Talk:Dara Ó Briain/Archive 1

Archive 1

Merchandise

Why oh why does he have no CDs, books, DVDs? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.164.3.90 (talk • contribs) 08:47, July 15, 2005

Sexual orientation

Is Dara gay? - Anon —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.192.232.88 (talk • contribs) 18:30, April 18, 2006

I doubt it. There was some controversy over a joke he told as host of Have I Got News For You about Elton John which revolved around his homosexuality, and the way he talks about it (well, when I saw him at Derby) seemed... how can I put this? He didn't talk about it as though he was part of it. That's a clumsy way of describing it, but it's late. 80.6.98.250 00:08, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

Dara is very much heterosexual, and is engaged to a lovely lady! If he were gay, he might have been a little more clued-in about how unfortunate the Elton John joke was. (The joke was that Elton John approved of the boy who plays Billy Elliot because "he can see a little bit of himself in him". i.e. the joke was that gay people are latent pedophiles. An unfortunate blot on an otherwise fine career. In his defence, it wasn't his joke, he was just reading it off the autocue and in the moment he probably didn't realise the ramifications of what he was saying.) --88.110.192.186 10:12, 18 March

2007 (UTC)

Yes, didn't he marry in 2006? I think he did to Susan, a doctor. Unwisely (talk) 22:13, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

Birth date/place?

Okay, this article [1] pretty much confirms that he was born in 1971, but the birthplace is not so simple. I'd seen a couple of sources which described him as "Dublin-born" (I've already sent all this info into IMDB) but this [2] article describes him as "Wicklow-born". Anyone know which is correct? Crisso 17:27, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

Crisso, this article (http://living.scotsman.com/tv.cfm?id=1132792006) shows his d.o.b., if you scroll down to the end, as 4th February 1972, and I think this year must be correct as on tour this spring he's said he's 34. 1971 would make him 35. Articles in Irish papers say he was brought up in Little Bray, Wicklow.{(User: Paperdoll}] —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.93.21.102 (talk • contribs) 06:13, August 21, 2006

Good work. I've promptly updated his entry and have already sent in a correction to IMDB. Crisso 17:22, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

most people from wicklow are born in wexford or dublin, but that is not what the phrase really means. get me? Owwmykneecap 03:59, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

I presume you are referring to the location of the maternity hospitals? Bray is technically over the border in Co. Wicklow (allowing taxi drivers to extort you) but is a suburb of Dublin. This might cause some of the confusion. -- Blorg 16:24, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Spelling of his name

The opening credits of The Panel give his name as "Dara O Bríain". That's a fada over the first "i" but none over the "O". Anybody have any thoughts on this? Ian Cheese 17:13, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

I ve seen the fada over the o in some name, not in others so i dont know. i had come here to see if the was an unnessesary apostrophe, but there was not, i fixed brendan o carrol, cos he was the first i could think of, there should be a wiki wide purging of the aposropheOwwmykneecap 04:00, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

I will be moving back the Brendan O'Carroll article: you are mistaken. If the English language form of a name like this is used, then it should be O'Brien (with an apostrophe). If it's in Irish use Ó Briain (no apostrophe, but with a fada over the O. Ian Cheese 12:42, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

In a video on youtube, Dara Ó Briain comments about how he likes the fada over the O, but I'm not entirely sure as to whether he is just playing along or not. Lessthanthree (talk) 03:57, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

Briain: ia was once written as ía, as this is how the diphthong sounds. Maybe the sound made the person represent his name that way. There is a also a great deal of dislike of name in Gaelic in Ireland, so the dropping of the sineadh fada on the o is not surprising. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 159.134.220.36 (talk • contribs) 13:58, June 27, 2007

Speak for yourself. If any are thus guilty, it's the undereducated peasants with aspirations who have that 'great deal of dislike of name in Gaelic in Ireland'- and you've a great use of the Queen's English, by the way. Meanwhile, the educated Irish continue to send their children to Gaelscoileanna, while the peasantry call their children 'John' and 'Sarah'. 86.42.74.123 02:59, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

This is both unsubstantiated and untrue. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.41.114.140 (talk • contribs) 22:25, September 29, 2007

Ehhhh...

