Talk:Website

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Very first website[edit]

Wasn't the very first website SYMBOLICS.COM in 1985?

-G

http://www.iwhois.com/oldest/ --134.155.69.125 (talk) 12:57, 28 May 2008 (UTC)
History sections is very muddled. Is it saying this this site itself is the first Web site?

Requested move Web publishing[edit]

"Web publisher" and "Web publishing" are redirecting to website, the correct is a article for it (a specialized part for Publishing article).

See also demands on:

-- 16 November 2006

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the debate was no move. -- tariqabjotu 05:43, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

Requested move[edit]

WebsiteWeb site — Based on English grammar rules and disucssion on talk page, prior to proposal. As explained within the article itself, Web is short for World Wide Web (a name, and thus always capitalized). Common usage Web seperates Web from what the thing it is connected to. For example, Web page, Web site, Web server, Web browser. Each has a space in-between. The title does not present that, at its current state. UBeR 20:03, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Survey[edit]

Add  * '''Support'''  or  * '''Oppose'''  on a new line followed by a brief explanation, then sign your opinion using ~~~~.
  • Support based on reason above. ~ UBeR 20:05, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Both versions are widely used (with for example "website" being used by the BBC and UK government sites), and typing either will get you to this article - there is little distinction to be made and this is just splitting hairs. Oppose. Thanks/wangi 20:09, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Oppose. You can make a fairly strong argument that "Website" is now a widely-used word in the English language, and that usage of both is equally correct. Titoxd(?!?) 22:56, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Oppose Nothing says new words cannot be formed, especially when new things come out. Website is very much a word now, as as correct as web site. --Wirbelwindヴィルヴェルヴィント (talk) 05:07, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Oppose. Both are in common use. To flesh out the points about other uses made above, we also have webcam and webcomic and webhead, etc., as well as proper names such as Webdings. Furthermore, the inital capitalization is totally irrelevant to the naming of this particular Wikipedia article; the "s" should definitely be lowercase, whether preceded by a space or not. The "w" isn't necessarily capitalized; some do and some don't, and you might be able to say it is wrong not to capitalize it if you talk about a World Wide Web–site, you don't have quite the same argument for website. Gene Nygaard 14:01, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Oppose I've been involved in most aspects of websites for a long time, I don't know anyone who uses "web site". Even Google asks you - Did you mean "website" - when you search for "web site". Capitalization isn't necessary either in my opinion, "website" is just fine. —B33R TalkContribs 01:11, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Oppose, just to make my position clear. Both forms are equally valid, there is no persuasive argument to move the page IMO, I am not aware of any relevant 'English grammar rules' (especially if the BBC use 'website'). -- zzuuzz (talk) 02:40, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Support - per nom. Website is falling into colloquial use, but web site is still the correct form. Therefore, move article to web site, with (obviously) redirect at website. robwingfield (talk) 22:42, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Oppose neither is "correct" or "incorrect." They are both widely used and both valid. Until all the grammarians of the world unite and say "Website is wrong and web site is right!", keep as is. — Frecklefoot | Talk 17:37, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Oppose per Gene. —taestell 21:23, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Oppose Website is now more popular and you're likely to find soon that Web site is rarely used. Website has now become the majority spelling and anyone using Web site makes it seem like you can't adapt to changes in common usage. Leenewton 20:15, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Oppose - the word may not have been right at one time, but it now is. Much like internet was once Inter net (capitalization and space), now website is a standard usage word. Both seem to be used equally frequently. Patstuart(talk)(contribs) 21:26, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Discussion[edit]

Add any additional comments:
Additional comment: based on disucssion within this discussion page, the article Web site, and original research:
Prefers Web site:
The Associated Press
CCI Computer
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.0.1)
Encarta World English Dictionary
Hutchinson Dictionary of Computers, Multimedia, and the Internet
Infoplease Dictionary
Marriam-Webster Dictionary
Microsoft
Netlingo
The New Dictionary of Cultural Literacy
New Oxford American Dictionary
The New York Times
Reuters
Webopedia
Additional note: Paul Brians
Prefers web site:
American Heritage Dictionary
LookWAYup
Oxford English Dictionary
RhymeZone
Travel Industry Dictionary
WordNet
Prefers website:
BBC
Cambridge Dictionary
Canadian Oxford Dictionary
Canadian Press
The Times
Wired News
~ UBeR 01:35, 13 November 2006 (UTC)


