Talk:Itanium
This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Itanium article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | Itanium has been listed as one of the Engineering and technology good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it. | |||||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||||
Current status: Good article |
{{WikiProject banner shell}}
to this page and add the quality rating to that template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details.![]() | Computing GA‑class Mid‑importance | ||||||||||||
|
This page has archives. Sections older than 60 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III when more than 4 sections are present. |
"Software support" section is mutating
The "Software support" section, which starts with the phrase
- Itanium is supported by the following operating systems
...then pretty much instantly goes off the rails by talking about operating systems that are being ported to another architecture.
I suggest that this section should remain about Itanium-supported software, and perhaps add a separate section on OSes that are being ported to non-Itanium platforms.--NapoliRoma (talk) 05:31, 14 May 2015 (UTC)
Similarly, this sentence doesn't seem to belong in the "software" section and should probably be moved to another part of the article:
- In late September 2012, NEC announced a return from IA64 to the previous NOAH line of proprietary mainframe processors, now produced in a quad-core variant on 40 nm, called NOAH-6.
--NapoliRoma (talk) 16:06, 14 May 2015 (UTC)
External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to 3 external links on Itanium. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}}
after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}}
to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
- Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20110720155941/http://www.eetimes.eu/18302255 to http://www.eetimes.eu/18302255
- Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20071014061746/http://www.theinquirer.net:80/default.aspx?article=33115 to http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=33115
- Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20061126193800/http://www.byteandswitch.com/document.asp?doc_id=81342 to http://www.byteandswitch.com/document.asp?doc_id=81342
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.
An editor has reviewed this edit and fixed any errors that were found.
- If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
- If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.
Cheers.—cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 10:43, 27 February 2016 (UTC)
- Two of them just moved and I restored them; the Byte and Switch one appears to be gone, but the Wayback Machine version works. Guy Harris (talk) 19:59, 27 February 2016 (UTC)
External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Itanium. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
- Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20160303215640/http://h20341.www2.hp.com/integrity/w1/en/systems/integrity-systems-overview.html?jumpid=ex_R11294_us/en/large/tsg/go_integrity to http://h20341.www2.hp.com/integrity/w1/en/systems/integrity-systems-overview.html?jumpid=ex_R11294_us/en/large/tsg/go_integrity
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{Sourcecheck}}
).
This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
- If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
- If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.
Cheers.—cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 15:47, 11 July 2016 (UTC)
Itanium was developed by Digital Equipment Corporation, not HP.
The Itanium processor was developed at Digital Equipment Corp. in the late '80s. DEC was acquired by Compaq in 1998, which in turn was acquired by HP in 2002. So Hewlett Packard acquired, but did not develop the Itanium processor. The article does not mention DEC at all and should. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mberman54 (talk • contribs) 11:53, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
- You're confusing Alpha with Itanium. Guy Harris (talk) 17:51, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
- No, Harris, you are wrong! EPIC VLIW architecture was really developed at DEC, alongside with DEC Alpha Team. HP once developed their PaRISC 2.0 to compete with it. Later both IA-64 and Alpha were bought by HP, they found Intel as their semi power support, and further development on that architecture is done by Intel only rather than HP. So Intel named IA-64 as Itanium Processor Architecture. -- Aaron Janagewen — Preceding unsigned comment added by 221.9.19.22 (talk) 00:18, 7 February 2017 (UTC)
- Wrong.
- Itanium - research project started in 1989, PA-WideWord by 1993, 1999 paper from HP on EPIC, instruction set manual released in 1999, Merced released in 2001.
- DEC - purchased by Compaq in 1998, Compaq purchased by HP in 2002.
- I.e., IA-64 was well under way long before HP bought Compaq.
- Without a citation from a reliable source, I will not believe any claim that IA-64 was developed at DEC with no HP involvement. Guy Harris (talk) 02:14, 7 February 2017 (UTC)
- Thank you for your reply. Your viewpoint and logic is without problem, but what the thing Compaq DEC research initially was based on VLIW and EPIC principle, and that architecture turns to be IA-64 after acquired by HP. In other words, IA-64 or Itanium architecture was researched much earlier than disclosed to the public. Once again, you are right! -- Aaron Janagewen — Preceding unsigned comment added by 221.9.19.22 (talk) 10:21, 8 February 2017 (UTC)
- If I'm completely right, then whatever VLIW/EPIC research DEC/Compaq may have done, SEPARATELY from HP's research on VLIW/EPIC, did NOT turn out to be IA-64 after HP bought Compaq, given that, as you acknowledge when you say "your viewpoint and logic is without problem" and "you are right", IA-64 existed before HP bought Compaq. Guy Harris (talk) 18:24, 8 February 2017 (UTC)
Let's put everything into one timeline...
