Talk:Chinchilla

Categorization

It seems the first half of the Chinchilla page is a standard encyclopedic entry, while the second half of the page is more domestication/pet notes. At the time of my reading this page, it seemed necessary to me to enter some caegorizing headlines in order to separate these two disctinct sections (ie: Chinchillas as household pets), no?

An anonymous user just changed the lifespan of chinchillas from 15 to 25 years. Now, a long lifespan is always good, but isn't 25 years a bit too optimistic? Can anyone point to a source that will validate either the 15 or 25 number? Nyh 06:52, 8 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Jumping height?

It is listed as one foot, but anyone who has had a chin knows this is quite short compared to the actual jumping ability of chinchillas. I've personally seen chins jump slightly in excess of three feet.

Chinchillas also jump off walls in a "Matrix-like" manner. If scared or worried, they will run and bounce off of a nearby wall. Chinchillas will occasionally 'twitch' by pouncing upward. It appears they get 'chills' like humans do.

>>>Some chinchillas can actually jump to a height of 5 feet from a standing position.

Spraying?

Do/can some Chins really spray urine up to six feet?

Females can spray according to a book i have.. although it doesn't indicate distance. -max rspct 13:50, 2 August 2005 (UTC)

Six feet is probably too far; I'd say about 2 feet (at most) at about a 30 degree arc from horizontal, which is where the genitals end up when they stand on their hind feet.OrderSponge 08:06, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

I have a cat scratcher with ledges at 1 feet intervals. All three of my Chinchillas have successfully leaping from ground level to the ledge at 4 foot. They leap it with considerable ease.

Fur density

"In fact, they have the highest fur density of any animal on earth with more than 20,000 hairs per square cm." This contradicts the entry for Otter, as well as the Monterey Bay Aquarium, which give the hair density of the sea otter as one million per square inch, or 155,000 per square centimeter.

This is correct: at least the otter, and possibly other mustelids, have denser fur.OrderSponge 08:03, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Lifespan of Chinchillas

A Chinchilla's Life Span usally consists of a mininum of 15 years, some have been said to have lived for up to 30 years.

Look under the section "Health." The individuals responsible for the site, Betti Cogswell, RN, Lani Ritchey, and Roxane Beeman, have privately published a booklet called "The Joy of Chinchillas" that is in its 6th edition now. I merely mention it because it was cited in the veterinary book by Elizabeth V. Hillyer, DVM, and Katherine E. Quesenberry, DVM, in their first edition (1977) of "Ferrets, Rabbits, and Rodents: Clinical Medicine and Surgery" (by W. B. Saunders Company). (The Hillyer & Quesenberry book has since been updated, but I cannot keep up with every edition that is published when I am not a veterinarian.) Betti, Lani, and Roxane have worked with chinchillas for a long, long time, from show chinchillas to rescues. They have been researching the health needs of just chinchillas.

As a result of their research and the increasing knowledge in general about chinchillas, the life span has been revised. It is necessary for an individual contemplating a chinchilla as a companion to know that the commitment may be for a long time.

Spraying Urine

Chinchillas do spray urine as a defense mechanism, but they do not have very big bladders.Some have never seen a chinchilla capable of spraying farther than about one and one-half feet, and by then it is just a few droplets. Between zero and one foot, they can be exceedingly accurate if they are smart. If they are not so smart, they might hide behind something and the spray backfires.

I have had eight pet chinchillas, four males and four females. So far, only six of them, that I know of, have attempted to spray. Three of the four females (knock on wood) sprayed with great accuracy. Three of the four males sprayed and either nothing came out, or only a dribble came out, or they sprayed themselves by accident. The fourth male was given to a friend after he was weaned, so I do not know whether he ever sprayed. Spraying occurred very infrequently when the chinchillas grew past two or three years. One male would squat and urinate on the rug in my line of site whenever he was angry with me.

I do not know why spraying urine is a defense mechanism. It never prevented anything from happening for which I was sprayed (the urine is not very strong in smell). In dominance "fights" it never fazed either combatant, and my using a spray water bottle never made any difference in my chinchillas' behavior. Whenever I tell my friends about my chinchillas spraying urine as a defense, they roll on the floor laughing.

