Talk:American Idol season 8

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Jamie Foxx Promoting His Movie & Cutoff Controversies

During The Top 5 Results Show Jamie Fox Promoted His New Movie The Soloist Successfully And Then Got Cutoff. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bvernon199 (talk • contribs) 22:42, 30 April 2009 (UTC)

Talkpage

Per our policies talkpages are not chat forums or to be used for general discussion that do not directly address improving this article. Also we need to remain civil to one another. For chart proposals please develop those in your own userspace. -- Banjeboi 02:02, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

Yahoo publishes results early?

Yahoo was reporting around 7:30 pacific time, before the show even aired, that Kris Allen won Idol. Did they do this shit last season, report it before the show aired? I've seen the last couple season finales and that didn't happen. Fox advertises the finale as being live (i.e. a circa 15-second delay), so I assumed that at, oh, 8:10 pm (west coast time, my time), I was watching something that was being taped at 8:10 pm in LA. --98.232.181.201 (talk) 03:19, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

The results were announced at 10:00 pm Eastern time, which is 7:00 pm Pacific time; the finale was live for eastern and central time zones only, it is tape-delayed for the west coast. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 03:22, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

Itunes promoting

Why should there be two indentical sections on Itunes one at the start and one at the end? Only to promote Itunes. Wikipedia is not for that! Suggest to remove top mentioning. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.127.162.156 (talk) 14:53, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

 Done A user moved it to the top, and another restored the deleted bottom one, creating two of the same. I now deleted the top one since it isn't as important there as the other info. Thanks for keeping an eye on it. --Mtjaws (talk) 18:07, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

Merge proposal

Grand Finale (American Idol 8) should be merged with American Idol (season 8)#Finale. The article can easily fit into the main article, and currently is a WP:Content fork.  iMatthew :  Chat  19:15, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

No. Gage (talk) 07:10, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Besides that, we've been doing this for a couple of seasons now. It works well because putting it here would simply crowd an already crowded page. --User:Woohookitty ^{Diamming fool!} 08:27, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Disagree - The Grand Finale is a different event as opposed to the show. It's more of an actual concert rather than just a results show. It may have added historicity if it is able to launch a music superstar.--23prootie (talk) 22:20, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Have any of you read Wikipedia:Content fork?  iMatthew :  Chat  22:45, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

How on Earth is that a content fork? -- Banjeboi 23:08, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Disagree. Grand Finale (American Idol 8) is an appropriate sub article to this and should be represented here summary style. -- Banjeboi 23:08, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Disagree - I think the page is too cluttered if all the finale info isn't split off on its own page. CloversMallRat (talk) 05:24, 26 May 2009 (UTC)

elimination chart

I changing the 'Elim' to palegoldenrod as they are too similar to the wildcard coloursFrazzler9 (talk) 13:49, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

megan and anoop top 13

i know Ryan never said they were the bottom 4... but it was heavely implied... ryan would say to JaSMINE... come to centre stage please... then to Kris ... you are safe... then to Megan... come down to centre stage... he only referenced Megan and Anoop as being 'safe' in comparison to Jasmine and Jorge respectively...I will put it btm 4 for Megan and Anoop even though I know that it will be reverted Frazzler9 (talk) 15:13, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

That is entirely original research and has no place on Wikipedia. I have reverted you. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 16:14, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

New Performance List Suggestion

I copied this performance summary list of the 'Popstars The Rivals' wikipedia article. I think it looks more proffessional.. What do You guys think?

Frazzler9 (talk) 23:44, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

It doesn't make any sense to me to have this AND the elimination chart. Keep them separate. --User:Woohookitty ^{Diamming fool!} 08:27, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

I have no idea how this might help anything as it is more confusing than what we already have. Sorry. -- Banjeboi 08:39, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

No they're meant to be in place of the performance lists... Atm we have those weekly lists. I think this example will work better as it says 'btm 3', 'btm 2' . 'elim' right next to the name so you don't have to waste time trying to find the eliminated name and their position in the performance list. here is a better example:

Semi Finals Group 1 (18 February 2009)

