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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by ARegularWisconsinite (talk | contribs) at 19:05, 13 November 2020 (→‎The storm track map). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

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Template:WikiProject Tropical cyclones

Bumping thread for 180 days. NoahTalk 15:27, 30 September 2020 (UTC) I will be adding archive links to the entire article. Please note that the article must be split up in order to do this because of how large it is (ie the tool can't process it). All talk subpages listed below should remain intact for future use with archiving (definitely a must when getting this to GA in the future). NoahTalk 12:16, 16 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Archiving Schedule
  • Every 15 days during the active season
  • Every month outside the active season
  • As needed after May
Archive Links
@Hurricane Noah: Thanks! ~ Destroyeraa🌀 13:58, 16 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Archived again due to extreme activity. NoahTalk 22:28, 20 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Update-Destroyeraa changed archiving to 10 days. --67.85.37.186 (talk) 17:34, 16 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

1886 - 6 or 7?

In the OP it says that this year tied 1886 and 1995 for the most hurricane landfalls on record in the U.S. on one season, but looking at the article on 1886, it says that there were 7 hurricane landfalls in the U.S. that year, not 6. Is there a debate over hurricane 8's track parallel to the TX/Mexico border as a U.S. landfalling hurricane that year or no? It currently states in the article that that storm made a landfall in Texas between Brownsville and Corpus Christi. 98.222.111.10 (talk) 05:47, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Do you mean 1886 Atlantic hurricane season#Hurricane Eight? I think it made landfall in Mexico, but super close to Texas, which later got impacted still as a hurricane. ~ARay10⁽ᵗᵃˡᵏ⁾ 22:07, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, I see. Storm 8 of 1886 was listed as a U.S. hurricane because it brought hurricane-force winds to Texas, but actually made landfall just south of the TX/Mexico border. So, it is a tie. NVM. 98.222.111.10 (talk) 04:38, 30 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Grammar correction. Lol. But it was 1985. 1995 had 2 I think. HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 03:00, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

100 deaths in one village

Sad to say this. 100 deaths in one village from eta https://de.reuters.com/article/storm-eta-guatemala/storm-eta-buries-150-homes-in-guatemalan-village-killing-100-army-idINKBN27M2FW — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.18.109.93 (talk) 18:38, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The Eta death toll is 181? Do you want us to update it now? Or did we already update it? --HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 22:13, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hyperactive

Now can we put up hyperactive in the lead? Also, Eta-wise, we should put "deadly" (I weep the 400 people that were murdered by these terrible tropical cyclones and the thousands more who lost their homes). 🐔 Chicdat Bawk to me! 11:09, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

What? I thought the death toll was 235! --HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 16:32, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It's now 250+, I think Chicdat means everyone who passed away from all of the 2020 atlantic hurricanes combined. ~ARay10 :) 18:52, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

ok, I will still oppose this being added for now. If the NHC officially declares this, then fine. Otherwise it’s WP: OR. HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 19:11, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
HurricaneTracker495 Are you referring to the death toll as being original research? The NHC isn't responsible for tracking fatalities of a tropical cyclone during the season. They only mention fatalities in the TCR of a particular storm. Finding reliable news sources, like media outlets from other countries--or even in the US--regarding the death toll of a particular storm is, in fact, not original research. Gumballs678 talk 19:46, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Gumballs678: no the hyperactivity. HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 19:56, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Hyperactivity is defined based on ACE values. My understanding is that, after a rather contentious discussion, it was decided that ACE calculations fall under WP:CALC. TornadoLGS (talk) 20:01, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@HurricaneTracker495: Thank you for clarifying. The NHC won't use the term "hyperactive" because NOAA doesn't. The highest threshold for a season's activity is "extremely active". I don't actually know where hyperactive came about. Gumballs678 talk 20:04, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
10+ hurricanes, 5+ major hurricanes and an ACE of 153+. This season is hyperactive, but post season reanalysis could change that(like if Epsilon is found to have only been cat 2). HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 20:05, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
It could, but we'd have to wait for the actual analysis to make that change before downgrading. That's looking less likely since we will likely have Theta and possibly Iota before long. TornadoLGS (talk) 20:07, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