I've only seen one of my four chinchillas spray urine, and it actually had a significant effect. A male was chasing a female around outside the cage, where they would frequently spat (inside the cage, they were fine...go figure). She must've gotten tired of it, because she stopped running away, turned around, and blasted him right in the face. He sort of stopped, like he was just blown away by it, and then they never had trouble again. They even had babies. OrderSponge 20:59, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

Urine is not a very strong smell to you, but not to chinchillas who have a more acute sense of smell. Strong smells and odors are very prominent to them. It's how they "see." They can identify each other by smell. My chinchillas actually have separate corners where they go to the bathroom. They would take a sniff at one corner and turn around as if to say, "Oops. Nope. Not mine." Urine is also used as a territory marker. That's why chinchillas who are not cage mates have to meet in a neutral area, so there is no "dominant scent." They can actually be very territorial and violent if they smell an "invader" inside their cage. I guess the urine-as-a-defense thing might have something to do with territory, and being marked by another chinchilla's smell. Oh, and I have one NASTY female chinchilla who can shoot urine for about five feet. We found spray marks on the wall. We call her "Sniper." :-P Rumpelstiltzkin 06:49, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

I know they also spit as a defense. Dora Nichov 03:36, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

physical characteristics?

Shouldn't there be information such as how big they can get, how much they can weigh, etc.?

Chins can grow up to 1kg in weight

I was under the impression these things were the size of mice, maybe rats, then I GISed them and saw some photos that made them look much larger.

Not to mention I can't imagine something jumping five feet vertically if it isn't fairly large. Sdr 10:19, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)

I've seen several Chinchillas clear four feet high (accurately measured) from a standing start. It wouldn't surprise me if in extreme situations they could jump five feet.

In my experience chinchillas tend to be about 500 g. I've never taken the time to measure one. Raw numbers are pretty meaningless, anyway. Perhaps someone could take a picture of a chinchilla next to a soda can? StradivariusTV 05:00, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)

A healthy chinchilla should weigh between 550 grams and 750 grams. The female generally weighing 50-100 gramms more than her male counterpart. This is also reflected in the slight disparity in size difference between genders with the female noticeably (at least to regular Chinchilla handlers) larger.

My 6 month old can jump about 4 feet, but my over-1-year can jump only about 2.5 feet. The younger one is approximately 8 ounces, the larger is 2 pounds. I don't know how to put in a photo here, otherwise I'd put the one of my larger chin, Pepper, but I'd say he's the size of a box of kleenex (the kind that are long rather than high). When I got my younger chin, he was the size of a young medium fancy rat, which is small considering his age, though he was the runt. He's now bigger than a medium sized rat, maybe the size of a coffee cup if you lie it on it's side.Narnibird 20:58, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Diet

In the wild chinchillas have been observed eating plants, fruits, seeds, and small insects; however, attempting to simulate or feed this formula in captivity can lead to serious illness or even death. Why?

Because domestic chinchillas are not used to this type of food. In general, domestic chinchillas are fed some type of pellet with a main ingredient of hay. Giving your chinchilla something its stomach has likely never had before can wreak havoc on their, already extremely sensitive, digestive system. --pIrish 22:06, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

This is slightly extreme. Chinchillas diet is more varied than just the standard Chinchilla pellet mentioned here. Their penchant for raisins is well known as well as dried fruit like apple and banana. In my experience they are also well capable of digesting fresh and dried herbs like basil and mint without suffering any digestive problems.

The primary domestic chinchilla diet is hay-based. Their pellets are made mostly of hay and they should be given a constant supply of hay. This is because their diets have adapted since the days when they roamed free and ate bugs. The chinchilla's digestive system is very, very sensitive. If you give them one too many raisins, they get diarrhea. If you give them a lettuce leaf, they could get bloat. If you give them a peanut (besides the problems with fungus, which is why seeds are also typically a no-no), it could give them hepatic lipidosis.