- 1982-1985 - DEC: FOUR different RISC development projects. At least two of them (HR-32 and Prism) are 32-bit (hardly VLIW).
- 1986 - HP: Introduces PA RISC processor
- 1988 - DEC abandons Prism, the last of their RISC projects of that era. Dave Cutler goes to work for Microsoft and takes much of the Prism/Mica team from DECwrl with him.
- 1989 - DEC: Begins development on Alpha
- 1989 - HP: Itanium research project started at HP. "The Itanium architecture has its roots in research that began in the 1980s, when HP Labs set out to define an architecture that would converge HP's current lines of computer system products. This resulted in what became known as the PA-RISC architecture (Reduced Instruction Set Computing)."
- 1992 - DEC: Alpha starts shipping (September). Note that there is not a trace of VLIW in Alpha (its instructions are 32 bits long)
- 1993 - HP: Defines PA-WideWord architecture, "the basis of the HP-Intel alliance and the Itanium processor specification (formerly known as IA-64)."
- 1994 - HP: HP partners with Intel to develop Itanium , targets 1998 for first product ship (hah)
- 1998 - Compaq: Compaq acquires DEC, partly to get Alpha tech for their high-end machines
- 1999 - HP: 1999 paper from HP on EPIC
- 1999 - HP: Itanium instruction set manual
- 2001 - Compaq: Decides not to use Alpha after all, sells all Alpha i.p. to Intel
- 2001 - HP: First Itanium (Merced) shipped. Performance is disappointing.
- 2002 - HP: HP acquires Compaq
So it is chronologically impossible for anything done at DEC to have been available to HP/Intel for Itanium development. Nothing from DEC was available to HP until the same year that Merced shipped. ...unless somebody working for DEC leaked the information to HP/Intel, but there's not a hint of VLIW/EPIC in Alpha, nor in (as far as I can find) the four RISC projects at DEC that preceded Alpha. So where's the evidence?
Is it possible that DEC did "early research on EPIC/VLIW" that didn't end up in Itanium? (or Alpha?) Well, it's not physically IMpossible... but given that there's no sign of EPIC/VLIW in Alpha, then if such research existed they must have considered it a dead end. There is no indication of anything like this in the Alpha Architecture book. Nor in the papers from DECUS Symposia back when DEC was hinting at those pre-Alpha RISC processors, or the Alpha itself.
Much more likely is that you've heard about "Epicode", which was part of the Prism architecture. But this had nothing to do with "explicitly parallel" anything. Rather, "Epicode" stood for "extended processor instruction code". This was basically writeable control store in the CPU that defined "extended instructions" and could be loaded via a maintenance operation (somewhat like updating motherboard firmware). This allowed the instruction set to be extended in ways required for a particular OS, and allowed the extended instructions to be implemented in different ways on different models of CPU while presenting the same semantics to the OS. (On my Alpha PC/150 I had to reload the PALcode when changing between VMS and Windows NT.) Alpha included this concept but renamed it "PALcode" (Privileged Architecture Library code). Given the timeline it's even possible that DEC heard of "EPIC" being worked on by HP/Intel and changed their name from Epicode to PALcode to avoid confusion. Jeh (talk) 20:37, 8 February 2017 (UTC)
- Jeh is, of course, 100% correct here. See, for example, Prism System Reference Manual 3.0 for a description of the very-much-RISC-rather-than-VLIW/EPIC Prism, and see section 10 for a description of epicode; see Version 4 of the Alpha Architecture Handbook for the equally-RISC-rather-than-VLIW/EPIC Alpha, and see section 6 for a description of PALcode (which sounds, in some places, like they took the text from the Prism manual section 10). Guy Harris (talk) 08:46, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
- (By the way, Jeh, if you're curious about Titan, one of the other two RISC projects, here's the Titan System Manual. I'll see if I can find anything online about HR32/HR-32 or whatever the Hudson RISC project was called and SAFE.) Guy Harris (talk) 09:00, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
- Oh great, more time sinks. :) (Seriously, thanks!) Jeh (talk) 20:28, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
System Environment should be mentioned!
Both terms, IA-64 and Itanium, could be used to refer to the same thing, but Itanium is a little bit different than IA-64. Because when Intel released Itanium processors, they permit the IA-32 software could also work onto this innovative platform. In Itanium architecture manual, it describes there exist two system environment, Itanium System Environment and IA-32 System Environment, both system environment are booted from the same EFI firmware, and the former is the default. When Itanium processor working under IA-32 system environment, it works like a real x86 processor running the x86 operating systems and x86 software, 16-bit and/or 32-bit. This is quite important thing needs mentioning!