What's with the "Ehhh..." that he seems to insert at the end of almost every sentence now? I'm sure he didn't used to do it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.242.154.119 (talk) 20:26, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Pronunciation

Is it really /dæræ o briən/? I'd have expected something more like /dɑrə o briən/ I'm not really familiar with him, but most dialects of English don't allow for lax vowels at the end of words. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.216.19.87 (talk) 11:08, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

It might be the Irish pronunciation though. --Peti (me) 13:19, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

Da-ra oh breen. Ceoil (talk) 22:40, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

Exclusively Irish?

Does he hold dual citizenship to the UK? I've seen him refer to himself as "British" at least twice on Mock the Week. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.152.8.110 (talk) 17:11, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

I think he is exclusively Irish, as far as i know, as he is an Irish speaker and spent most of his life(if not al) in Ireland, but i could be wrong Jimjom (talk) 14:30, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Ara sure he must be British by now: sure hasn't he had heaps of success. A successful Paddy? Jaysas, we can't be having that now. 78.16.98.134 (talk) 00:31, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

"Most energetic man on TV"

I removed this rubbish: "He is generally regarded as the most energetic Irishman on TV". What a load of crap, all he does is sit in a chair and wave his arms about. Feel free to express YOUR views. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.209.46.103 (talk) 16:11, 21 August 2008 (UTC) Also, the part that says hes is the most succesfull irish comedian in the UK since the tgurn of the century can not be put there. What idiot counts Daras agency as a reliable source for that type of info? Of course they are going to say something like that! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.194.186.206 (talk) 17:41, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Funniest quiz show host?

I've heard rumours flying around in real life and the internet he's been voted 2008's funniest quiz show host? Can anyone confirm that either he was, or even such a title exists and if so who owns it?84.92.16.13 (talk) 22:34, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Credit Today Awards

Dara will be hosting the Credit Today Awards this coming May. I think this is relevant to Dara’s Wikipedia page. Is Dara sending out a signal that he supports the questionable activities of the debt collection industry in the UK and that such activities are worthy of this type of celebration? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.147.105.237 (talk) 13:04, 28 March 2009 (UTC)

Probably not, I would assume he just got booked for it, a lot of comedians do awards shows and stuff like that for the money basically.I don't think we can make any sort of judgements about him based on that. HIGNFY14 (talk) 22:58, 18 October 2009 (UTC)

Brilliant, brilliant - brilliant

Watch this superb interview by Manchán Magan with Dara in the Irish. Manchán was giving out to him for taking the soup and dropping the Ó when he first arrived on that troublesome island between Ireland and France. Dara got fierce thick and recounted how his people drove the Vikings from Ireland at the Battle of Clontarf in 1014AD but Manchán, fair play to him, wasn't having any of it. Dara finally repented - "Is mo fada é!" and said he'll no longer take the soup and that fada will have pride of place over in Britain as well as Ireland until the day he dies! Great stuff Dara (and Manchán!). 86.44.18.40 (talk) 15:19, 6 July 2009 (UTC)

Gin epidemic -> Gin craze

I can't fix this myself, as anonymous edits are unwanted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.195.249.57 (talk) 00:22, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

 Done Thanks for spotting it! -- Timberframe (talk) 13:50, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Gaelscoil

Technically Coláiste Eoin is a Gaelcholáiste not a Gaelscoil. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Rinagaeilge (talk • contribs) 17:31, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Greyhound racing

This section seems to be being used as a WP:COATRACK for a general discussion about some problems in Irish Greyhound Racing which have nothing to do with Ó Briain. Subject to comments from other editors, I think the time has come to rewrite it so as to be relevant to the subject of this article, and no other. The basis for this is that attaching all this to Ó Briain seems to be imputing some blame to him for these problems, and that is impermissible, per one of our major policies. Rodhullandemu 21:14, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

I have tried to write the piece from a neutral view point and the issues outlined about Greyhound racing are fully relevent to DO'B PSYSTAT —Preceding unsigned comment added by Psystat (talk • contribs) 22:54, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