While they can handle minimal amounts of treats, they shouldn't be given more than, say, a raisin once every few days, just to be on the safe side. They also shouldn't be given fresh veggies/fruits or foods high in fat at all. Dried, mild herbs are ok for the most part since they are a dry plant and don't contain a lot of water (which is the main reason they can't have fresh veggies/fruit, there's just too much water in one serving for them to handle and it can lead to bloat). The biggest thing about this though is that the treat isn't for them, it's for us. We give them the treat for our own amusement. They're cute when they beg for it or hold it in their paws. They don't need it and can live a long and healthy life without it. Why risk giving them problems? If you feel you must give them treats, it must be done sparingly with the appropriate treats in the appropriate amounts. --pIrish 16:38, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

There is no way they have 'adapted' to a "domestic diet" in the amount of time they have been domesticated. Dogs have been fed kibble-crap for close to a hundred years, and still do best on a raw meat diet. I'm removing this claim as the reference contains a mention only of their wild diet, not that the wild diet is 'dangerous' for domestic chinchillas. --andrew leahey 16:55, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

I changed the wording a little. It's not that they adapted to it, it's that they were already eating it. They were already eating dry plants (hence, why they easily adjusted to hay) in the wild before they were domesticated. Their diets have, however, adjusted to being fed this, and only this, and stuff like bugs and fruits could irritate their systems (just like a long term vegetarian can usually tell when they've eaten something with meat in it because they feel ill; their bodies just aren't adjusted to it). I also added a citation stating hay/pellet based is best. I will try re-wording it a bit more though. --pIrish ^Arr! 17:31, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

most expensive?

Is it the most expensive fur?

There should be more fur entries in this article, I think this fur is more valued than mink

If you have ever fully researched, the fur is more expensive that a minks.Crystal

I'd rather this regrettable misuse of healthy, intelligent animals was not mentioned at all.

Unfortunately, this is an encyclopedia and not a personal webpage. Thus, information cannot be censored and this includes the fact that chinchillas are used for their fur. No matter how much you disagree with it (I do too), the information must remain since it is very valid. --pIrish 14:28, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

A fair point, sir.

White chinchilla

I have a picture of myown chinchilla and I think that it could be used in the article since all the chinshillas are grey. Just send me a message if you want me to upload the image. --Krm500 00:53, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

Edible? Cute?

Are they eaten in South America like the Cuy or the Guinea pig. I wouldn't eat them... maybe I would. They are so cute though.

• I wouldn't think so, not as a regular thing anyway. At least not now, though I'm sure it was common a while ago. They're extremely protected nowadays because they're nearly extinct in the wild. --pIrish 12:08, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

They're cute and soo pettable. Should something be added to reflect them as cute pets?

No as that would go under the category of original research which is against policy. It's also rather unencyclopedic. --pIrish 17:33, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

It's not that unencyclopedic, see cuteness. Malamockq 17:01, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Cuteness by itself isn't, but with regard to this animal, it is. It's also very biased. I know plenty of people who think they're ugly. --pIrish 21:18, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Which is also original research Malamockq 07:06, 18 April 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.152.210.18 (talk) 16:25, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

That doesn't make saying chinchillas are cute justifiable, either. KiwiiTOS (talk) 08:32, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Discuss links here

Editors regularly clean out undiscussed links from this article. Please discuss here if you want a link not to be cleaned out regularly. (You can help!)

The external links section was starting to get out of hand. We should have only a few outside links, at the most. Please see Wikipedia: External Links for more information on what outside links are appropriate. These are the edits I made to this section and my reasoning behind each:

