Talk:Freedom (Franzen novel)

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Novels Mid‑importance

	Novels portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Novels, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to novels, novellas, novelettes and short stories on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and contribute to the general Project discussion to talk over new ideas and suggestions.NovelsWikipedia:WikiProject NovelsTemplate:WikiProject Novelsnovel articles
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Plot summary

The plot summary is absolutely dreadful! I don't like plot summaries myself and refuse to touch them but this one really needs some attention. 81.178.38.169 (talk) 15:23, 27 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed. What does "unusually young and pretty" mean? Nothing. Viriditas (talk) 01:37, 20 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I have just finished reading the book, and I felt like revising and adding more details to the plot summary. I'm not sure if I overdid it, but in my defense, Franzen's writing style is detail-heavy, and this book has more plot details than its already-above-average page count would suggest. But I'm also new to Wikipedia editing, so feel free to improve on my contribution. Also, on the particular comment about the “unusually young and pretty” phrase, I've changed that to, simply, “charming and young”. --ReverseDelay (talk) 22:41, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@ReverseDelay: Its great that you expanded it, but it definitely feels a bit too long for the Plot summary: I try to keep plot summaries for novels less than 1/4 of the content on an article page (preferably less, see the advice at WP:PLOTSUMMARY:). After all: the goal of the Wikipedia plot summary is to provide sufficient familiarity for someone reading the rest of the article (if they need all the details, they can read the book -- its also not Cliff-notes, we are trying to be encyclopedic so focus on ). That being said, sometimes its easier to condense bits of the plot summary, if you write other parts of the article. See Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Writing_about_fiction. I have been meaning to read the novel: and it has plenty of secondary sources, so I might be able to help if you still plan to work on it. Sadads (talk) 23:42, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Sadads: Thanks a lot for this. I read through the guides you shared and revised the plot summary as well as I can. It's the best balance I can achieve right now between skipping out on details and keeping the main plot lines and themes intelligible for readers. I also removed the chapter divisions. I maintain that the 1/4 length rule-of-thumb is unrealistic for this article given the length of the work, and the brevity of the rest of the article. --ReverseDelay (talk) 20:07, 18 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@ReverseDelay: It definitely feels better, but the 2004 section is still a bit overwritten. I need to read it carefully when I have a more clear reading/revising brain. I would highly recommend trying to write some more other content from reviews into the article, to build it out more of the balance. There are lots of reviews: take google or Google Scholar. Adding balance to a more real-world perspective will strengthen, the impact of the plot summary, and give you a good guideline for what needs to be strengthened in the plot summary. Sadads (talk) 21:48, 18 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox

Added cover artwork of first edition as suggested by infobox Donn Edwards (talk) 18:56, 14 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

University of Virginia

as this book reflects so much of american culture, the summary should clarify where the character Joey went to college. As of now it just says 'Virginia' as in the state, but he actually attends the University of Virginia, or UVA, as it's colloquially known, which is significant to understanding the novel as it's seen as an elitist and conservative school that somehow fits Joey's rebellious and precocious character. It's just as telling as his sister's choice to take an athletic scholarship to the U. of Minnesota. I would edit this myself but this article is currently blocked

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