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Thomasvisel (talk • contribs) 01:01, 8 July 2010 (UTC)

The numerical placing is only there because there were no defined "winners" and "losers" in the first challenge (Pyramind Over/Under), and no one was actually eliminated. The numerical placings were instead used to form the basis for the team divisions. I also don't think it's necessary to add another color unless it's something light and easy to read text against, like . Twentydragon (talk) 02:12, 8 July 2010 (UTC)

Okay, on the subject of a new standard for all Total Drama contestant tables, here is my new proposal:

Place	Name	Team	Ep 1	Ep 2	Ep 3
TBA	Alejandro	Chris	6th	IN	IN
TBA	Bridgette	Victory	5th	LOSE	LOSE
TBA	Cody	Amazon	10th	WIN	WIN
TBA	Courtney	Amazon	13th	WIN	WIN
TBA	DJ	Victory	2nd	LOW	LOW
TBA	Gwen	Amazon	13th	WIN	WIN
TBA	Heather	Amazon	12th	WIN	WIN
TBA	Izzy*	Chris	15th	IN	IN
TBA	LeShawna	Victory	3rd	LOSE	LOSE
TBA	Lindsay	Victory	4th	LOSE	LOSE
TBA	Noah	Chris	8th	IN	IN
TBA	Owen	Chris	9th	IN	IN
TBA	Sierra*	Amazon	10th	WIN	WIN
TBA	Tyler	Chris	7th	IN	IN
15	Harold	Victory	1st	LOSE	WD
16	Ezekiel	Victory	15th	OUT
17	Duncan	None	WD

Pink Team Amazon | Yellow Team Victory | Sky blue Team Chris

Dark green Direct win | Light green Indirect win | Tan Defeat

Dark red Elimination | Orange Withdrawal | Gainsboro Low placing

Here are the issues I fixed:

The individual challenge (Episode 1) no longer uses ambiguous "win" and "loss" terminology; rather, it uses a clear ranking system.
Readers are no longer relying solely on the background color of a contestant's name to determine team, as per Wikipedia's Color Accessibility Standards.
Teal-backed "IN" spaces denoting the second-place team have been removed, in favor of a lighter, tan-backed space denoting the losing team.
Since yellow is used for Team Victory, gainsboro is used for the low placing.
"QUIT" has been replaced with the more clear, concise, and professional "WD", for "withdrawn".

Any input you guys have for this should help standardize the tables used and make them easier to understand. Thanks. Twentydragon (talk) 18:38, 11 July 2010 (UTC)

I think the team column isn't necessary since it is already shown in the table's key. I still like the yellow color for the "LOW"s, so the team color for team victory can go back to the golden color. I am unsure of the "LOSE"s since it shows the losing team, however, it is not in any of the previous elimination tables. Also, when the teams dissolve, only one or two people will win each challenge, meaning everyone else will "LOSE" and I just think it would be easier just to put IN. Lastly, the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc. placings do not follow the other tables, as well. For example, for TDA episodes 1 and 2, there was a similar format with the placings and I don't think that should change. Other than that, the table is fine and I appreciate the time you took to create the table (if any). --DragonofFire (龙火) 22:08, 11 July 2010 (UTC)

The Team column was added because, according to Wikipedia's Color Accessibility Standards, color should not be the sole means of communicating information. In this case, it was. Can you think of a better word to use than "LOSE" for the last-place team (after teams dissolve, "LOSE" becomes moot unless there's a tie for last place)? I see you suggested using "IN", and while that can work, I don't think we should rely on that. It goes back to using color again. I also understand the concern for the numerical placings, but I believe they're important here, since that's how teams were determined; otherwise there would only be one "WIN" (under the strictest definition) for Harold, while the rest read "IN". In addition, this is a proposal for a new standard that would replace the color schemes of the previous seasons' tables, so whether it follows them is irrelevant. Thanks for inputting, by the way. Twentydragon (talk) 04:38, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