• Save the Wild Chinchillas [1] - This is one of the only sites on the internet that is directly related to chinchillas in the wild. If any links should stay, this one should be it.
• Chinchilla Library [2] - deleted it. Most of the books listed are extremely out-of-date and even out-of-print. Some of the books weren't in English and it really doesn't give us any extra information on the little guys so it's rather irrelevant.
• Chincare [3] - I'm leaving it...for now. It has decent information on chinchillas and it has a good section on chinchilla rescuing. The only reason I'm iffy on this one is because it advertises a lot of products all while giving information (which I'm sure they're making money on) so I'm really not to sure which way to go with this one. If nobody objects, I'll delete it at the end of the week.
• Chinchilla Club [4] - I took it out. I know it's one of the first hits on google, but it's a product-based e-store where breeders can mingle. There is hardly any outside information and is, therefore, irrelevant to the article. Also, any information it does contain, simply links you to an outside website.
• Chinchillas.com [5] - Deleted. While the site does contain some information, it is not really intended for someone who knows little about the breed and it looking to learn. It is primarily breeder based and it's primary goal is to auction of chinchillas, not to educate.
• Chinchilla-Lexikon [6] - Not in English. Deleted. If it is in English, I can't find it and that page should be linked, not the non-English homepage.
• Garden City Chinchillas [7] - I'm going to keep it because it offers valuable information on color mutations within the species that isn't covered in the article. It also shows pictures of all the mutations, which is very unique compared to nearly all other sites. However, being a breeder's site created for advertisement, the link must go to this page and not the home page.

• Cheeky Chinchillas [8] - I'm keeping it. It has lots of information on how to keep chinchillas as pets and extra information on them. Also has a very good page on chinchilla health problems. While this is a breeder's site, the homepage links to chinchilla information intended to promote the well-being of the animal instead of advertising their service.
• Chins-N-Quills [9] - I added this. I figure it would be good to have at least one link that sends people somewhere where they can ask questions about their pets that they can't find anywhere else online.

If anyone disagrees with any of these, please discuss it before adding it back or deleting it. We need to keep it down to a maximum of five, otherwise it starts looking cluttered. Also, I have this page on my watchlist, so don't worry about messaging me. Discussion here would be fine. Thanks. --pIrish 21:02, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

Links to forums are specifically considered not appropriate, per WP:EL. I'm removing Chins-N-Quills. CiaranG 23:13, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

That's fine. I wasn't sure whether to put it in or not to begin with so that's fine by me. --pIrish 01:19, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

The forum link should be removed altogether please. We can not testify to credibility of information provided on forums. This is a disaster waiting to happen, then who's liable? Guest 14:12, 4 July 2007

There is a new scientific study that for the first-time categorizes chinchilla sounds. To date there have only been hobby sound-tracks WITHOUT scientific basis. I am trying to add the scientific source -also in English translation and along with English abstract - numerous times. It gets deleted. Please explain why a scientifically based study keeps being substituted by hobby sound impressions. I thought Wikipedia aspires good knowhow, improved knowhow etc.

Frankly, it is truly frustrating to contribute scientific knowledge on this basis. This link would help to put the wiki entry on chinchillas on a higher level. It gets deleted??? Maybe that's why Wiki cannot be quoted on a scientific basis regarding this replacement policy. I am sorry, but I do not understand, why hobby and laymen homepage sound tracks are accepted, but scientifically based sound tracks in Englisch language are not. And keep being deleted????

Wiki is frustrating.

Confusing

The article says that they don't like being held and then sayys that they like eing held. Aside from individual variation, whcih is more correct? --Scottandrewhutchins 14:32, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

In general, they don't like being held. If you want to point out where this is, I could change it or you can go ahead and change it if you want. --pIrish 17:40, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

It depends on the chinchilla. Some of mine like being held. Four of them will actually jump out of their cage into my hands, the other three would resist but would let me pick them up and occasionally hop into my hands on their own. My friends' chin completely ignore her. It just depends on the animal's personality and their comfort level when it comes to the humans. I think article should just say that chinchillas differ per individual. Rumpelstiltzkin 23:01, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Question to Rumpel, as a chinchilla owner: Can they be kept out of their cages, like cats and dogs? Do they get along with cats? --Flvg94 17:24, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Not really. You have to chin-proof your house so they can't chew on anything (furniture, wires, etc). It's also a lot easier for them to sneak out of an open door than a cat or dog would and they would likely bolt for it rather than just sticking around the house like most dogs and cats. While, yes, I suppose they could be kept outside of a cage, it's probably not the smartest thing to do (plus they can't be housetrained (nearly impossible) so you'd have their poops/pee everywhere).

