Talk:Orthodox Judaism outreach
|WikiProject Judaism||(Rated C-class, Mid-importance)|
|This page was nominated for deletion on September 21, 2007. The result of the discussion was keep.|
- It was only a first rough version, that must be sourced properly--יודל 17:41, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Jews For Judaism
Do they count as a "subset" of this - or are they more strictly a counter-missionary/cult group? FlaviaR 18:34, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
- more strictly a counter -missionary/cult group, but their motives are outreach.--יודל 18:43, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
This article isn't nominated for deletion
the user who opened this page has a patern favor creating nominations that it should get bettered and uselessly retracts his deletion vote he hasn't even voted delete yet.--יודל 14:12, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
Related talk on Baal teshuva article
See an important discussion about this topic at Talk:Baal teshuva#Should some of this article be split into Orthodox Jewish outreach?. Please add you views. Thank you. IZAK 12:45, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
Proposal to split up project and rename
I will start here to collect notable information about this phenomena, please note that i am needing Izak's help in this since he has created many many articles on the subject of kiruv so i will wait for his OK in creating such an article.--יודל 20:26, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
- First i will try to write the success story in Boca Raton, Florida, which no outreach effort has yet matched thet outreach success strory of that single rabbi, which he was therefore later recruited by YU to head and mimic this effort globally.
- and then i will write about this phenomena --יודל 20:34, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
- Hi, boy you do keep me busy. First of all it is a very good idea. Second of all it should be written as Modern Orthodox Judaism outreach (and it will be a sub-article of a main article Orthodox Jewish outreach which should be officially renamed to Orthodox Judaism outreach because the word "Jewish" is too informal and it is referring to Orthodox Judaism whereas "Jewish" is more connected to the word "Jew" which is an ethnic notion.) And you do not have to go to Boca, you can start with NCSY, YU has programs. Third of all there must then also be Religious Zionism outreach (don't scream, but I think they do more SUCCESSFUL outreach than anybody else in Israel.) Fourth of all it means that some chunks will be taken out of the main Orthodox Jewish outreach article and put into the "Modern" and other ones and new material can easily be found for all of them. Finally, at this rate, there can be a further split into Haredi Judaism outreach (Kollelim, Baal teshuva yeshivas, Partners in Torah, Lev Le'achim) and even down to Hasidic Judaism outreach (Chabad, Breslov, Belz, Skver, and even Bobov and Satmar have achievements)-- all excellent topics for articles with verifiable information and exciting content. Good thinking, here! IZAK 04:52, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
- To do list:
- Religious Zionism outreach
- Modern Orthodox Judaism outreach
- Rabbi Kenneth Brander
- Haredi Judaism outreach
Ultra-Orthodox outreach to Modern Orthodox
This section was just inserted by Jerosenb. I think it's argumentative and biased ("adolescents who are already Orthodox are influenced to isolate themselves from the secular world") and also not properly part of an article on outreach. It is a fact that Haredi Jews are more likely to go into chinuch (education), but their work is not "outreach." That AJOP is dominated by Haredim is no surprise -- there are far more Haredi outreach organizations. But they aren't doing outreach to Modern Orthodox so this is all irrelevant to the article as well as failing on NPOV. Here's the text: Avigdorim (talk) 02:57, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
- Ultra-Orthodox outreach to Modern Orthodox is distinct from Orthodox Jewish outreach and the Baal teshuva movement, which are both aimed at Reform, Conservative, and unaffiliated Jews. In this case, adolescents who are already Orthodox are influenced to isolate themselves from the secular world, which is alternatively portrayed either as religious radicalization or a deeper religious commitment, and is part of the conflict between the Ultra-Orthodox and Modern Orthodox. Modern Orthodox Jews founded groups such as the [], which because Ultra-Orthodox are more likely to become Jewish educators, subsequently became predominantly Ultra-Orthodox; this transition allows the Ultra-Orthodox to influence some of the children of the Modern Orthodox to become Ultra-Orthodox.
- The phenomenon was first articulated by the band Blue Fringe in the song <a href="http://fact-archive.com/encyclopedia/Flippin_out">"Flippin' Out"</a> about Jewish adolescents to become Ultra-Orthodox due to spending a year in Israel post-high school.
- This song was the first to articulate the controversial social phenomenon and the phrase became so well-known that an <a href="http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/943768.html">influential</a> academic book on the issue named itself after the song: <a href="http://www.yasharbooks.com/Flipping.html">Flipping Out? Myth or Fact? The Impact of the “Year in Israel”</a>.
- Modern Orthodox adolescents are also influenced to become Ultra Orthodox by their teachers in yeshiva day school, which are again predominantly Ultra Orthodox.
Using Haredi instead of "Ultra-Orthodox"
NOTICE: It has been long-standing practice on Wikipedia NOT to use the phrase "Ultra-Orthodox" anywhere in any context on Wikipedia because it is viewed and used as a disparaging term in many sources. The favored and acceptable term is "Haredi". Thank you for abiding by this long-standing practice. Sincerely, IZAK (talk) 04:42, 27 January 2008 (UTC)
- If most information outlets use the term Ultra instead of Haready why would it be insulting? and i don't see any links to where this was excepted as "a long standing practice" thanks if u can elaborate on this statement.--YY (talk) 14:31, 27 January 2008 (UTC)
Crtitical response towards Kiruv
Within and without the Orthodox community there has been much written that is critical about Kiruv. That should be mentioned in this article. AvatarZ 04:22, 24 July 2008 (UTC)