Theme: Billboard Hot 100 hits

Order	Artist	Song (original artists)	Result	Notes
1	Jackie Tohn	"A Little Less Conversation" (Elvis Presley)	Eliminated
2	Ricky Braddy	"A Song for You" (Donny Hathaway)	Eliminated	Chosen for Wild Card
3	Alexis Grace	"I Never Loved a Man (The Way I Love You)" (Aretha Franklin)	Advanced	Highest Votes Female
4	Brent Keith	"Hicktown" (Jason Aldean)	Eliminated
5	Stevie Wright	"You Belong with Me" (Taylor Swift)	Eliminated
6	Anoop Desai	"Angel of Mine" (Monica)	Eliminated	Chosen for Wild Card
7	Casey Carlson	"Every Little Thing He Does Is Magic" (The Police)	Eliminated
8	Michael Sarver	"I Don't Want to Be" (Gavin DeGraw)	Advanced	Top 2 Males
9	Ann Marie Boskovich	"(You Make Me Feel Like) A Natural Woman" (Aretha Franklin)	Eliminated
10	Stephen Fowler	"Rock with You" (Michael Jackson)	Eliminated
11	Tatiana Del Toro	"Saving All My Love for You" (Whitney Houston)	Eliminated	Chosen for Wild Card
12	Danny Gokey	"Hero" (Mariah Carey)	Advanced	Top 2 Males

Frazzler9 (talk) 10:20, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

What don't you understand about no? Gage (talk) 03:37, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

What don't you understand about the fact that I don't value your opinion...

This format is used on the Pop Idol page so if you want to keep consistency then you should stick to the original Idol wikipedia article. This way looks more professional and the notes section is good for putting facts like Alexis, Allison and Lil were the highest voted females and information about the save etc... 92.2.27.46 (talk) 21:39, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Actually, the Pop Idol page was only done recently - I should know, I helped do most of it. If anything, the Pop Idol pages should change to these American Idol pages, which are far more established. Pop Idol doesnt even run anymore, making it sort of irrelevant. (Kyleofark (talk) 15:22, 29 May 2009 (UTC))

Well if you made the pop idol page then did you make these tables. They are really good and are more clear and simple to read. 92.4.65.142 (talk) 22:02, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

I made some of the tables, but the first few were already done by someone else, who I imagine thought that Pop Idol would be under the same category as The X Factor, which followed it as such in the UK (Kyleofark (talk) 23:13, 29 May 2009 (UTC))

I'm going to revert the changes just made. I don't see a consensus here for this change. LEAVE. IT. ALONE. :) Tired of the constant messing with the tables in this article. --User:Woohookitty ^{Diamming fool!} 06:29, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

We need a consensus before massive changes are made again. --User:Woohookitty ^{Diamming fool!} 11:57, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

I didn't actually make the change this time actually haha.. But i vote for these tables to be used 92.4.83.254 (talk) 20:29, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

The tables do look ok, but every single section for all eight seasons would have to be changed, to create a unified look. I am fine with the current, simplified format, and object to "change for the sake of change". Everything doesn't have to look like the European counterparts. --Mtjaws (talk) 15:49, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

I also do not think the changes are necessary. Adding these tables seem to be change for changes sake and adding color to brighten up the page, which are two of Frazzler9's current themes. As evidenced two quotes above not making the change this time, we know all of the IP addresses starting with 92. are Frazzler. I have been reverting these table changes from the first two seasons because the editor, 70.52.179.169, refuses to discuss anything in an edit summary, article talk page or his own talk page. So no, Frazzler you, your many IP 92. statements/edits and possibly also 70.52.179.169 have not "gained consensus." Aspects (talk) 17:07, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