It's a no-go on the cats. While there are some chinchillas and cats that get along, for the most part, the cat's instinct will kick in and it'll go chinchilla hunting. If you let your two pets play to try to get along, it would have to be under strict supervision and they can never, ever be left alone.

If you have a question to ask as specific user, leave it on their personal talk page. If you leave it here, anyone will answer it, like I have done. --pIrish 17:31, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, that was very concise. I doubt Rumpel coulhave done a better job answering that :) . --ThrowingStick/Talk 14:51, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

What pIrish said. :-) Plus, they have would urinate. Though their urine is not as smelly as a rabbit, it's still not pleasant. You can let them out in an enclosed, controlled and supervized area for exercise. Like a hallway with all the doors closed and the end the blocked off by either a person or a tall enough barrier. The guys jump like crazy so at least 6 feet. Mine can clear 5 foot box easy. Rumpelstiltzkin 21:13, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Disambiguation?

The disambiguation bit at the start of this article seems unwieldy and long. Should we create Chinchilla (disambiguation)? Mermaid from the Baltic Sea 04:03, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

It used to be really short, but now it's gotten a little out of hand. I'd like to see it return to that state, but I think a disambig page, with this page being the default and this one linking to the disambig page, may be the best route to take. --pIrish 13:43, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

That seems like a good solution. Obviously, this article as the default is best. Mermaid from the Baltic Sea 18:28, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Ok, I've just done it at Chinchilla (disambiguation). Any corrections would be appreciated. Mermaid from the Baltic Sea 02:52, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

Looks good to me! Thanks! --pIrish 13:29, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

Females are softer?

Female Chinchillas also are 1.4235 times softer then males and are more frequently used in coats.

how does on measure the softness of the fur? and hos to such precision of 1/1000 ? --Tricksj 22:50, 30 January 2007 (UTC)tircksj

• There's a little tool you can use to measure the thickness of very fine materials. My dad uses one all the time at work and he brought it home once so we could see how thick my hair was compared to my chinchilla's. So, yes, it is possible to measure how thin it is which will give you a guesstimate about how soft it will be. However, that statistic sounds like a bunch of bull to me. I'm glad someone's already taken it out of the article.

Before I forget, make sure you ask a new question with a new heading. It makes for better organization on the talk page and it'll likely be answered more quickly than it would it you just tack it on to the end of a pre-existing conversation. --pIrish 02:12, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

Housing chinchillas with degus

We are successfully housing a juvenile chinchilla with a pair of degus, since they seem to get along and have the same dietary restrictions. Comments or concerns, anyone? Discpad 15:50, 4 March 2007 (UTC) Dan Schwartz & Adria Friedman, New Jersey.

If you say it works, it probably does. Here in Sweden however, the only mammal species that can legally be kept in the same cage are rabbits and guinea pigs. Probably for a good reason. --Oskila 21:58, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Chinchillas can be aggressive and kill other 'things' in their cage. Housing chinchillas with other animals is not advised as they should be on a formulated chinchilla diet and they can pick up diseases from other animals they are not accustomed to fighting. Chins should be kept with chins alone.

Mixed Breed?

I saw somewhere that a Chinchilla is a Hybrid betweeen a Rabbit and Rat. Does this happen to be true?

No. --pIrish 00:40, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

Diet: avoiding any sugars

The feeding section lists the raisin as an acceptable treat, which is (at minimum)dubious, because of the chinchilla and their first cousin, the degu are very prone to induced diabetes. It would be good to get the opinion of a vet in on this one. Discpad 15:50, 4 March 2007 (UTC) Dan Schwartz & Adria Friedman, New Jersey.

