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Precious anniversary[edit]

A year ago ...
Cornflower blue Yogo sapphire.jpg
Croatian locations
and language
... you were recipient
no. 1480 of Precious,
a prize of QAI!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 06:51, 2 October 2017 (UTC)


You are vandalising Peter Norman. Stop vandalising, it's spectacularly stupid. (talk) 14:19, 31 October 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for the ping[edit]

I would not have known anything about it otherwise. The discussion caused me to comment at one or two other CFD's that I see you also commented on. (see? the category has already fostered collaboration!) God I hate this place sometimes. --Floquenbeam (talk) 23:25, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Ice cream headache requested move[edit]

See my reason for support and my reply to In ictu oculi. Thinker78 (talk) 04:51, 14 November 2017 (UTC)

New Page Reviewing[edit]

Wikipedia New page reviewer.svg
Hello, No such user.

I've seen you editing recently and you seem knowledgeable about Wikipedia's policies and guidelines.
Would you please consider becoming a New Page Reviewer? Reviewing/patrolling a page doesn't take much time but it requires a good understanding of Wikipedia policies and guidelines; currently Wikipedia needs experienced users at this task. (After gaining the flag, patrolling is not mandatory. One can do it at their convenience). But kindly read the tutorial before making your decision. Thanks. — Insertcleverphrasehere (or here) 09:29, 23 November 2017 (UTC)

@Insertcleverphrasehere: (Belated) thanks for the invitation, but I'll think I'll pass – as I've never felt an inclination to perform NPP for my years of tenure, I don't think I ever will. No such user (talk) 11:00, 18 December 2017 (UTC)
No worries, it isn't for everyone. — Insertcleverphrasehere (or here) 11:01, 18 December 2017 (UTC)


Hi, I'm not sure I follow your reasoning. Surely a table of freezing points belongs in a section discussing its use as a refrigerant? Saline water doesn't seems like a good fit, as the table mostly concerns concentrations which would be classed as brine.--Project Osprey (talk) 08:57, 24 November 2017 (UTC)

Project Osprey: On principle, I'm against WP:REDUNDANTFORKs. Physical properties of all concentrations of saline waters are given in, um, saline water. Brine#Refrigerating fluid article explains the physical process (sort-of, should be made clearer) but I don't think reader's understanding is enhanced with a large table of salt water's physical properties. If needed for explanation, saline water#properties can be simply linked from the relevant sentence (I can't even locate an appropriate one at the moment). No such user (talk) 09:35, 28 November 2017 (UTC)

ArbCom 2017 election voter message[edit]

Scale of justice 2.svgHello, No such user. Voting in the 2017 Arbitration Committee elections is now open until 23.59 on Sunday, 10 December. All users who registered an account before Saturday, 28 October 2017, made at least 150 mainspace edits before Wednesday, 1 November 2017 and are not currently blocked are eligible to vote. Users with alternate accounts may only vote once.

The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.

If you wish to participate in the 2017 election, please review the candidates and submit your choices on the voting page. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 18:42, 3 December 2017 (UTC)


As I said a month ago or so, I'm working on the articles. See User:Mr_KEBAB/VPAS. Obviously, it's far from complete. Mr KEBAB (talk) 09:29, 16 December 2017 (UTC)

Serbia waterpolo team[edit]

FINA considers Serbia to be inheritor of both SFRJ and SCG results. This document is evidence — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gagibgd (talkcontribs)

Results can't be inherited, you should actually read that source. --Pelmeen10 (talk) 18:01, 23 February 2018 (UTC)
Actually that document list results for YUG until 2003, SCG from 2003 till 2006 and SRB after that. Similarly TCH results are still credited as TCH results.Tvx1 23:05, 1 March 2018 (UTC)


The Yugoslavia name has been carried out by both SFR Yugoslavia and FR Yugoslavia. --Pelmeen10 (talk) 18:01, 23 February 2018 (UTC)

And by the Kingdom of Yugoslavia actually.Tvx1 23:06, 1 March 2018 (UTC)

Italian place names[edit]

A few days have passed since my last reply to you ([1]), I'd like you to read it and tell me what your thoughts about my last linguistic argumentation. (talk) 08:01, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

The page about Baselga di Piné was correctly renamed. Could you please move the other one, Ruffré-Mendola, please? The page in it.wikipedia has already been moved, which means that consensus was reached in the Italian wiki about this Italian name, exactly as for Piné, and other wikis moved both pages too. Even Google Maps spells it Ruffré, as it does for Piné. And let's not forget the 2 noted Italian orthography and pronunciation dictionaries, DOP and DiPI, which agree with the acute accent spelling. There's no reason not to move this page, overall after moving Piné, as far as I can see... (talk) 15:00, 1 March 2018 (UTC)


I thought you might want to know that I requested revision deletion of the copyright violations you removed. Vermont | reply here 00:22, 16 March 2018 (UTC)

An unusual request[edit]

Hi. I have a query related to languages. I could have posted it at WP:RDL, where you've answered my queries a few times so far, but for personal reasons I prefer this one not to be public. Given your areas of expertise, I think you'll maybe have some idea about how to help me, or know who might have.

