Talk:Day & Zimmermann

Business?

Passing mentions of sweets wrappers and a sports venue hardly constitute an informative encyclopedic entry. Private company it may be, but such display of reticence suggests it might prefer not to appear in WP--SilasW (talk) 21:16, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Requested Changes

{{edit COI}}

1. 1 REMOVE SENTENCE: Remove the first sentence in the paragraph with the section titled “Involvement in Israel-Palestine conflict,” which states, “Day & Zimmermann is responsible for supplying much of the artillery munitions used by Israel in its ongoing invasion of Gaza.”
2. 2 REMOVE SENTENCE: “The American Friends Service Committee says that Merkava tanks fired M830A1 rounds in a November attack on a UN school in Gaza, and in the attack that killed Hind Rajab, and that serial numbers on shells recovered at the scene suggest that the shells were made by Day & Zimmermann subsidiary Mason & Hanger.”

* Reason for the change: #1. REASON: The first sentence in the paragraph titled, “Involvement in Israel-Palestine conflict”, is incorrect and not backed up by credible sources. US Munitions manufacturers are not supplying munitions to Israel. All arms manufacturers are subject to the Foreign Assistance Act (FAA) of 1961 and The Arms Export Control Act (AECA) of 1976. These acts govern the ability of a manufacturer to supply arms to foreign entities. There are no requests, contracts or approvals for sales by D&Z to Israel, and no listed sources of this information. Contracts are with the US Army. The US Government is supplying US munitions to Israel and those munitions have been produced for decades by many different US manufacturers, including BAE, Boeing and General Dynamics. It cannot be known which or how many have been sent by the individual manufacturers and these manufacturers have no control over transfers of munitions; this is under the control of the Joint Munitions Command (JMC).#2. REASON: The source (and subject) of the second sentence is not a verifiable source based on Wikipedia’s creditable sources. This organization is not a media or news organization but rather a nonprofit advocacy organization with a biased interest per Wikipedia’s policies on sources. The “suggestion” that the shells were made by a company is not acceptable verification. There are no verified sources or verified photographs. In addition, Mason & Hanger was not owned by Day & Zimmermann when shells produced by Mason & Hanger were manufactured.

* References supporting change:

ADDITIONAL CONTEXT: Day & Zimmermann has been one of several contracted managers of US Army plants since the 1940s. Many munitions currently in the US stockpile were manufactured by these plants and manufacturers, and several plant managers have changed by acquisition or award. All were delivered to the US Army along with munitions from many other US Manufacturers. All contracts are with the US Army.

Simple research shows that US manufacturing of munitions has been at very low production levels for decades. Most lines have remained shut down since the end of the cold war and several plants were shut down with the 2005 Base Realignment and Closure Commission (BRACC). The main plants where artillery shells are produced have been at low production levels until the conflict in Ukraine. The current US Army/Department of Defense stockpile was produced over decades for the US Army by multiple US Munitions manufacturers. It cannot be accurately known how many were produced, used, or transferred by any one manufacturer. That is known only to the government. The United States Army's Joint Munitions Command (JMC) manages the country's ammunition plants, and has the responsibility for storing and shipping the ammunition to wherever in the world it is needed. Therefore, the munitions manufactured now and, in the past, and supplied to any US ally, are under the direct control of the US Government through the JMC, not the manufacturers.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/28/middleeast/gaza-us-munitions-rafah-strike-analysis-intl-hnk/index.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/24/us/politics/pentagon-ukraine-ammunition.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arms_Export_Control_Act

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_Assistance_Act

https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/STATUTE-90/pdf/STATUTE-90-Pg729.pdf

136.226.52.244 (talk) 15:54, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

Foreign Assistance Act (FAA) of 1961

https://www.jmc.army.mil/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Munitions_Command

~~~~ 170.85.72.248 (talk) 20:36, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: This request is poorly written and fails to explain its reasoning in a concise manner. Quetstar (talk) 19:57, 4 June 2024 (UTC)