10+ hurricanes, 5+ major hurricanes and an ACE of 153+. This season is hyperactive, but post season reanalysis could change that(like if Epsilon is found to have only been cat 2). HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 20:05, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hyperactive is an unofficial term not used by either the NHC or NOAA. But it can be equated to NOAA's "extremely active", which has the same thresholds as Wikipedia does for hyperactivity in terms of ACE. With that, though, a season does not have to meet all three requirements in order to be hyperactive. It has to have an ACE of 153 and then at least either 9 hurricanes or 5 major hurricanes. I think in order to avoid confusion, we just leave the season as "extremely active" rather than hyperactive. Gumballs678 talk 20:11, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
In that case we should use "extremely active" as "hyperactive" would indeed appear to be OR. TornadoLGS (talk) 20:14, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
9? I thought it was 10 ! But hyperactive yeah is OR. Extremely active does not equal hyperactive however. Many seasons(like last year) were extremely active and nowhere near hyperactive.
Hyperactive and extremely active do "equate" each other. 2019 meets the qualifications of "above average" but not "extremely active". The only years in the 2010s that actually meet extremely active threshold are 2010 and 2017. Gumballs678 talk 21:05, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Extremely active means that they were a lot of tropical storms, while hyperactivity means hat it has a high ACE. --HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 22:12, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Hyperactive isn't the real term, as it was said above, extremely active and hyperactive are the same term, one is the actual scientific term though. 🌀Weatherman27🏈 (chat with me!). 17:57, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Remove hyperactivity from all Wikipedia pages?

I suggest that we remove this from all Wikipedia pages due to WP: OR. Adding a RFC for anyone’s thoughts. HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 20:43, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@TFESS: Yeah, I think the signature got lost when I rephrased my comment. May have been an edit conflict somewhere in there, too. TornadoLGS (talk) 18:21, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Page protection

@Cyclonebiskit: Is page protection until 2021 really necessary? I think pending changed protection is better suited, since all editors can edit, while IP edits are still in check. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 23:03, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ask on his user talk or at WP:RFPP. --HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 23:31, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@HurricaneTracker495: Procedure IMO is that I talk with the protecting admin on the protected page. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 00:20, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Destroyeraa: standard procedure, or at least how I've seen it, is to gradually increase the duration of protection if vandalism resumes soon after protection is dropped. Given that a storm is threatening the US at present, and history has it that vandalism spikes during land threats, I see no reason to drop protection. ~ Cyclonebiskit (chat) 03:33, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Cyclonebiskit: Now that Theta formed, and 2020 is now the most active season, vandalism will probably increase when protection is dropped. Thanks. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 13:57, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 10 November 2020

This is the first time two storms have been active in November since 2001.[1] 74.73.230.232 (talk) 04:48, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done Interesting, but not a proper edit request – must be of the form "please change X to Y". Drdpw (talk) 06:29, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
 Not done Purely trivial. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 13:57, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I don’t think it’s purely trivial. I think that it should be mentioned somewhere in the article. Just my $0.02. I would not implement it without consensus. HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 17:03, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Incorrect opening paragraph

Opening paragraph says 2020 is most active year, but this is not true yet. We now have more named systems than any other year, but 2005 still beats 2020 in total systems formed by one. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:446:400:7f10:88c6:364c:893a:4867 (talk) 06:09, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I have modified the sentence to state: "It is the most active Atlantic hurricane season with regard to number of named tropical or subtropical storms on record." Drdpw (talk) 06:37, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Please refer to Tied with 2005 needs changing and 2020 is No Longer Tied as to why it is the most active year. NotYourFriend 420 (talk) 08:53, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Tropical depressions are still tropical systems. You guys can try justifying it by only including named storms all you want, doesn't change the face that while 2020 has more named storms than any other season, it is still behind 2005 in total systems. Thank you to the user who changed it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:446:400:7f10:8d16:7f2c:6238:c0ce (talk) 04:38, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Now it is the most active in terms of total systems formed! LOL!ChessEric (talk · contribs) 17:49, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Force Thirteen

It seems, this year, we've seen an increase more edits from well-meaning but misinformed editors changing the intensities of hurricanes to the estimates from Force Thirteen. It's starting to become a nuisance. I think we should put a hidden note next to intensities along the lines of This wind speed comes from official reports of the National Hurricane Center, not Force Thirteen. It should probably only go on articles where multiple Force Thirteen fans have made such edits (such as Hurricane Lorenzo (2019), though (see WP:BEAN). While I was tempted to be bold on this, I wanted to test the waters and see if others might implement this differently. TornadoLGS (talk) 18:54, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

