Talk:Cadastre

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Runhold section

What's a "runhold section": is this a typo, or just an obscure term? -- Anon 18:22, 17 November 2005 (UTC) what about the roman survey of land for taxation purposes? shouldn't this have it's own article!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I suspect it's a US-specific term. Looks like Mikeh removed it in his edit here http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Cadastre&diff=next&oldid=151548622. 132.244.246.25 08:17, 24 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Bible as cadastre

I noticed that many Zionist Jews in Israel interpret the Bible as if it were some kind of cadastre for government property and related religious legislation. Although that might seem unusual, it is a unique interpretation for a unique document, which is nevertheless rejected by many non-Zionist and Secular Jews. ADM (talk) 11:26, 30 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

== Please note that capitastratum is neither in Lewis and Short's Latin Dictionary nor in Souter's Glossary of Later Latin. It should not be cited unless authoritative evidence is found of its existence. "Capitastratum" is found in the (rather poor) Oxford English Dictionary entry "cadastre" without any authority being cited for it. An excellent, accurate definition of the word (more restrictive than the Wikipedia entry) is supplied by The Free Dictionary (probably from the American Heritage Dictionary).

    The source of the term is from late Greek, a tax term of the Byzantine Empire, via late medieval Italy. "Capita" has nothing to do with it; neither does any poll tax. The operative prefix is "cata-".

The late and probably earlier Roman Empire (perhaps even the Republic) had cadastres, but not under that name. One applicable late Roman word for such records is "polyptych", which continued to be used for such records in the early Middle Ages. There is also a single citation of "capitularius" in this sense (Gregory of Tours). Other words are also attested. A good medieval example of an early cadastre is "Domesday Book".

    It is standard practice in scholarly works to apply the term "cadastre" to Roman records and early medieval ones regardless of the fact that it's anachronistic in Roman and most of medieval history; see, e.g., Andre Piganiol, Le Cadastre d'Orange. The word, best entrenched in French, is used generically and should be understood in this sense.
    The entire Wikipedia entry probably deserves to be revised, with much being taken out as too restrictive and misleading. "Cadastre" is a generic term, as well shown by the Free Dictionary listing, mentioned above.130.132.120.12 (talk) 13:05, 24 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Disputed etymology

Please see: http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=cadastre&searchmode=none Gamillscheg dismisses capitastrum as the etymology of the word cadastre. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.44.120.114 (talk) 18:41, 10 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Scott in Seeing Like a State

In the section "cadastral map", reference is made to James Scott. Why the term, "tangible [to outsiders]"? The term Scott uses throughout the work is "legible" and I believe this makes far more sense in relation to a map. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 118.209.177.172 (talk) 04:05, 25 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Bureau of Land Management

I was surprised to read, "In the United States, Cadastral Survey within the Bureau of Land Management maintains records of all public lands. Such surveys often require detailed investigation of the history of land use, legal accounts, and other documents." While I expect that BLM keeps track of federal land, my experience is that Counties (or Parishes) are the arbiters of most private land. At least that's were my title and deed are filed and maintained, and their GIS system is the only one I know to obtain a Cadastre map of my neighborhood. I suggest that the statement be changed to something like "... BLM maintains records of all Federal lands." If something general can be said about local title records being kept by municipalities or counties are common throughout the world, that would be less parochial.

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Longueuil-quartier du parc des Semis vue aérienne et plan cadastral - 2020-11-21.png

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Grids worldwide

Mention what other countries than Canada and the United States also use grid system for cadastral surveys. Jidanni (talk) 12:26, 11 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

U.S. marine cadastre

Section Cadastre#United States mentions a "marine cadastre", which despite the name does not seem to adhere the the Cadastre#Definition, as it seeks to map "(infra)structure, vessel traffic and wind power", not land parcels. fgnievinski (talk) 18:53, 28 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Fgnievinski: When reintroducing, I tried to address this by emphasizing "structure". Some are on the shore, and the rest can arguably fit the definition if we use the sense of "land" as geography that is owned.

"Vessel traffic and wind power" doesn't. But definitions change. US government agency NOAA is as authoritative in English as the (UN-recognized but NGO) International Federation of Surveyors. Yes, "Marine Cadastre" confused me, but I assumed the modern meaning broadened.

"A marine cadastre is different to the traditional land-based cadastres."^[1] The UN^[2] and geographic information system company ArcGIS^[3] also use "Marine Cadastre". These are from Googling cadastre at sea, whereas "marine cadastre" returns 17,800. Perhaps this information can be split into another section until someone writes enough for an article. 142.113.140.146 (talk) 21:14, 28 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not disputing the existence of a "marine cadastre". But the example given is not representative, it degenerates the narrower concept of "cadastre" into a synonym of the broader concept of "mapping". Plus, it's poorly sourced, to a website with not much discussion of its selection criteria -- it could well be called a "marine SDI" or a "marine geodatabase". If marine cadestre is to be mentioned, it should be defined in relation to marine land rights and sourced to academic publications, such as:

Lots of content also from FIG: [4]

fgnievinski (talk) 02:23, 29 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I now lean towards removing "U.S. marine cadastre" as you suggested. The example I reintroduced wasn't the best.

Instead, I'll create a stub section with those references. It addresses both my concerns of my uncertain time commitment, and wanting that sole "marine cadastre" mention because it taught me those exist. 142.113.140.146 (talk) 02:34, 29 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I removed the example and added a rough draft stub. I only skimmed the abstracts, so editing is welcome. 142.113.140.146 (talk) 02:59, 29 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@142.113.140.146 Fair enough, thank you for the rewrite. I've mentioned two other non-conventional cadasters. fgnievinski (talk) 04:52, 29 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

[1] ttps://www.bvz-abdm.be/sites/default/files/news/attachments/marinecadastre-paper-general_rights_under_unclos-property_rights-registration-summary.pdf

[2] ttps://unece.org/fileadmin/DAM/hlm/sessions/docs2015/day_2_presentations/2.6c.3b__Rik_Wouters_Marine_Cadastre.pdf

[3] ttps://www.arcgis.com/home/item.html?id=abe9dd73377b48b69817e74ad3ee739f

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