By the way I was not making any effort to conceal my IP address. I just hadn't signed in to Wikipedia. I looked at this page and saw that someone had implemented the tables into the article so I just adjusted them to look more professional and sophisticated. My aim is not 'colour for the sake of colour'. i prefer these tables as they make more direct emphasis to the advanced or eliminated contestants. The notes section I particularly like because we can say that the contestant was eliminated but then add that he/she was selected for the wild Card; a similar debate occured with the elimination chart and that the semi final performance should say 'elim' instead of 'WC'. The original list at the moment never say that the contestants who didn't advance were eliminated. It just shows the Wild Cards and the top 3. To be absolutely sure that the contestants were eliminated you would have to check on the elimination chart. The tables act as a more efficient resource and doesn't need to be cross-checked with the elimination chart. The colour I feel isn't distracting or in appropriate... I find that it is used well. BY the way I am not 70.52.179.169... and the only IP 92. I have are my computer and my ipod touch. Frazzler9 (talk) 18:34, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

So with this edit, [1], you admit you do not have consensus but then you still make the edits? Aspects (talk) 16:55, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

I was just showing an accurate completion of the tables. I think that the notes section is useful but needs to be trimmed down and not to take up so much space. I htink the tables are more useful and act as a 'stand-alone' resource. You don't need to cross-reference the tables and the elimination chart, everything is perfectly clear. 92.4.67.8 (talk) 17:58, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

Okay, one more request to please STOP making changes without discussing them here AND getting a consensus. I believe that frazzler is the ONLY one that is interested in these changes. Not only is there a consensus, there is a fairly strong consensus for frazzler to stop making arbitrary changes on his own whim. I would recommend that frazzler start up his own AI web-page where he can change things daily to his hearts content and stop making changes to the Wikipedia. Tedying (talk) 02:02, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

You really need to chill out.... Why are you getting so worked up about an edit which you probably didn't experience and if you did you could have just taken 2 seconds to revert it. I doubt that it caused you much trouble. I was just showing what an accurate completion of the tables would look like. I am not the only one wanting this edit... IP 70 actually made all the tables and added them to this article. The tables make this article look more proffesional. The movie week especially looks jumbled and stupid. 92.6.113.88 (talk) 18:59, 9

June 2009 (UTC)

Wild Card Round - Billboard Hot 100 hits

Order	Performer	Song	Artist	Result	Notes
1	Jesse Langseth	"Tell Me Something Good"	Rufus and Chaka Khan	Eliminated	Was told by Cowell she almost made it
2	Matt Giraud	"Who's Lovin' You"	The Jackson 5	Advanced	Was the 3rd selected
3	Megan Joy	"Black Horse and the Cherry Tree"	KT Tunstall	Advanced	Was the 2nd selected
4	Von Smith	"Sorry Seems to Be the Hardest Word"	Elton John	Eliminated	Was told he had some incorrections
5	Jasmine Murray	"Reflection"	Christina Aguilera	Advanced	Was the 1st selected
6	Ricky Braddy	"Superstition"	Stevie Wonder	Eliminated	Was told he lacked personality
7	Tatiana Del Toro	"Saving All My Love for You"	Whitney Houston	Eliminated	Tatiana sang the same song
8	Anoop Desai	"My Perogative"	Bobby Brown	Advanced	Anoop was advanced to make a top 13

I much prefer these tables. If there is a concern about space then we can eliminate the 'artists' sections and merge it with the song section to make it a 'songs (original artists)'. 92.6.113.88 (talk) 20:47, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

check otu this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pop_Idol_(series_2)#Elimination_chart ... this is the pop Idol article and they use tables.. they lose the notes section however after the semi finals 92.6.113.88 (talk) 20:52, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Votes?

So what was the final score of votes between Kris and Adam? This is something American Idol never mentions on the show (or rarely). And its pretty important for validity.24.61.21.58 (talk) 05:02, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

There is no way of knowing, official numbers were not released, and rarely are. Gage (talk) 16:16, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

Hm. Lame. So I guess we all just trust that the show is delivering us the proper winner every week without actually knowing the true results. (not like that couldn't be fooled with, I know, but it would be nice to know anyway).