We've tried hidden notes before, but many people ignore them and change things anyway. ForceThirteen is just a nuisance in general. ~ Cyclonebiskit (chat) 19:00, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Yes indeed they are, on @Destroyeraa:'s talk page, we have tried to get the point across that Force 13 is not a reliable source for information to a user, but they can't seem to get that through their head, and they are being quite the nuisance, but yeah, these F13 edits are getting tiresome, even if they are in good-faith. 🌀Weatherman27🏈 (chat with me!). 19:22, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Cyclonebiskit: Can you please protect my talk page (semi)? The editor is really annoying. Thanks! ~ Destroyeraa🌀 19:24, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think that editor will be a problem, since they've agreed not to add F13's content, even if they disagree. But we do have a lot of people who either follow F13 and not the NHC, or don't realize that the NHC's info trumps F13's. TornadoLGS (talk) 19:46, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
WP:WikiProject Tropical cyclones/Force Thirteen ~ Destroyeraa🌀 19:53, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, that is true, I thought it was worth mentioning as this section was created right after that discussion took place. I have a strong feeling that it is both, based on what I have seen from editors, and also from other sites besides Wikipedia. 🌀Weatherman27🏈 (chat with me!). 19:54, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Force Thirteen always makes bad estimates and isn’t a reliable source. I do watch them often but I have to agree it shouldn’t be used for Wikipedia. We need to do much more action on these kinds of edits. Robloxsupersuperhappyface (talk) 20:30, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Robloxsupersuperhappyface: Well said; I created a project page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Tropical cyclones/Force Thirteen. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 20:53, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Theta

I have made a draft for Theta if anybody wants to edit it. It is located at Draft:Subtropical Storm Theta (2020) and is nearly finished. Robloxsupersuperhappyface (talk) 20:33, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, @Robloxsupersuperhappyface: though I don't think it's necessary to have the year, since it is the only storm of that name. Also, @Floridaball: anyone who creates a draft should communicate that they have done so, as two separate drafts were created for this storm. TornadoLGS (talk) 20:45, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@TornadoLGS, yeah since Floridaball already created the draft without my knowing I had to do that. However, I will be able to remove the year since its now Tropical Storm Theta. Robloxsupersuperhappyface (talk) 21:28, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Theta needs to make some kind of an impact for it to have an article, records can easily be mentioned in a sentence or two. - Knowledgekid87 (talk) 21:34, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I think they're creating the draft now, in the event that it does bring impacts to at least the Azores. Can't say for certain if that will happen, yet. Gumballs678 talk 21:44, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
It looks like Theta will stay well south of the Azores; though as of this morning (Wednesday), Madeira is within the cone for early-Saturday. Given that Theta's impact there will likely amount to less than the impact Epsilon recently had on Bermuda, the likelihood that this storm will warrant an article is very slim. Drdpw (talk) 15:52, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Yep! I agree, but they probably created the draft assuming that it may bring impacts to the Azores. We'll have to keep watching, but I agree with you on that Theta may end up along the same road as Epsilon. Gumballs678 talk 18:50, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Why is the Geostationary image for Theta not changeable? Can't we change that to the newest satellite imagery for 11-13? If it is there for a reason please let me know as I am uncertain at this point. If there is no reason to keep it shouldn't we update the image to the latest available?SingingZach (talk) 16:31, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I was wondering the same thing, I myself would rather not mess with those kind of things because usually one person handles them pretty well and I trust them. ARegularWisconsinite🌀 (talk) 16:45, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Eta deaths

Just wondering why etas deaths have dropped one hundered? Looks like it’s the landslide one, was it just estimates? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.18.109.93 (talk) 21:15, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

No they are confirmed, rose it again Nickrotat (talk) 21:47, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The most recent sources for Guatemala state 42 deaths and 100+ missing, the earlier sources incorrectly lumped the missing into deaths. ~ Cyclonebiskit (chat) 23:09, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

261 or 153?

Make up your mind. Pick a reliable source and stick with it. I’m tired of seeing it change. HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 01:02, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@HurricaneTracker495: it's 153. People are adding outdated information regarding Guatemala. Initial reports stated 150 deaths but this included missing people. The latest I've found is 42 confirmed fatalities and 100+ missing. ~ Cyclonebiskit (chat) 02:25, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Not true. It's now 44 dead in Guatemala. --HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 02:40, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 11 November 2020

there are now 30 named storms.... soon to be 31. Big man bry (talk) 17:46, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

What? there's only 29, you may want to recount. Gex4pls (talk) 18:21, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
 Not done – At the present time there are only 29 named storms. Also, next time, please present your edit request in the form "please change X to Y". Cheers. Drdpw (talk) 18:34, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I think they mean 30 tropical depressions, because TD 10 didn’t strengthen, but we use tropical storms. They are also refering to Invest 98L soon to be Tropical Depression 31(I hope). Will welcome user immediately. HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 20:18, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Use of subsequently x 20, use of Laura x 16

None of this is needed. Every time I make them carefully re-worded some editor says I don't speak English. It's daft! Let me help this article out.- Adam37 Talk 22:45, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Huh? I never said that. I just said the grammar was off.ChessEric (talk · contribs) 22:49, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Tbh the grammar was a bit off Adam37, as I said on your talk page. Laura is a storm name, and 16x isn't too much. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 22:54, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Add Theta to timeline

already added. HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 12:58, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

