Talk:University of Helsinki

• how would you feel about linking to this page Finnish innovation system?

I don't think that would be very useful because that article will (hopefully) be deleted sooner or later. --Jonik 3 July 2005 17:58 (UTC)

The plural of campus is campuses [1]. This is not latin but English, so use English plurals.--Alun 1 July 2005 17:55 (UTC)

Exactly. People who think we should prefer correct Latin forms to established English ones should really head over to the Latin Wikipedia. ;-) --Jonik 3 July 2005 17:58 (UTC)

What sets this campus apart from most other university campuses in the world is its central location and the seamless way in which it segues into the rest of the city What is the basis for this statement? Many Universities are set in the centre of cities, and they often reflect the architecture of the time/place they were built and so generally fit seamlessly into their environments. I really don't think this is unusual at all.--Alun 1 July 2005 18:06 (UTC)

As the article actually points out, "campus" is hardly the most correct term to use for a traditional urban university. It might be more appropriate for the peripheral areas. Uppland 3 July 2005 20:02 (UTC)

I have assumed that the University itself uses the term campus. Helsinki University is clearly not a campus university (I work in Meilahti, a long way from the centre). If the locations for the various buildings are not officially called campuses by the University, then why not just call them sites? As in The University is located on four main sites.... If the University explicitly uses the term campus for the various sites, then it could be mentioned that they are not conventional campuses, but are called such by the University. Anyway I don't really see what your point is. My point is that universities based in city centres are not unusual, so this fact doesn't set this campus apart from most other university campuses in the world...., in this context use of the term campus is irrelevant. We appear to be misunderstanding each other here.--Alun 7 July 2005 12:25 (UTC)

I actually think I understand you perfectly well. My point is that it is the very use of the American word "campus" which forces the text to explain something which is actually quite normal, making it appear unusual, while it is so only in relationship to more recent "campus universities". I have no idea what terminology the university itself uses, or if the use of the word "campus" in the article is simply the result of adapting to an American terminology perceived as normative. Uppland 7 July 2005 13:00 (UTC)

Well I don't seem to understand what your point is. My point is that there is nothing unusual about having a University spread out over several locations in a city centre (something the article originally said was unusual). I don't think that the term campus is American. There are numerous campus universities in the UK, as well as many city centre universities (like Cardiff where I went). If your point is that the use of the word campus is inapropriate, then I quite agree, and have already suggested changing it to site. The only reason for not changing it would be if it is an official term used by the University of Helsinki itself, which I have also mentioned. So if you agree, maybe I'll re-word the article somewhat to replace the word campus with something more appropriate. What do you think?--Alun 8 July 2005 06:01 (UTC)

I have no disagreement with you, have never pretended to disagree with you, and don't see why we are having this argument. The word campus is American, and originated in Princeton.[2] My point is that whoever wrote the passage about "campuses" may be catering to a perceived American reader's expectations. I live in Uppsala and have frequently been asked by visiting Americans "where the university is", or where "the campus" is located. It is obvious that many Americans expect a university to be collected more or less in one place, and many Europeans are aware of this and may even have more knowledge of American universities than of other European ones. I have no knowledge of how Finnish universities use the word "campus"; I know it has been borrowed by traditional Swedish universities like Uppsala and Lund, but it is not used for the older parts of the universities located in the centre of the town, only for various peripheral complexes. --Uppland 8 July 2005 08:19 (UTC)

I'm not aware that we are having an arguement. I am merely trying to determine your position relative to mine. I'm looking for clarity not confrontation, surely people should be allowed to express their oppinions without rancour, how else will we acheive consensus? It seems that we actually agree that the term campus is not appropriate for this article. In any case the relevance of the term was never actually the point of my initial comment, so I have become confused as to how your point (about the appropriateness of the word campus) has any bearing whatsoever to the point I was initially making (about how city centre universities are NOT unusual), which is why I am seeking clarity. The term campus may have been coined (with repect to universitie) in the US, but as far as I'm aware it is in common enough use in universities accross the English speaking world (certainly in th UK) to be considered a general English language term for a university (or part of a university) based at a single site, and not a specifically American term. This is my oppinion and you are perfectly entitled to hold a differing oppinion if you so wish.--Alun 8 July 2005 09:55 (UTC)

