Talk:Ethiopian Zion Coptic Church

NPOV dispute

This article needs some substantial NPOV work. Whether the Ethiopian Zion Coptic Church is a recognized religious group by DEA authorities, there is more to them than just a group accused of cannabis distribution.

I dunno. The Zion Coptics look to me like a group of white stoners who adopted the externalities of Rastafari in order to provide a justification for using marijuana. Back when they were active in Jamaica (having been legally incorporated by act of the Jamaican parliament), they published a newspaper called the "Coptic Times" which was distributed for free. I was reading a copy one day on a minibus in Kingston, and was asked by a dreadlocked gentleman what I was reading. I told him that it was a Rasta paper, he asked 'Dem check fi di Emperah?' When I replied in the negative, he said 'Den dem nuh Rasta.' I'd say that this POV needs to be taken into account. fledgist 02:49, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

I recommend this so-called "Ethiopian Zion Coptic Church" organisation to change its name QUICKLY in order not to throw people into confusion (it is neither the Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church nor the Coptic Orthodox Church of Egypt). Besides, Marcus Garvey was not a prophet. First because he denied publicly H.I.M. Haile Selassie I in a Jamaican newspaper, "The Blackman" (It was Published November 8, 1930); second because in 1916, Empress Zewditu had already appointed the Crown Prince Tafari Makonnen as Regent Plenipotentiary and Heir to the Throne. What some Rastas call a "prophecy" is in fact an open secret... Emperor Haile Selassie I is the Holy-Prophet for Rastafarians !

While your statements are all undoubtedly correct, I am constrained to point out, in the interest of fairness, that they can call themselves whatever they like as long as they aren't claiming to be other than what they are -- and they are not pretending to be either of the Oriental Orthodox churches you mention. I have to point out, also, that by act of the Jamaican parliament (in 1976) they are a corporate entity formally acknowledged to be such by the Jamaican state. If you want to change that, you'd need to lobby a Jamaican MP. fledgist 22:40, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

I've removed the NPOV tag because, as it stands, the stub takes no position either for or against the EZCC. fledgist 22:43, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

Notability

What is this groups claim for fame (Why is is notable)? Just wondering. Nashville Monkey 21:40, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

The group's claim to fame is an appearance on 60 minutes years ago and a long fight with the DEA over the religious use of certain drugs. It also always comes up when stoners are out preaching their version of history. The reality of the organization has always been questionable. Its always looked from the outside like an American stoner hijack of Rasta. Its a product of the 1970s that long ago outlived any real useful purpose. 66.226.193.82 18:20, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Historical notability is notability, ie we arent an encyclopedia of what happens today and notability is based on what happened in the sixtuies. i would have thought it does pass notability, iof you really believe not it should be afd'd, SqueakBox 18:24, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

I think the question was informational (as was my answer). The questioner wanted to understand the notibility but didn't seem to question it. Offering an opinion, the article is poorly written and while the subject is notible, the current content of the article does not really implicitly show why. Its not an easy subject to write about because there is actually very little useful true information about the group. The official history of the group written by itself is a long rant expressed in 1970's drug logic. And the secondary sources are poor. Any true history written would end up being considered original research. And if the original research were done, it would be difficult to get published because the subject is so obscure. Because we are an encyclopedia, we are at the mercy of publication and research interest in many subject areas. And when articles on obsecure subjects are created. I dont know that I have any point to make in all my rambling, but maybe if someone looks at this article in future the comments will have some value. 66.226.193.82

I have been compiling as much information as I can about the group, and intend to make some more significant edits to the page when I have things in shape. I agree there is not a huge amount of secondary information available, secretive organisations involved in crime can be like that, but there is some. There were many press reports about them in the 1970s and early 1980s, and in recent years Clifton Middleton, a member has written an autobiography. Alan Meyerson has also recorded a 10-part podcast on his history with the group (https://yourbrothercast.com/). There are also some small bits of information about them in several books on Rastafari and journal papers. They were also in the documentary 'Square Grouper' made in 2011 (magnolia pictures). I agree that the page needs a more neutral point of view and will try to include as many sources as I can. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Topatopranks (talk • contribs) 00:01, 18 January 2024 (UTC)

Who was Olsen? The former Libertarian candidate for for governor of Iowa, and for Congress is mentioned only by the name "Olsen", and without any explanation of how is might be connected to this group. — Preceding unsigned comment added by SRBirch922 (talk • contribs) 15:44, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

I believe it is Carl Olsen, a member of the group (see him here https://www.linkedin.com/in/carl-olsen-3779a78). Also comment here - https://barbarablakehannah.wordpress.com/2014/04/20/remember-the-coptics/#comment-167, he is mentioned on page 242 of Cliffton Middleton's book (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ganja-Warrior-Priest-CLIFTON-MIDDLETON-ebook/dp/B08RY4X1CY). Topatopranks (talk) 23:50, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

Social Work

I have talked to a former leader of this Church (who is now based in South Africa), and he told me the income from the marijuana exportation was used to fund social programmes in Kingston and Jamaica.Es-won (talk) 21:19, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

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