On the timeline picture right after the lead, Theta isn't on there. I don't know how to add it, so could someone else please do it? Thank you. 𝙲𝚘𝚍𝚒𝚗𝚐𝙲𝚢𝚌𝚕𝚘𝚗𝚎 ᴛᴀʟᴋ 04:11, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Someone already did it... you can close this now. 𝙲𝚘𝚍𝚒𝚗𝚐𝙲𝚢𝚌𝚕𝚘𝚗𝚎 ᴛᴀʟᴋ 04:14, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Hurricane Epsilon article??

Close again. Consensus will not develop for an article to be created. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 17:06, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Look, I know this discussion has already been talked about and I know most people were against the article, but I personally think Epsilon deserves at least some kind of article. And if this Non-notable storm gets an article than why not Epsilon? reasons I think it should.

  1. It went under rapid intensification where you would least expect.
  2. Farthest east storm to go under rapid intensification this late in the year.
  3. Pretty much surprised everyone who tracked it.
  4. Made it to an unusually high latitude.
  5. Have you seen the photos from inside the eye?? They would look good in an article in my opinion.
  6. Had a similar IR look to Dorian.
  7. Was a major hurricane.
  8. Was a pretty decent sized storm.
  9. Was a Greek storm

Now look, I know that 3, 5, 6, 7, 8, and 9 mean nothing about having an article but make the storm a little more notable in my opinion. I also know that the rest is and can be said in the season article. I also don't want to argue with anyone here and if most people oppose an article I will not mention this again. Cyclonetracker (talk) 21:21, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Question on number of storms

2005 Atlantic hurricane season says "28 tropical or subtropical storms recorded" (+3 depressions = 31). Currently, this article says "30 tropical or subtropical cyclones", but are we not at 29 tropical or subtropical + 2 depressions (TD10 and TD31)? Chris857 (talk) 15:05, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. I see this article just changed to say 31. But still, the 2020 and 2005 articles seem inconsistent in this regard. Chris857 (talk) 15:06, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Use depressions over storms

I think that now we are tied with 2005 as the most active. Comment below, but I think we should use depressions over storms. Because all tropical storms are depressions and it’s the true amount of systems. We had two depressions that didn’t develop as of this writing(TD 10 and TD 31.) 2005 had 3(TD 10, 2005 Atlantic hurricane season#Tropical Depression Nineteen#TD 19, and SD 22). HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 15:26, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thirty-One

We are now at our 31st tropical cyclone in the Atlantic this year and I have made a draft for it anybody wants to check it out. It is under the name “Draft:Tropical Depression Thirty-One (2020)”. Robloxsupersuperhappyface (talk) 15:27, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hurricane Eta needs condensing

That one section is like article size of some smaller articles(Zeta 2005). Can we condense eta’s size in this article? HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 15:35, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Destroyeraa did so already.ChessEric (talk · contribs) 17:55, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
But I don’t think he did enough. HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 18:03, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
You guys can help. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 18:54, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 13 November 2020

I am requesting an edit where it says that is is the fifth consecutive season that was above average since 2016; the word fifth is misspelled, thats all! GoldGamer32 (talk) 17:17, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

 Done–The edit was made by ARegularWisconsinite.ChessEric (talk · contribs) 17:56, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Record early formations regarding Theta and Thirty-One

I believe that even though Theta (and probably Thirty-One soon, into Iota) are the first time there are the twenty-ninth and thirtieth named storms in the Atlantic, they shouldn't be included in the table under seasonal summary, since they didn't break any records with regard to being the earliest 29th and 30th named storms, since there were never any others. However, if this isn't popular, could we at least agree to put a note that says they are the earliest by virtue of being the only ones? JoeMT615 (talk) 17:29, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose That was the way the list was on the record page before 2020 tied 2005. Records were set here because no other storm exist to break that record. The removal isn't necessary imo.ChessEric (talk · contribs) 17:59, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose I agree with ChessEric. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cyclonetracker (talk • contribs) 18:11, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose I agree too. Even if they are the only 29th and (soon to be) 30th named storms, they still broke the record. HurricaneIcy|Talk 🍂 18:38, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The storm track map

We need to update the 2020 Atlantic hurricane season map. There were more paths for Hurricane Eta and Tropical Storm Theta. Seventyfiveyears (talk) 18:59, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I think someone is responsible for making those, I don't know how to but Theta is still active. ARegularWisconsinite🌀 (talk) 19:05, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
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