The university itself widely uses the term campus nowadays. Both in Finnish (kampus) and in English. (There is the "city centre campus", and three other main campus areas that are not in the centre, but some 3-8 km away. In the past, the university facilities were more scattered around, but at least since late 1990s (maybe earlier) there's been an effort to concentrate all activities to the 4 main campuses.) So, I think the term is appropriate enough for the article, and that there is no need to replace it with "site" or some such. Take at look at this page, for example, to see what kind of terminology they use: http://www.helsinki.fi/inbrief/.

While at it, I'll point out that "none of the campuses have student accommodation" is slightly incorrect, because at least the Kumpula campus has some student housing right next to the university buildings, and also in Viikki there's accommodation basically in the same area. The mention does have a point though, in a way, because these student apartments are not directly owned by or related to the uni, but instead are managed by HOAS [3], a student housing organisation. To live in these flats, however, you have to enrolled at the uni, or some other educational institution in the Helsinki area. Of course, all this is a bit complicated and tedious, and not really worth mentioning. I really do not know what's the best way to describe the campus areas in the article. :-) --Jonik 8 July 2005 18:33 (UTC)

Thanks for clearing that up. Seems to me the article is about right as it stands then, what do you think? By the way does a campus have to have accomodation to be considered a campus? Not according to this definition--Alun 8 July 2005 18:45 (UTC)

That's a good point, too. I removed the explanation as it stood. I guess the person who wrote that in the first place was indeed "catering to a perceived American reader's expectations" or something. To make matters very clear, we could of course add a senctence such as: The campuses are not similar to typical American campuses, but perhaps that's not necessary. :-)

(So at least now the article is about right. To make this into a good article though, someone ought to expand at least the history section. (Preferably a lot, since the uni has a long history, and because it has on many occasions been of great importance to Finnish historical developments in general.) And perhaps also the "notable people" part which is currently just scratching the surface. I mean, as far as Finnish statesmen, scientists, cultural figures, etc, go, quite a big percentage of them have attented this university.) --Jonik 8 July 2005 19:30 (UTC)

We might want to separate the "notable people" section to "alumni", "faculty" etc. and state more clearly what is the relation of the person to the university. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.27.13.18 (talk) 19:41, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

Trivia Section

Aside from the gross indentation this section creates, we ought to resist the dubiously fashionable spread of these 'empirical' league tables. They have been demonstrated to favour certain kinds of institutions of higher education, they simplify and mislead the understanding of the institutions character and social place and, more importantly, only serve to turn wiki-pages into university advert brosures. Though the addition and effort is appreciated, I submit that paragraphed presentation of the institution's quality ought to be prefered. Thanks all the same. 81.129.7.241 (talk) 23:56, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

Category:1640 establishments vs. Category:Educational institutions established in the 1640s

Category:Educational institutions established in the 1640s is itself a category within Category:1640 establishments — Robert Greer (talk) 15:03, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

University of Helsinki on Facebook

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Helsinki-Finland/University-of-Helsinki/200739723082?ref=ts —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.101.11.67 (talk) 15:05, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Bologna compliance

"As of August 1 2005, the University complies with the standards of the Europe-wide Bologna Process and offers Bachelor, Master, Licenciate, and Doctoral degrees.[1]"

• Bologna is not a standard but soft policy and it is much more than BMD-structure. I thinkt his phrase should be reconsidered or reformatted to include wider perspective of Bologna process --Murrur (talk) 03:30, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

University Ranking Ought Not To Be Included

Given the a) implicit ideological tendencies; b) the English language-culture bias; c) the empiricist fetishism; and d) the instrumental rationality inherent in the university rankings mentality (in theory and in praxis), I don't think it is in the interests of a considered and thoughtful article on the university's history and social context to include such 'statistics' here. To include them, aside from the critical reasons hinted above, is surely to make the first step in turning this unique online information compendium into a tacky university applications brochure that only serves vested interests, whether ideolodical or more concrete.