Could you please give me the chance to contact you via email? If you specify an email in your settings and mail me, I'll mail you back. It needn't be your "regular" email; you could just make one for this purpose only, and then remove it from your settings.

I realize this is a bizarre request. Feel free to decline it, ignore it, and even delete it from your talk page. Still, I would be grateful if you responded. --Theurgist (talk) 09:39, 24 April 2018 (UTC)

Cheers Theurgist. You got mail. No such user (talk) 10:48, 24 April 2018 (UTC)

Renaming discussion[edit]

I'd love to get your opinion on this discussion: Talk:Green Park tube station bombing. --Gateshead001 (talk) 23:57, 19 May 2018 (UTC)

Closing decision[edit]

No such user, I'm sorry but am not convinced in regard to your close at Talk:Die, Monster, Die#Requested move 17 May 2018. Whether or not my oppose !vote to rename to the native-language title is convincing, I think the oppose rationales carried more weight than you seem to think. It's possible that the outcome should have been "no consensus" and the page should not have been renamed to "Murder Me, Monster". So I ask at this time that you reconsider your close.  Paine Ellsworth  put'r there  14:27, 14 June 2018 (UTC)

Painius: I don't see that anyone agreed with your position. The film has an official translation ("Murder Me, Monster"), as issued by its very producers and distributors, it is commonly referred in English-language media under that title, and, for God's sake, it's the title that can be seen at the theatrical poster in the infobox. The nominator provided quite a number of English RS using the proposed title. WP:NCFILM provisions for native titles apply only to films that have never seen a significant English coverage, and this one has. Please see WP:NCFILM#Examples–none of the exceptions (Bande à part (film), Ran (film)) applies here. Finally, I'll point out that it's all based on the WP:UE policy: In deciding whether and how to translate a foreign name into English, follow English-language usage. If there is no established English-language treatment for a name... but we do have one here. No such user (talk) 14:44, 14 June 2018 (UTC)
As I said, whether or not my arg was convincing, I think the opposing args were, as a whole, weighty enough to challenge what the supporting args set forth. This should have led to a "no consensus" outcome, and the page should not have been moved. In regard to your arg above, while it seems convincing, it is by no means completely accurate. There has been no evidence produced that this film has ever been released in English-speaking countries under any English title. At the very least, the title from which you moved the page, "Die, Monster, Die", is a direct translation, and the title to which you moved the page, "Murder Me, Monster", is a "variant English translation" and is covered clearly by the film guideline. At the very least, there should have been a "no consensus" outcome, and the page should retain its direct English translation. Would you be okay with a new RM to request that the page be retitled to its native-language title?  Paine Ellsworth  put'r there  14:57, 14 June 2018 (UTC)
Opposes from Lugnuts and ONR were based on apparent misconception that both titles (Die, Monster, Die and Murder Me, Monster) were in equal circulation in English, but they were refuted by the point that the former was based on an early Cannes festival webpage that has been superseded since. The list of some 15 sources in the nomination using the proposed title has not been refuted by anyone.
As for opening a fresh RM, you're certainly entitled to it. But I don't think that your apparent interpretation of WP:NCFILM that the film must have an English theatrical release (it's barely a month since it was released in home market, after all) to have a English translated title holds closer scrutiny; the criterion is more commonly recognized by English readers, and the film has seen a fair deal of English-language coverage so far, so that we can say that one is established. No such user (talk) 15:14, 14 June 2018 (UTC)
We'll have to agree to disagree on the film guideline, which expressly states that if the film has not been released in English-speaking countries, then the native-language title is preferred over any and all variant translations. Thank you for allowing a new RM, and would you be kind enough to add that to your closing statement?  Paine Ellsworth  put'r there  15:42, 14 June 2018 (UTC)
Just had a thought based upon what you said about "(it's barely a month since it was released in home market, after all)". Your closing sentence was "It has been reasonably demonstrated that 'Murder Me, Monster' eventually emerged as the most common one." So I wonder how after only a month, any English variant translation could possibly emerge as more common than the film's Spanish language release title, Muere, Monstruo, Muere? As you say, it's only been barely a month, after all.  Paine Ellsworth  put'r there  19:32, 14 June 2018 (UTC)
Painius, please see the evidence for yourself in the RM nomination. The film was shown in the Cannes festival, which makes it notable in the first place. We have 12 (fifteen) English-language references, produced by Film Fan, mostly reviews and the festival coverage, and several producer websites, all using the Monster title in English. That makes it a pretty open and shut case. I'm really at loss how you fail to even acknowledge that evidence, let alone address it. If you want, open that RM, or start a MR, you don't need my blessing, but I don't think we should discuss this further here. No such user (talk) 19:43, 14 June 2018 (UTC)
Forgive me, because I certainly mean no harm. Mainly, I just don't understand why the guideline seems unclear to editors. No amount of coverage in English reliable sources under variant English titles is as important as the Spanish title under which it was released – no amount. That's what the guideline "guides" us to do. And that guideline represents the consensus of our community. While I still disagree that there was consensus to move, I do not plan an MRV at this time. I think I'll wait awhile on the RM, as well. This will be my last response to you on this matter. Again, I never meant to close you off to further discussion, very sorry for that!  Paine Ellsworth  put'r there  19:54, 14 June 2018 (UTC)
PS. Just FYI, Film Fan has opened a discussion on the guideline's talk page. PS added by  Paine  20:53, 14 June 2018 (UTC)