To answer your question, raisins are absolutely acceptable in SMALL amounts as a treat. Small amounts is the key. They can have one here and there, they just can't have them all the time. Similar to a dog. You give them too many treats and the dog gets fat and gets diabetes. To include an opinion of a vet would be original research unless it was published in a reliable source. No reason to take the information out, though it may be a good idea to really stress the importance of them only having them occasionally. --pIrish 16:29, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

NO! Chinchillas are about as sensitive to sugar-induced diabetes as their cousin, the degu. I'll have to get a reference on this, as this is what my friend (who has 2 degus sharing a cage with a chinchilla) was told by her vet, who is also a vet on staff at the Staten Island Zoo. In any case, despite this being an encyclopedia, often people will use this as a primary source; and the last thing we want is to put bad diet info in this article. Discpad 18:45, 5 March 2007 (UTC) Dan Schwartz

I actually own a chinchilla (which is NOT genetically identical to a degu!) whose previous vet works for the Indianapolis Zoo and his current vet works for the Mesker Park Zoo (does this make mine any more or less reliable than yours?) and I know many chinchilla breeders, as in, people who breed dozens of them, not just own one. I have never been told otherwise about raisins. Just because your friend's vet said something, doesn't necessarily make it true (that's backward logic). Yes, their digestive systems are sensitive, I'm not denying that, but they aren't going to be thrown completely out of whack by one raisin every few days and they aren't likely going to get diabetes from that small amount either. Please do more research! --pIrish 19:07, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

I just googled "chinchilla diabetes raisin" and these are the top six hits (not including this wiki article): [10], [11], [12], [13], [14], [15]. Not one of them says that raisins are diabetes-inducing killers that shouldn't ever be fed to your chinchilla, but they ALL say that they should be given in small amounts as sparingly as you can so you don't compromise the chinchilla's health if you give them too many. I'm not even going to list the hundreds of hits "chinchilla raisin" gets that all say the exact same thing. --pIrish 19:20, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

And another reply. You added info into the article that chinchillas can have fresh veggies just like their cousin the degu. Once again, you are assuming that both creatures are identical in digestive needs, when they aren't. It's important that chinchillas have as few fresh veggies as possible as they are loaded with water. Chinchillas come from the desert where everything is extremely dry and water is hard to come by so the plants they have adapted to eating are dry (which is why hay is fine for them). Too much water in their system could hurt them and it's far easier to overdo these than it is raisins. Most vets and breeders would never even consider giving their pets these foods, let alone suggest it. References to this: [16], [17], [18], [19], [20], [21], and [22]. --pIrish 22:31, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Exercise wheel

Take a look at United States patent number 6,578,526 and the related drawings (A TIFF viewer browser plug-in is required to see drawings). Discpad 19:11, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Too improve this article

This article is mixing genius, species and domestic chinchillas. It could be improved using the french fitured one and sub-pages: Chinchillas, chinchilla lanigera, chinchilla brevicaudata, domestic chinchillas or at least the external references in English linked from those pages. --Salixen 23:33, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

I think this article is sufficient, I really don't want us to have to have three pages for each type, I think that would get a little confusing. However, this page really does need sections talking about the individual types since we currently don't have them, I'm not even sure it's really even briefly mentioned. Actually, the article really needs a complete overhaul to it in general. I'd love to work on it, but with school, it's hard for me to get a lot of time to do it. --pIrish 00:19, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

There is a new scientific study that for the first-time categorizes chinchilla sounds. To date there have only been hobby sound-tracks WITHOUT scientific basis. I am trying to add the scientific source -also in English translation and along with English abstract - numerous times. It gets deleted. Please explain why a scientifically based study keeps being substituted by hobby sound impressions. I thought Wikipedia aspires good knowhow, improved knowhow etc.

Frankly, it is truly frustrating to contribute scientific knowledge on this basis. This link would help to put the wiki entry on chinchillas on a higher level. It gets deleted??? Maybe that's why Wiki cannot be quoted on a scientific basis regarding this replacement policy. I am sorry, but I do not understand, why hobby and laymen homepage sound tracks are accepted, but scientifically based sound tracks in Englisch language are not. And keep being deleted????

Wiki is frustrating. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.152.210.18 (talk) 16:32, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Ok, I am not good at tech stuff. But isn't it content that should matter and make a difference, rather than names? I provided scientific content. I am happy to also provide personal information and contact information about myself. However, I do not understand why this has any impact on scientific facts provided here. Sad. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.152.210.18 (talk) 17:34, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.152.210.18 (talk) 17:34, 2 October 2007 (UTC) 

Whatever that means??!?

I give up. Just stay on a scientific low level - a layman level. It is Wiki Level. Waste of time. Well, who cares...