I think most of this table is okay, since it is made so it's better for people that are colorblind. --Ha dg er 04:09, 12 July 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, but I get the sense you want to suggest changes. Please do. Twentydragon (talk) 04:38, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Well, I don't think the "LOSE" part is really necessary. We really only need to put the winning team. However, I also think it is good on the table, since some teams don't win or lose the challenge. --Ha dg er 08:59, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

So if I understand you correctly, you're saying that it's unnecessary but helpful. Is that right? Twentydragon (talk) 00:32, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Yup. That's what I mean. However, now I think that it should be kept on the table. --Ha dg er 08:07, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Okay then. If we're in agreement, I'd like to go ahead an implement this on the page. Twentydragon (talk) 23:48, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Done. The changes we discussed have been made. Twentydragon (talk) 09:57, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

Well, I really like the way it was before. (98.231.218.47 (talk) 02:45, 20 July 2010 (UTC))

Thanks for your input, although the previous version was extremely unfriendly to those with limited vision or color-blindness. Do you have any suggestions to improve the new one? Twentydragon (talk) 03:55, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

If you guys liked it better how it was or feel that the color scheme still needs improvement, please say so here before going off and changing it. Otherwise, I will assume you don't know what you're doing (which may in fact not be the case). So please, please, use the Talk page first. Twentydragon (talk) 15:46, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

I really don't like how this one is almost completly different from the TDI and TDA ones. I mean:

Instead of "IN" for the losing team, it's for the runner-up team. The losing team now gets "LOSE". I do think that instead of "LOSE", the runner-up team should be in the color "LOSE" is in now (tan), tagged "IN", and the losing team should get "IN" colored white.
"LOW" is a different color (gainsboro).
We now have an alternate column describling what team each camper is on, even placing Izzy and Sierra swapped in this section to show that they switched teams. The latter is completly unnecessary, they switched teams nearly in the begining like Izzy and Saide, we can just put it in a footnote. If it's to sort them out via teams, it's bad because Izzy would be grouped with Team Amazon (and Sierra on Chris) even though she was only in for two episodes. Although as of this writing this isn't a problem as the teams are switched back.
The first episode listed who crossed at what place. This is unnecessary and trivial.
The dark "WIN"s and "OUT"s have white text.

I think if this is how an elimination table should be, then at least switch the Total Drama Island and Total Drama Action ones to this style. Great Pikmin Fan (TD) (Talk) 00:00, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

Thank you for your input, but I feel you're protesting the very purpose of the reformat. Yes, it's different. However, this style is intended to be a replacement for those first two, adding more clarity, visibility, and simplicity to the tables.

That might be a valid point, although I don't see a better way to do this. "LOSE" (and the color) is for all players tied for last place, which includes teammates. If it changes in the way you're proposing, then once the teams are dissolved, then the tan background will either apply only to the second-place player or to everyone not tied for last.
Yes. "LOW" has been changed to gainsboro. Yellow was needed for Team Victory, as almost the entire table needed to be lightened. Rather than use the same color for both a team and the low-ranked player, I thought it prudent to use something else.
While Izzy and Sierra did switch early on, they were still assigned to the teams originally shown. No, it's not necessary, but it's there for clarity. You may note that the column reads "Current Team", showing which team they are currently on. This, like the background colors of any other cell, is only used to help communicate information. It's not a replacement for the footnote; it's a supplement.
The contestants' rankings are only shown because that was how teams were determined. It allows you to (mostly) sort the table by original team makeup.
Yes. The text on the dark red and green colors has been changed to white. This was for readability only, as you can see that the background colors have not been changed. I, and many others, had a lot of difficulty distinguishing between the two; I can only imagine someone who's colorblind trying to read it.