I'm wondering what, for example, "The programme was also perceived to be good publicity for Greyhound racing", even if sourced, tells the reader about O'Briain. That's just extraneous detail, to my view. I think all we need to say is (a) O Briain was a member of a greyhound racing syndicate (b) one of their dogs had to be put down (c) any comments he made about that incident. Anything else is unnecessary. Rodhullandemu 23:01, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

Maybe I have meandered from the point slightly but the facts are that both DOB and the BBC are being elusive about the incident, the programme has been perceived as good for greyhound racing and tourism in the ROI so I felt this detail would reinforce the article —Preceding unsigned comment added by Psystat (talk • contribs) 23:12, 17 February 2010 (UTC) Have since made the point clearer how DOB'S presence in the programme could be perceived as good for Greyhound racing, hope this is clearer now (Psystat (talk) 20:22, 19 February 2010 (UTC))

No, it isn't. Please look at WP:COATRACK and WP:BLP. I have spent more time than I realistically have available to remove poorly-sourced, unsourced, and speculation from this section, and when it comes down to the handful of reliable sources that exist, in no way do they support the whole section as written, as it was at best an attempt to combine sources to influence the reader. Sorry, but Wikipedia is not for advocacy, and that sort of editing does not belong here. As it is currently, I think it fairly represents the situation and has its appropriate weight. Rodhullandemu 01:27, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

Ironically, your drastic re write of the section appears to contain the same faults as you purport that mine had. You state O'Briain was very upset about his dog and disbanded the syndicate. This has only been reported in a tabloid article so we cannot be sure if this really is the case. [[[User:Psystat|Psystat]] (talk) 22:04, 21 February 2010 (UTC)]

It may be a tabloid (which only refers to its size, not its reliability), but I think it sums up the gist of the situation without introducing unnecessary material which could easily be misread as (a) blaming O Briain for the situation, (b) indirectly accusing him of not caring or (c) a general essay on the state of greyhound racing in Ireland. If you like, I will seek a third opinion from an editor who will examine the whole picture and offer advice. Meanwhile, I have left precise reasons for removing content in my edit summaries; if you wish to take issue with any of them, please leave the diffs below. Rodhullandemu 22:13, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

The fact of the matter is that DOB's thoughts concerning the incident have only been reported in a newspaper article so as I said we cannot be sure these really are DOB's views. who's to say a new syndicate has not been formed, I doubt that this is the syndicates first casualty. According to correspondence from the BBC to myself DOB was fully behind his dog appearing in the show (Section of correspondence from BBC to myself: To some, Greyhound racing is an important part of Irish entertainment and rural pursuits and Dara, who was showing Griff and Rory a slice of Ireland from his own perspective, decided it was a perfect opportunity for Griff and Rory to watch Snip in action.) Incidentally the BBC did not confirm the death of the dog and refussed to comment on it It is perfectly clear to say DOB had some part in the incident, he owned the dog and was aware of the risks. He has promoted the sport and must be fully aware of the welfare issuses involved. DOB is a very popular figure and his likeable intelligent manner contrasts dramatically from other celebrity greyhound owners, his participation in the sport must surely have been of benefit to it. His indirect endorsment might well have influenced new recruits to the sport. A balanced view of the whole incident therefore needs to be displayed. I would be gratful if you could get further opinion on this, I am not trying to write an essay on greyhound racing in the ROI but feel the full story should be aired [[[User:Psystat|Psystat]] (talk) 23:06, 21 February 2010 (UTC)]

I will raise this at the WP:3O board; your initial comments above indicate a campaigning point of view, and letters between yourself and the BBC, since they have not been published, are the very essence of original research. You seem conveniently to forget that O Briain was only one of fifteen in the syndicate, and I don't think you've made a case for him alone to shoulder any public obloquy for the dog's accidental death; hence the repeated references above to WP:COATRACK, which I again urge you to consider. Rodhullandemu 23:17, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

I agree with Rodhullandemu. We should stick to the what the publish RS say, and not give this undue prominence or make unsupported statements (that he could have started a new syndicate, for example). It was also very poorly written and overwhelmed the article.Verbal chat 13:57, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