Walls of Basel[edit]

Merging the articles on the various gates into Walls of Basel has broken several InterWiki links, including but not limited to wikidata:Q669522, wikidata:Q392077, wikidata:Q667144 and wikidata:Q381836, making those articles in non-English Wikis effectively inaccessible from English Wiki. Those and other merges have also removed valid entries in categories like Category:Gates in Switzerland, Category:Buildings and structures in Basel, Category:History of Basel and Category:Cultural property of national significance in Basel-Stadt. You might wish to reconsider your recent actions. Narky Blert (talk) 19:54, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

@Narky Blert: I think that our duty first and foremost is to provide information to English Wikipedia readers in a succinct and most accessible manner. But having one sentence articles such as those inviting the reader to visit them to find more information is much more reader-unfriendly than depriving them of interwiki links. While nice to have, having interwiki links is pretty low on the list of issues to consider, and it is AFAICT nowhere specified in our guidelines that we have duty to maintain the article structure as in other wikis (otherwise, nothing would ever get done); we aren't a database of cross-wiki mapping – wikidata is. Readers who speak German or Allemanisch and wish a better article than ours still can go to de:Basler Stadtmauer and deep-dive from there.
As for having entries of those gates in appropriate categories, that is easily fixable, but I'd rather move those to German-language redirects, which seem to be their common names. No such user (talk) 07:42, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
You have raised several points.
  1. If one-line stubby unsourced articles are turned into redirects, those articles will never get written in English Wiki, no matter what exists in non-English Wikis. If there is a guideline, I don't know of it. Is there somewhere where we two can open a discussion and argue our opposing corners towards a WP:CONSENSUS? This is a very important Wiki issue indeed.
  2. In any event, your argument fails as regards Aeschenschwibbogen. That article was supported by four independent WP:RS sources, and was larger and better-referenced than either the Alemannisch or the German article. (Alemannisch isn't exactly difficult to understand, even when spoken.)
  3. I wholeheartedly agree that amateur translations of non-English placenames should be stamped upon, heavily and quickly. It looks as if this nonsense Talk:Aeschentor#Requested move 17 June 2018 was created by a Wiki editor and has now escaped into the wild. Narky Blert (talk) 21:11, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
Sorry for late reply, I was away for the weekend.
  1. I'm afraid I don't know about a more appropriate place for discussion of broader approach. For this case, as you know, there was a mention of a merger at Aeschentor RM, and Andrewa and I later had a brief merge discussion at Talk:Walls of Basel, and after a month without opposition I decided to go for it. My general impression is that over the years requirements for a minimal article have gradually raised, as evidenced by stringent criteria at WP:AFC and Draft promotion, but I don't think there are any written rules. WP:STUB and WP:SUBSTUB essay only contain very broad guidance.
    However, to counter your point to an extent, I will notice that all of those articles (Gate of Saint John (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views), Gate of Steinen (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) etc.) were created in 2006 by the same author in essentially the same sorry state as I found them before merging. I think that mere existence of a substub actually discourages proper article creation, much more so than a red link would. A potential author might think "oh, we do have an article about this, well, it's crap, but it's been vetted by someone", while a redlink might inspire someone to fill in an apparent void and claim a "creator trophy". Not having a full article on a landmark as prominent as Spalentor on en: is a shame, but I think it has to do with having a bad article there for so long time.
  2. Kudos to you for writing Aeschenschwibbogen, but it wasn't much larger than als: and de: counterparts. However, it was IMO a minimal reasonable article size, and if all the gate articles were written in a similar volume, I doubt anyone would think of merging them. However, I think my merge essentially carried over all the information (I only erased a sentence about someone being executed there sometime). I wouldn't mind you restoring it, as it basically fell victim to other articles' bad quality (why have more info on a small razed gate than on an existing and magnificent one)?
In sum, I think we should focus on providing quality information about the topics of interest rather than on the sheer number of articles espousing this information. Call me a m:Mergist if you like. No such user (talk) 09:49, 23 July 2018 (UTC) ping No such user (talk) 09:59, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