The intent is to, once this format has been adequately perfected, replace the other two with this new style. Again, your input is greatly appreciated. Twentydragon (talk) 02:00, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the input twenty. (98.231.218.47 (talk) 23:34, 24 July 2010 (UTC))

I need help maintaining it. Every time I look at it, someone else has come in and taken a wrecking ball to the thing. I cannot keep up with this. In addition, for everyone, before you go ahead and make big new changes to the table, please discuss them here! Twentydragon (talk) 07:26, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Hi! I have had a ton of experience in maintaining the Total Drama articles... and it is reallllly annoying- in the past and as I can see, currently too! I will be in contact with an administrator soon to block the page from IP addresses. Any IP who wants to contribute in a productive way can come to the talk page and suggest ideas, which we can later put up. And on the team issue with the second place team... why not give them the "HIGH" ranking? TDI19 (talk) 23:36, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. "HIGH", as it was used before, was the direct opposite of "LOW", meaning that while the contestant in question was still on the losing team, their name was the first one called. Using "HIGH" in a different meaning alongside "LOW" may just lead to confusion.

At any rate, I've also gone ahead and reverted the table back to our last-discussed version of the colors and undone all vandalism and fallacious edits in one fell swoop. I'm posting this table here as well so that we can further discuss what might need changing. Twentydragon (talk) 00:11, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

Here is the current version of the table. If you have changes you want to make, please discuss them here before you go off and edit it up. Also, don't forget to read this whole section; it's come a long way: Twentydragon (talk) 00:11, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

Place	Name	Current Team	Ep 1²	Ep 2	Ep 3	Ep 4	Ep 5³	Ep 6⁴	Ep 7	Ep 8
—	Alejandro	Chris	6	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Cody	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	Courtney	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	DJ	Victory	2	LOW	LOW	LOW	IN	IN	LOW	WIN
—	Gwen	Amazon	13-14	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	Heather	Amazon	12	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOW
—	Izzy¹	Chris	15-16	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Lindsay	Victory	4	LOSE	LOSE	LOSE	IN	IN	LOSE	WIN
—	Noah	Chris	8	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Owen	Chris	9	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
—	Sierra¹	Amazon	10-11	WIN	WIN	IN	WIN	IN	WIN	LOSE
—	Tyler	Chris	7	IN	IN	WIN	LOSE	IN	IN	IN
13	LeShawna	Victory	3	LOSE	LOSE	LOSE	IN	IN	OUT
14	Bridgette	Victory	5	LOSE	LOSE	OUT
15	Harold	Victory	1	LOSE	WD
16	Ezekiel	Victory	15-16	OUT
17	Duncan	None	WD

The following have been summarized and condensed to save page space:

¹ Switched teams. // ² Individual challenge. // ³ Reward challenge. // ⁴ Aftermath episode.

Team Amazon. // Team Chris. // Team Victory. // No team.

Direct win. // Indirect win (someone else won it for the team). // Did not win, did not lose.

Last place but still in. // Last place, last called. // Voted out. // Withdrew.

Twentydragon (talk) 00:11, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

THREE THINGS! I think that the "current team" column should be deleted at the end of the season. I think that Team Victory's color should be made a darker, golden color, so we can then bring yellow back for the bottom 2 member. Lastly, to solve the three team crisis we can... (a) mark the losing team as "LOW" but with a different color or (b) mark them as IN (-) and the second place team as IN (+) as has been done with Top Chef! Thanks! TDI19 (talk) 02:31, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

The heading may need to be changed from current team, but the team column needs to remain. We cannot rely solely on colour to indicate team assignments. —C.Fred (talk) 02:57, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

There is one problem with using gold ( ) for Team Victory: that color has been set aside for the winner of the season. Granted it could still be used, but even in the show, Team Victory's assigned color has been yellow, not gold. As far as the wording used, I advise against using "LOW" for more than simply indicating an almost-elimination. We want to avoid relying on colors alone to indicate certain information, like the difference between a loss and a near-elimination. Twentydragon (talk) 04:34, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

Check out the elimination table colors in Design Star and Shear Genius. They are very clean and easy to read- I think something similar to them should be done with TDWT, TDA, and TDI, because, let's face it, they all need a re-do. TDI19 (talk) 00:58, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

Not bad, though I'd advise against using similar colors with similar words like they do. Hmm, lemme try something... Twentydragon (talk) 06:33, 1 August 2010 (UTC)