Third opinion

Hi, here is your requested third opinion:

• The greyhound section was indeed essay-like and should have been edited for tone and length.
• It was more an inappropriate level of detail and focus that was the problem than any blatant synthesis that I saw.
• The section (or paragraph) shouldn't be too long, we must keep undue weight in mind, and weight the section appropriate to the amount of coverage it drew and how important it was to the subject in question.
• I can't easily read the Irish Mail source since it's offline, but if the reaction to this dog's death lead to a statement from the DSPCA, and the prominence of the death was directly due to O' Briain's fame, then it is fine to include a mention of it. Any such mention should be encyclopedic and brief.
• Rodhullandemu, as a general comment not necessarily related to this dispute but related to this article and talk page, please review the policy on article ownership, don't revert due to mere lack of consensus, and the page on wikilawyering. Reverting good faith additions should be rare, and looking through the page history, you seem to be doing this quite a lot. As well, endeavor to use less abrasive edit summaries. When discussing changes like this, try not to barrage people with tangentially related policies and guidelines like you did above.

Hope this helps- Gigs (talk) 14:23, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

Would you like to back up those accusations of ownership and wikilawyering (both forms of disruption) with some evidence? Or would you rather retract your unfounded accusations? Being fair and balanced doesn't mean criticising both sides, especially if you have to manufacture those accusations. Verbal chat 14:33, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

Also, in the thread above the reasons for the trimming of the section were spelt out, therefore the advice in the essay WP:DRNC was followed, so please explain the relevance of that comment. Following policy to improve the project is not wikilawyering and never disruptive, especially when the article is a WP:BLP where unsourced or poorly sourced material should be removed and then discussed. Thanks, Verbal chat 14:46, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

I have no desire to argue about it in length, it's just my opinion as an uninvolved editor. Citing 8 different policies in a single reply is why I brought up wikilawyering. Abrasive edit summaries discourage polite discussion about an article. Unsourced material should only be reverted if it's contentious or dubious. I have no desire to be "fair and balanced", except that I don't think established editors should get a pass on behavior. Gigs (talk) 14:51, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

If you refuse to justify your accusations of disruptive behaviour please strike them. I see no evidence of wikilawyering, merely correct identification of relevant policies. Perhaps a mention of BLP would have been enough, but providing more information is no requirement to censure. The pointer to WP:DRNC seems pointless as it was followed, while the accusation of ownership is equally unjustified. This is a BLP and Rodhullandemu went beyond what was required in improving the section rather than just removing it, as it is both poorly sourced and contentious. Please remember to WP:AGF and not make unfounded accusations. I also agree that we should encourage a positive atmosphere, which is why I find your unfounded accusations of disruptive behaviour against an editor in good standing and acting correctly so objectionable. Verbal chat 14:56, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

I will strike only DRNC, as it is less relevant. I didn't realize this section was created prior to the edit summaries asking to "discuss first". Gigs (talk) 15:13, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

I see no merit in your other criticisms of RH&E (who I don't think I know, and this page is also new to me), so I will ask you again to strike them, or to support them with evidence - per policy. Otherwise you are yourself in violation of WP:AGF and other policies, which I wont list as you don't like more than one policy being mentioned. This will be the last request here. RH&E has acted correctly, and we should not criticise editors following policy to the betterment of the encyclopedia. Note the message RH&E left was a template, and it was used correctly, and the comment at the end pointed the editor in question to important policies which could lead to the editor being blocked if they ignored. RH&E is doing them a service by pointing them to the rules in this area. What benefit do unsupported accusations against editors acting in good faith have? Verbal chat 15:20, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

A third opinion is just that. It's my opinion. You are free to disagree with it if you like. I will not strike my opinion because you disagree with it. Asking Rodhullandemu to be mindful of policies and guidelines is not out of line. I am not making "accusations" or we'd be discussing this at a noticeboard, not here. I believe my criticisms are supported by the page histories which you can see as well as I can see. Nothing about my comments implies an assumption of bad faith. Gigs (talk) 15:35, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

You have made unsupported accusations of disruption against an editor acting appropriately and well within norms and policies of wikipedia, and refused to support them after a request. Asking Rodhullandemu to be mindful of policies and guidelines would not be out of line, but that is not what you have done. Discussion moved to your talk page. Verbal chat 16:06, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

Why do you have such a problem with the word reported? Your insistance that this word be deleted portrays a biased view on how O'Brian views the incident Psystat (talk) 13:40, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

College

He didn't go to Trinity, he went to UCD.

