Talk:Irbit

Stress accents

Crossposted from User talk:Ezhiki#Stress accents ([1], [2])

Stress accents are only used (generally) in Dictionaries. You insist on using them in general Wikipedia articles. This is not done for English, Danish, Dutch or German articles. Why only for Russian? I can understand for the difference between "ye" and "yo". But why do you insist on a visually obtrusive arrangement that serves no purpose other to aggrandise one pronunciaciation over another! If you can provide a verifiable pronunciation expert for Siberian placenames, I will accept your cultural imperialism ~ "A" v "O" inter alia! BUT provide some proof! Are you an Irbitskiy? Or merely a control freak? Unless you are a local, BACK-OFF!—The preceding unsigned comment was added by M-72 (talk • contribs).

Hi, M-72. First of all, I strongly suggest that next time you engage in a discussion with fellow Wikipedians, you study WP:CIV and WP:AGF, the former of which is a policy, and the latter—a guideline (and a very good one, too). Incivility and revert warring are not the Wikipedia way and will get you blocked sooner than later.

Now, to address your concerns:

• Stress marks are not only used in dictionaries. They are generally used in educational and reference materials, including encyclopedias. Check out a copy of Great Soviet Encyclopedia—you'll see that all title words bear accent marks to indicate stress. Russian Wikipedia does it as well.
• Unlike with Russian, there is no tradition of indicating stress in reference material in the English, Danish, Dutch, or German languages.
• Regarding the arrangement being "obtrusive", please note that stress marks are there not on my whim, but are a result of previously established consensus. The matter had been discussed on numerous occasions before, and the consensus was to use them as they add encyclopedic value, are not readily available through other sources, and are not trivial or obvious.
• Pronunciation (and stress) of any Russian placenames (Irbit is not in Siberia, by the way) is easily verifiable through toponymic dictionaries. Even when some cases cannot be easily verified (and Irbit is not one of them), it is generally preferrable to request citation before removing a piece of data altogether.
• I am not a native of Irbit, if that's what you mean. Russian, however, is my first language, and I have a great interest in geography of Russia. Any literate Russian person will tell you which syllable is stressed in Irbit; it's just not one of those cases where there could be doubts.

With all that in mind, I am reverting your edit once more. Please do not remove valuable encyclopedic content again.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 13:33, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

I note that on several previous occaisions you have rv this page without explanation. And despite that, when challenged, you still refuse to cite any source for your actions. You claim consensus, but fail to offer any source for that consensus. I call your actions vandalism and revert them as such.M-72 11:25, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

I also note that you have added NOTHING to this page other than stress marks that confuse readers as they are OS dependent! Your stress marks are not in unicode and are confusing! I'll simply say "Cease and desist!". M-72 11:38, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Ah, what a nice, logical, knowledgeable, and insightful comment! Anyway, my detailed reply to this, including the citations I "refused" to provide (when did I do that, if I may ask?), is available here. As for "my" stress mark "not being in Unicode": excuse me? The mark in question is called "combining acute accent" (U+0301), and it is part of Unicode's "combining diacritical marks" range of 0300–036F. Pardon the sacrasm, but if your system does not render them correctly, may I suggest an upgrade? Of six different platform/OS combinations I am using, only my pocket pc is having difficulties with rendering this stress mark.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 16:27, 28 February 2007 (UTC)