"Spanish flu": inaccurate and offensive[edit]

Hi "no such user",

In the talk page of the 1918 flu pandemic, I have listed several reasons for opposing the requested move of the article to "Spanish flu". Happy to copy them here if necessary? I believe the opinions voiced were rather poorly argued. I don't dispute that there was a consensus, just that the debate leading to that consensus ignored most relevant aspects of the move.

I understand you are the closer of that vote and I need to raise this with you first? I'm slowly learning how this process works, so apologies if I didn't start this through the right channels.

Thank you for your time.


MiG-25 (talk) 02:18, 3 August 2018 (UTC)

Hi MiG-25. As you guessed, a closer's job is generally to assess consensus and weigh arguments based on applicable policies, not to impose a "supervote". In the debate, support for "[1918] Spanish [F/f]lu" was near-unanonimous, with only Amory dissenting, and supporters put forward evidence that "Spanish flu" is the common name indeed.
I'll reply further on Talk:Spanish flu for greater transparency. No such user (talk) 08:52, 3 August 2018 (UTC)
Hi No Such User,
I don't know if you followed the discussion involving Rjensen and myself after your response on this topic. To sum up, firstly, the PubMed data used in the vote was incorrect: 1918 influenza is more common. Secondly, while "Spanish flu" is more common in both general and Google Book searches, the alternatives are not uncommon (General: ~700,000 for Spanish flu to ~400,000 for the addition of "1918 flu" and "1918 influenza"; similar ratio for Books). Finally, I believe I have provided plenty of evidence that "Spanish flu" is considered, at the very least, quite unfortunate in Spanish and medical and divulgation sources. These are at pains to emphasize that it is a misnomer or actively avoid or encourage avoiding such uses (CDC, WHO and The Conversation).
I fully understand and respect that you were simply interpreting what seemed to be a fairly clear result in favour of "Spanish flu". However, I would say evidence in support for change based on WP:COMMONNAME seems rather weak in light of the above. Examples often used as part of WP:COMMONNAME do not seem to compare easily to this case, which may also explain the problems in applying it.
I don't know if you would be the best person to re-open a vote/move vote review or whether I should do it. In any case, I would appreciate any guidance.
In closing and regardless of this debate, I would like to thank you very much for your time and express my true appreciation for your efforts in making this great project work. MiG-25 (talk) 06:48, 12 August 2018 (UTC)


Hi No such user. I am unhappy with your close of the move discussion there. Can you please revisit it? Can you also please refrain from closing any more move discussions for the meantime? --John (talk) 10:53, 7 August 2018 (UTC)

I'm disappointed you ignored my request. You are now on my radar as somebody who has incompetently closed move discussions. If I saw you do it again, I would raise your behaviour at a central discussion and it is likely you would receive a sanction. Please be more careful. --John (talk) 15:27, 7 August 2018 (UTC)
Feel free, John. Can't say I'm impressed with your behavior though, as you chose intimidation and vague threats over policy- and argument-based discussion, but I'll leave any further comment for that "central discussion". No such user (talk) 15:31, 7 August 2018 (UTC)
It's not a vague threat, it's a promise that since you clearly do not understand how to evaluate consensus you should refrain from making any more poor judgements like the one we are talking about. --John (talk) 15:32, 7 August 2018 (UTC)
The close was good, and in fact the only available one. There was clear consensus, supported by evidence, that this is not the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC, so moving it to some title was necessary. Per WP:THREEOUTCOMES, this is the right thing to do. NSU even stated that a new RM could be held to hash out the best form of disambiguation. There's nothing at all out of process here. John, if you feel differently, you can take it to move review, though it's very unlikely it would succeed, as the close was totally reasonable. I'd strongly advise against threatening people with "a sanction" for perfectly reasonable, kosher actions; that tends to WP:BOOMERANG.--Cúchullain t/c 20:19, 7 August 2018 (UTC)

Kalyanasundaranar listed at Redirects for discussion[edit]


An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Kalyanasundaranar. Since you had some involvement with the Kalyanasundaranar redirect, you might want to participate in the redirect discussion if you have not already done so. Kailash29792 (talk) 05:51, 14 August 2018 (UTC)