13:40, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

Move to Dara O Briain

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved Kotniski (talk) 07:09, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

---

Dara Ó Briain → Dara O Briain — There is considerable inconsistency in how secondary sources spell his name, however this spelling (no apostrophe, no accents) is used consistently on his website, on the covers of his books, etc. me_and (talk) 15:57, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

I was under the impression that the Ó variant was the "correct" version, at least in Gaelic, but as we have numerous sources from the man himself, I support this move. Perhaps mentioning it in the opening paragraph would be wise? NikNaks _{talk - gallery - commons} 12:19, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

O' is definitely incorrect. Ó is the correct Irish form, which he did used to use, but he seems to predominantly use the O form these days (a lot of people use different forms for different situations) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.100.58.51 (talk) 00:15, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Ó is correct, and as the above contributor says O' is definitely incorrect. And the final word on the matter rests with Dara Ó Bríain in this interview (go to 1.56) when he declares "Dara O fada (i.e. Ó) Bríain", repeats it several times and then goes out to a poster and puts the fada over the O. hehe. Now that's what I call definitive evidence for the spelling of his name! Dunlavin Green (talk) 07:40, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Hmm. I'm guessing (I don't speak Irish) he's saying that he uses the name without a fada for us Brits who can't cope with such things, but his proper name has the fada. By my understanding of policy (I've not checked, I'll look shortly), the name should be what he is commonly known as to Wikipedia readers, and regardless of his personal opinions on the matter, the name he is commonly presented with (by his agents if not by himself) has no fada. Essentially, I'm not convinced a foreign language YouTube video overrides all the published material, also by him, which disagrees. me_and (talk) 11:28, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

A couple of policies I believe support the move:

• WP:UCN: "Common usage in reliable sources is preferred to technically correct but rarer forms, whether the official name, the scientific name, the birth name, the original name or the trademarked name."
• WP:UE: "The choice between anglicized and local spellings should follow English-language usage". This, in particular, discounts the above video to me, since that appears to be quite explicitly non-English usage.

--me_and (talk) 12:31, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

The gist is that the presenter is talking about people who drop the fada from their names. Ó/O Briain appears as an example of someone who does. He explains that "the fada is still there" but he took it out because "it's difficult". He took it out, he says, "maybe so that people would be comfortable with a Gaelic name". He reflects on the origins and meaning of the fada over the O (meaning he is a descendent of Brian Boru). He says that after moving to London, with "the bright lights of the West End", he "didn't have the time for the fada". The piece at the end where he puts the fada back over the O strikes me as a humorous redemption piece after he promises to put the fada back on, saying, "It's my fada!"

TBH, I'm not really convinced either way. As you say, it is "common usage" not what is "technically correct" - whether that is "technically correct" according to the rules of grammar or what is "technically correct" according to the precise way that a person spells their stage name. All of the variants appear to be in common use and none are particularly obscure or overly pedantic or technical. Also, there is no conflict with WP:UE: fadas commonly appear on Irish names in English. This is hardly like the difference between Florence and Firenze. (Indeed, "translating" Irish names to English is a particular "no, no".)

Since there is no actual "common name", and little or nothing between the variants, I'd stick with the correct spelling (Dara Ó Briain) and note in the first paragraph that he drops the fada from the Ó for his stage name (per the MOS for bios). All of the other common variants (Dara O Briain and Dara O'Briain) should redirect here. --RA (talk) 20:07, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

I'd not seen WP:IMOS, thanks for pointing that out. Per that page, then, I agree: don't move. me_and 10:45, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.