Controversy section

Someone needs to elaborate on the AT&T scandal because there are quite alot of significant details not gone into there..like the exponential voting, free cell phones given out, etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.61.21.58 (talk) 06:08, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

Alexis Grace

I was just doing some work, and browsing through, various contestant articles. Why does every finalist except for Alexis Grace have an article? I noticed the deletion page (so don't just point me there), and it seems very shady to me that it was first kept then deleted a VERY short time later, with very little discussion, and no reference to the previous time when it was kept. Anyways, it just seems odd that Jorge Nunez and Jasmine Murray--neither of whom lasted as long in the competition as Grace--have articles about them and she doesn't. And someone protected Alexis Grace so the article can't even be created. I just don't understand all of this stuff. Unitanode 13:27, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

• sigh* Long story short: the deletionists won the argument for deleting her article, because we couldn't come up with a reason why she was truly notable at the time. Jasmine was considered "notable" on the merits of her "Miss America's Outstanding Teen" title; I have no idea what made Jorge notable. But based on the fact that she finished 11th and hasn't done anything "notable" since, I'd just leave it be - I'm afraid if anyone makes a big stink about it again, the deletionists will just come back and try to wipe out some more contestant pages (i.e. Jorge, Jasmine, Sarver, etc...). Cespence17 (talk) 16:14, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Actually it started out with articles for Alexis, Danny and Michael since they were the first three to advance to the final 12/13. They passed the first AfD and then they were overturned on review. By that time the deletionists were going after Von Smith and Jackie Tohn, that both had articles before they were on American Idol, and Danny and Michael's articles had numerous references to fulfill WP:MUSIC. If only Alexis had made the top 10, chances are more articles would have been written about her and since she would have gone on tour, would have increased her chances to pass WP:MUSIC. I tried to get the last version before the deletion on a user page of mine but it seem to get lost in the shuffle of the deletion review and never happened. Now I do not have the effort. If someone else wants to try, go to Wikipedia:Deletion review asking to have the page userified. Aspects (talk) 17:12, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

• It all seems a bit pedantic and over-the-top. Why would anyone care if Alexis had an article? Doesn't EVERY finalist on AI have an article? I truly don't understand the motivations of people who argue for deletion of articles like that one. Unitanode 18:27, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

she should have an article as she was in the top 12... thats how it works... I'm going to the admins if the deletionists don't let us have an article for Alexis Grace Frazzler9 (talk) 19:45, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

It is a bit silly that Alexis doesnt have an article, though I do understand why. To be honest, I think more needs to be written about her on the main AI8 page. All whats there now is "Alexis has been singing at a young age" which is a bit basic and not at all informative about Grace, considering a lot of aspiring artists sing from a young age. If anyone could find sources, im sure it would be useful if it were mentioned that her exit was a shock, that she has a son and so on.(Kyleofark (talk) 21:57, 6 June 2009 (UTC))

Alexis deserves an article (she's unlucky, isn't she? first the tour, now the only finalist without an article). If she had survived just one more week, she'd already have one.--Yolgnu (talk) 04:41, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

Jasmine & Jorge

I changed the wording of a sentence in their short biography things. They both previously said "Jasmine/Jorge was the first to be eliminated from the top 13 along with Jasmine Murray/Jorge Nunez. I felt that to give the wrong message, because whilst they were the first two to be eliminated, and we're unsure of the order, its strange to say that two people were the first to be eliminated. Im not even entirely sure that it makes sense. I changed it to "Jasmine was eliminated in the first week of the finals, along with Jorge" and the same for Jorge, which i feel makes more sense. I know its minor, but I thought id mention the change here anyway. :) (Kyleofark (talk) 22:06, 6 June 2009 (UTC))

Elimination Chart

(Moved elimination chart to User:Frazzler9/Sandbox instead of continually having new charts here on the talk page. Aspects (talk) 20:50, 14 June 2009 (UTC))

I think this is a good idea and should be up for discussion as this version of the elimination chart is more in-sync with the shows format in which the highest-voted female, male and the next highest vote recipient advances. You get the impression from this table through the use of the male and female colours that the highest male and female advanced. I have some problems though. Do we know for definite that Kris, Jorge and Michael were the 'next highest'? If so then should their semi final result block contain '2' in the cyan colour or '3' in the palegoldenrod. I fear that if it was the 'cyan' colour it might give the impression that 2 guys get voted through. i got this idea from other idol articles which show the vote placement for the semi finals by using '1' and '2' on contestants semi final performances. I implimented this idea into season 1 and 3 articles as i thought it made the table more accurate. one issue i had with this is that the column width is not equal to the 'btm 3' column lenght so I put an extra '0' in front of the semi final dates. I know u can increase column width but I didn't want to mess with it.. I am not putting this idea on the table just for change sake but I feel that is useful and you can't deny that I have a point. 92.3.181.207 (talk) 20:15, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