Article re-write...of sorts

Some of you may know me as the editor that watches this page like a hawk and edits it mercilessly on occasion. I've had a lot of concerns about the article itself including the lack of citations, original research, and the fact that almost the entire article is basically an instruction manual/texbook for how to take care of chinchillas, which is against Wikipedia policy.

Due to these concerns, I've started re-writing the article. At the moment, I'm trying to include as much of the current article as I can, but I'm trying to make it more organized so it will flow better and look more professional. I'm trying to break up the intro into specific sections (like history, native habitat, and the fur trade). I'm trying to shrink the guidebook part of the article (How to keep a pet chinchilla!) so it is just a small section instead of the bulk of the article. I'm also trying to tack on as many citations as I can possibly find to make the article more reliable and get away from the original research feel of it.

What I'm asking any of you who watch this page or happen to stumble on this message is to help out if you can. The biggest thing I'm looking for are ideas for sections or information we may be missing from the current article (other than the fur trade stuff, I've already started expanding on that). To make this more reliable, if you can suggest any particular sites with really good information, I would be really grateful for the help. I plan on trying to get this new version up toward the beginning of next week. Remember, it's not a complete re-write, it's more of a moving-information-around-and-making-it-more-encyclopedic sort of thing. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! --pIrish 16:04, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

You can benefit of months of work I did in collaboration with the chilean and american specialists of chinchillas. You'll find many information in english from here , from here, from here and from here. Be carefull many websites are telling wrong information, that's wy I had to ask specalists to help on the frensh pages ! --Salixen 07:55, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

I used a few of the links that I found on those sites. Thanks for the help! --pIrish 14:25, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

All right, I just put up the new version. Hopefully it follows Wikipedia standards more closely. I've got about 20 citations, which is 20 more than we had before. I contracted the how-to section about keeping chinchillas as pets since Wikipedia is not a guidebook. I broke the intro up since it was way too long into sections about their history, their native environment, the species, and the fur industry. I also cut the external links down to the two most prominent. I deleted a few pictures to make it look less cluttered and replaced the picture in the infobox with a picture of an entire chinchilla (you can see his head, body, and tail).

Let me know what you think. If you have any concerns, don't be hesitant about leaving them here so we can talk about them. I'm always up for discussing improvements to the article. --pIrish 14:25, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

If anyone's interested, the family Chinchillidae, the genus Chinchilla and the two species all need their own artitcles. So that's four in total. This page should stay with whatever species is kept as a pet or, if both are, the genus Chinchilla. --Aranae 14:40, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure splitting would be the best way to go. I think there would be a lot of repeat information in the articles, which, in itself, would indicate that splitting isn't necessary. If the repeat information isn't included, then I fear the articles would be labelled as stubs. I'm all for more expanded, lengthened sections within the this article about each species instead of the little sub-section it's got right now, but I don't think splitting would be the best idea. At least, I don't think it is at the moment. If enough unique information about each species can be built up to form a full article (not a stub), then I think that would be ok. Until then, I think we should just expand on this article with seperate sections for each species.

Do understand, however, that I am not completely familiar with the seperate species. What I included in the current version is what I could find; nothing more, nothing less. If the species really are drastically different enough to need seperate articles instead of seperate sections, then please do let me know and point me in the right direction to where I can find more information than I've already got. Considering I want this article to be listed as a good article and, eventually, a featured article, I do want to see improvements. If this really could help, I would appreciate all the help I could get that would aid in my understanding of the seperate species. Thank you. --pIrish 15:46, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

