Talk:42 (film)

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Leo Durocher's suspension

The article edit is inaccurate to say that Leo Durocher's suspension was "never" because of his romantic relationship with actress Laraine Day. Three of multiple sources:

"Chandler, who came to be regarded as a joke as commissioner, never did. In truth, he had been under pressure to prove himself as commissioner, and in all likelihood was emboldened to act by the Catholic Youth Organization's decision (motivated by the headlines implicating Durocher in Day's divorce case) to end its affiliation with the Dodgers' youth group, the Knothole Club." - from the LA Times, at http://articles.latimes.com/1989-08-06/sports/sp-154_1_leo-durocher

"Back in Brooklyn, disturbed over Durocher's role in Laraine Day's divorce action, and upset over Leo's earlier associations off the field, the Catholic Youth Organization withdrew from the Dodger Knothole Club, claiming that Durocher was "undermining the moral training of Brooklyn's Roman Catholic youth.""- from Sports Illustrated, at http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1129732/2/index.htm

"The sorting out was a feast for headline writers, as Day sought a Mexican divorce and was speedily married to Durocher, only to see that marriage invalidated by a California judge. The baseball commissioner, Happy Chandler, suspended Durocher for the 1947 season as Brooklyn Catholics threatened to boycott the Dodgers. By 1948, the dust had cleared — Day was properly divorced, and she and Durocher remarried, and he was reinstated." - from the New York Sun, at http://www.nysun.com/obituaries/laraine-day-87-film-actress-and-first-lady/66358/

98.242.190.11 (talk) 12:53, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

In fact, the citation being offered ("and got himself suspended for the 1947 season by Commissioner A. B. (Happy) Chandler, "as a result of the accumulation of unpleasant incidents detrimental to baseball."") doesn't even say what's being stated in the article edit. It does NOT say Durocher's suspension never had anything to do with Laraine Day.

98.242.190.11 (talk) 12:57, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

From Jules Tygiel's book Baseball's Great Experiment: Jackie Robinson and His Legacy (published 1983), “On the morning of April 9 [1947], . . . Baseball Commissioner Happy Chandler shocked the baseball world by suspending Durocher for one year for ‘conduct detrimental to baseball.’ Durocher was the unfortunate victim of a long-simmering feud between Rickey and Yankee President Larry MacPhail, a conflict which had deepened, though not created, by their differences over the race issue. Several years earlier, Commissioner Landis had warned Durocher against consorting with known gamblers. In response, he had presented the commissioner with a list of people with whom he would no longer socialize. When two of the people on Durocher’s untouchable list appeared in MacPhail’s box at a Yankee game, both Durocher and Rickey attacked the hypocrisy of the situation. MacPhail, who had orchestrated Chandler’s selection as commissioner, cried slander and demanded an investigation of the charges. Few people expected any major developments to occur. Nonetheless, with the opening of the baseball season less than a week away, Chandler levied fines on both clubs and suspended the Dodger manager.” Tygiel further refers to Durocher's autobiography Nice Guys Finish Last (1976, pp 229-236), Harold Parrot's The Lords of Baseball (1976, pg 204), and Arthur Mann's Branch Rickey: American In Action (1957, pp 250-251).

The LA Times' opinion of baseball's comedic talents in choosing Chandler as Commissioner notwithstanding, stated opinion without actually researching the known facts. The CYO did sever its association with Brooklyn's "Knothole Gang", but it was an issue with Brooklyn, NOT with all of baseball. Durocher's adventures with Laraine Day were well known at the time, and served as fodder with which many bench jockey's taunted him, but those adventures were not what got him suspended. The only one of your cited sources that makes that direct claim is an obituary of Laraine Day,60 years after the suspension. The late Jules Tygiel was a respected baseball researcher, and I would consider him a much more authoritative source. -- Couillaud 15:33, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

Smith vs. Lacy for BBWAA primacy

The NYT says Sam Lacy was the first African-American writer in the BBWAA. Cooperstown and Wikipedia say it was Wendell Smith, though the Wikipedia entry is not sourced. Given the opposite opinions of Cooperstown and the Times, how is it we're picking a winner? JMOprof (talk) 17:29, 3 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I had no opinion on this previously, because I had no idea which was correct, but now that you've pointed this out, I think it's best that we not mention this at all. Clearly, reliable sources differ on this, and we cannot decide which is to be believed. ---The Old Jacobite_{The '45} 13:05, 20 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I do not have an online source, but the BBWAA lists Sam Lacy as a member starting in 1948 and Wendel Smith in 1956. -- Couillaud 05:43, 23 May 2013 (UTC)

I added a {{cn}} tag to the paragraph. It's clearly required. Were it up to me, I would accept the Baseball Hall of Fame's article ("As the first black member of the BBWAA, [Smith] covered the White Sox...") on Smith over the NYTimes article on Lacy. The former being an agency that deals only in baseball vs. an agency that dabbles in baseball. ☺ JMOprof (talk) 12:59, 23 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The Hall of Fame, while owning the best library of baseball-related materials, has been known to accept and publish inaccurate statements without independently checking them; this is one such example. And the BBWAA is short for "Baseball Writers Association of America". The BBWAA is also an agency that deals only in baseball, and its publication listed Lacy as the first African-American sports journalist admitted (1948), and listed Smith as admitted in 1956. I cannot give an online citation (and considering the massive body of knowledge that is still not online, I am not bothered by that), but the BBWAA should be considered a prime source as to its list of members. I think that it's probable that the movie used such data as the Hall as its source without checking further.

-- Couillaud 15:53, 24 May 2013 (UTC)

Inaccuracy in section on historical inaccuracies

Jackie Robinson was born in 1919, according to every entry I can find in other sources. This would make him 28 in 1947, not 38 as the "historical inaccuracies" section previously claimed. This is either an unfortunate typo or a major mathematical error and I have corrected it and included a citation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.53.188.244 (talk) 21:08, 15 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Inaccuracy 2 in section on historical inaccuracies

"The Brooklyn Dodgers held their 1947 Spring Training in Havana, Cuba, not Panama City, Panama, as depicted in the movie." false. The Dodgers went in Cuba and Panama. 85.69.175.172 (talk) 00:15, 3 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

no Panama City in Panama, there IS a city named Panama in Panama but NO Panama City... there IS a Panama City in the PANhandle of Florida.. is this the one that is implied in the movie? 184.63.251.224 (talk) 18:14, 30 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]