The changes you are proposing make the table more confusing. "You get the impression from this table through the use of the male and female colours that the highest male and female advanced." That is exactly what happened. The problems with placing the numbers are 1) the placements of the men were never fully explained on any of the three semi-final weeks, it is confusing how two people couple could be 1 and it is leads one to believe every week the top two men and the top woman would advance when it could have been been two women and one man. Aspects (talk) 20:56, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

On the season 7 article Kinnik Sky and Kevin Covais are, in the elimination chart, listed as 'btm 3' in their own gender colours on top 20 week. It is the same principle as Allison was the 1st voted female as Kinnik was the btm 3 female and Adam was the 1st voted male as Kevin was the btm 3 male. We could possibly put '1 - 2' on Kris and Adam? On the main AI page it once said that ADam, Scott and Danny were the highest. The table acts as a stand-alone source and isn't as reliant on the other text in the wikipedia chart as the old table. I still think this table should be up for consideration... 92.3.181.207 (talk) 21:26, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

• Long story short, you have no consensus to change the chart to your preferred form. Stop doing so until such time as you can gather consensus for it. Unitanode 05:02, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

ok i don't mean this disrespectfully but shut up. I have never changed the article to include this table and what i'm doing now is trying to gain consensus so your comment is irrelevant as it is stupid.. My change is appropriate. Like the season 5 article, Kinnik sky has a btm 3 in pink and kevin covais has a btm 3 in blue... This is the same principle.. and it makes sense. at the moment it says 'top 13' What does that mean???? They advance to the top 13 but it doesn't make sense when it says 'top 13'. The contestants arn't announced as 'top 13'. They have advanced to the top 13. 92.0.139.111 (talk) 15:43, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

I don't mean this disrespectfully, but it must just be a huge coincidence that another anon IP just happens to be trying to force the new chart format into the article, right? Telling people to "shut up" is incredibly counterproductive, especially when you're wrong about the issue you're discussing with them. Unitanode 16:28, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

Just to add my two cents in this, but I really dont see the point in adding this information. Anyone with any sense would work out that the people with "top 13" are the ones who went through, just by them having "Top 13" and the other contestants from their group having "Elim". Also, seeing as we have no idea of which males were the 1st placed male, it's just going to get confusing. I think it should just be left as it is. The table is fine, people need to stop making endless changes to it. (Kyleofark (talk) 16:25, 17 June 2009 (UTC))

excuse me im not an anon IP.. This is frazzler9 and ip70 is not me... The table is more of a results table than an elimination table & so the placements should be charted. If we do not kno the male placements we can put 1-2 92.0.139.111 (talk) 19:07, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

elimination chart colours

(Moved elimination chart to User:Frazzler9/Sandbox instead of continually having new charts here on the talk page.) Aspects (talk) 22:46, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

I feel that the wild card colours are too similar to the elimination colour scheme especially the yellow 'elims'. i am suggesting this scheme posted below... We could also change the 'save' colour to this scheme as it is the same concept: the judges are saving a contestant who was eliminated at one stage in the competition. The WC colour is too similar to the elimination chart colours 92.3.174.44 (talk) 14:28, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

my sandbox

check out my awesome ideas at User:Frazzler9/Sandbox.. these are significant and not foolish ideas 92.3.174.44 (talk) 19:49, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Wild Card Colours

I am changing the wild card colours to the same colour used for the judges save. I am doing this because A) the wild card colours are too similar to the btm 3/btm 2/Elim colour scheme and B) because it is a similar concept: the judges saving contestant/contestants who were originally eliminated 92.3.174.44 (talk) 11:34, 23 June 2009 (UTC)