I completely disagree. The article needs to be split. If not, the chinchillids become the only extant group of mammals in WP:MAM that are pooled into a single page instead of split into several. Find another page where it's pooled like this and you'll find a WP:TOLer who is planning to split it up some day. There are a few fossil taxa where that's may be true, but not something as well studied as chinchillids. This page is only vaguely relevant to viscachas, but due to a historic artifact in article creation, Chinchillidae redirects here. It's rather simple. If both species are kept as pets, then the pet related info belongs at Chinchilla and the species pages are for specifics of biology, distribution, etc. If only one is, then that gets the pet-related info and the others refer to the biology of the genus as a whole and of that species. --Aranae 16:50, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Please see Viscacha as an example of another page where there aren't seperate species pages and, instead, they are all lumped together in one article...and it's not tagged. However, that aside, after skimming through numerous articles, I do think we should split off and create stubs for the other two species. However (another one), I do not think we need four. I think three pages are suitable enough (one for each species, plus one for the domestic chinchilla and general history/break-off to the other two species) as this seems to be what various other pet pages, like Hamster and Gerbil, do as well. They have a main page about the domestic animal that tells the history and links to the other species. Also, Chinchillidae shouldn't be a redirect to here (it should be a disambiguation sort of page, this could be a type of fourth page you were talking about?), but I'm not the one who did that. --pIrish 17:39, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

The family page is what I was referring to as the fourth page. One for each species, one for the genus, and one for the family. They don't all have to be created at once. We seem to be in agreement so I won't press the issue, but viscacha is set up with red links to the various species pages and for the two genus pages who will all be getting their own articles someday. --Aranae 18:21, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

I'm happy you finely decided to split this article. It will help you to right it properly and more easily... It's exactly the same case as Rat : you have the Rattus page, the fancy rat page and pages for each species. Be carefull, the image used on Chinchilla brevicaudata page is a pet domestic hybrid chinchilla. You have on commons another one with a wild animal. However it's a good start ! Think that you can contribute with those pages to save the last wild animals in Chile : it's our responsability to inform all the world and we must be quick ! --Salixen 23:10, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

Adding a link

I added a link of a new site with good info about Pet Chinchillas, I saw the warning about posting here first after i edited the page. The site is non comercial one, I found useful info about chinchillas there.

I've removed it. The site produces no information from Alexa. The information is also extremely basic and is either already talked about here on this article or is contained in the more frequently visited and more informative chincare.com which is already listed here. --74.137.225.219 20:20, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

There is a new scientific study that for the first-time categorizes chinchilla sounds. www.chinchillasounds.de AND / OR http://www.freewebs.com/chinchillapost/cpenglish.htm To date there have only been hobby sound-tracks WITHOUT scientific basis. I am trying to add the scientific source -also in English translation and along with English abstract - numerous times. It gets deleted. Please explain why a scientifically based study keeps being substituted by hobby sound impressions. I thought Wikipedia aspires good knowhow, improved knowhow etc.

Frankly, it is truly frustrating to contribute scientific knowledge on this basis. This link would help to put the wiki entry on chinchillas on a higher level. It gets deleted??? Maybe that's why Wiki cannot be quoted on a scientific basis regarding this replacement policy. I am sorry, but I do not understand, why hobby and laymen homepage sound tracks are accepted, but scientifically based sound tracks in Englisch language are not. And keep being deleted????

Wiki is frustrating. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.152.210.18 (talk) 16:35, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Ok, I am not good at tech stuff. But isn't it content that should matter and make a difference, rather than names? I provided scientific content. I am happy to also provide personal information and contact information about myself. However, I do not understand why this has any impact on scientific facts provided here. Sad.

The link for chinchilla sounds is currently being used as a reference, which is perfectly acceptable for what you are suggesting. It doesn't have to be used and a reference AND be listed in the external links section. That's just overkill. It also makes its importance known by being a reference that cites a fact within the article. --199.8.170.4 18:40, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Ok, scratch that. You are making absolutely no sense here. Say what you mean, rather than ramble on and on about how terrible Wikipedia is for not allowing your site to be listed. The chinchillas.de site is being used as a reference and is perfectly suitable to use as a reference. The site you've listed here (the freewebs one) is absolutely not acceptable. The fact that it's being hosted on a free site shows that. Just because you call yourself an expert doesn't make you one. Surely these experts have published their findings in reputable sources? If they have, those can be used. Until then, this site is original research and shouldn't be linked to. --199.8.170.4 18:46, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Pre-Columbian use

did Andean civilizations not breed the Chinchilla for its coat or meat? Any reason why not? --86.148.57.131 (talk) 01:04, 8 January 2008 (UTC)