This is rather original research. I just want to point out that many of these sites use both versions. For example w3.org Quality Assurance Interest Group uses "Web site" four times, and "website" three times in one short page. Microsoft also uses "website" a lot. No doubt there are other examples which would show that 'support' is not overwhelming. -- zzuuzz (talk) 02:20, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
And even Tim Berners-Lee uses both versions on his website: http://www.w3.org/People/Berners-Lee/ Thanks/wangi 02:23, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Discussion[edit]

When I've taught web site design, I always began by telling the students that a web site consists of three elements:

  • the address, like http://www.edpoor.com
  • the server, where the content resides
  • the content, which is what the user sees
I'd argue all of those. You make no distinction between a single file and internet content. A single file on a home users computer is a website. So is a e-mail. An e-mail has content. A server can be any machine you want, in this case it is an e-mail server, and the e-mail has content. Whats more the e-mail program is a website. It has an address on the computer, it is on a server(you refered to a server as a computer and not a program, and any machine can be considered a server as long as it is serving information; therefore a server program always resides on a server.), and since the program requires space, and space==content(even if it is binary, you didn't mention any requirements, just content) you have a website... I'm not trying to be mean, just saying you may want to revise that to avoid confusion in the future. Even if you changed the first on to `web address', or URL, I can still point a URL to my e-mail server's location.

--Capi crimm 08:26, 25 July 2005 (UTC)


"The limit of a website is the limit to a computer's power and the limit of copyright": this should be rephrased, as it ignores that many people illegally violate copyright on the internet. --Daniel C. Boyer


Should acknowledge that content can be included on a website that is not inline (though maybe this belongs in another article), such as PowerPoint presentations. --Daniel C. Boyer 20:24, 31 Aug 2003 (UTC)


What about communities or forums as a type of a website? --Ajvanari 21:38, 24 May 2004 (UTC)

Web site is two words and Web is capitalized.

This is correct. Would anyone object if I moved this page to Web site? Jason One 23:54, 19 Oct 2004 (UTC)
See discussion below re: consensus/google. --Overand 20:22, 13 May 2005 (UTC)

How long does a website last? I've heard the typical lifetime of a website is between three and six years, but I can't find any research about the subject.

History of the term 'website[edit]

Does anyone have any information on why the word 'website' (or 'web site') was chosen, or how it came into usage? It seems like a bit of a dated phrase to me. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.211.19.70 (talk) 17:51, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Media does NOT use "website"[edit]

The AP Stylebook officially changed "web site" to "website" in April 2010. The main wikipedia entry needs to be updated to explain this detail. Otherwise it is very confusing for people. The entry refers to "website" as if it was always "website", which is not the case at all.24.148.23.218 (talk) 02:35, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

The use of "website" by "newspapers and other media" is utterly incorrect. Most newspapers and other media use "Web site". AP Style, as well as several other authorities, forbid "website". The only mainstream media that uses "website" that comes to mind immediately is WIRED Magazine, which made the controversial change relatively recently. (Forgot to log in. I posted this.)

Correct. Most news media do indeed use "Web site".
http://news.google.com/news?q=website
http://news.google.com/news?q=%22web%20site%22
Googling 'web site' Will return google suggesting you search for website instead. Looks like there isn't a very good consensus here.--Overand 20:16, 13 May 2005 (UTC)
Also worth note is the difference between the google results of Web site and website. Microsoft.com's Web site as opposed to the Python Language Website. --Overand 20:25, 13 May 2005 (UTC)
I think the momentum is with the term website however. I think the other form comes from a relatively technologically illiterate time when it was also more common for the web to be capitalized because it was considered to be a specific singlular entity, thus being a proper noun. I never understood this usage--why for instance isn't world capitalized? Theshibboleth 21:53, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

The internationally recognized official Web standards are established and published by the World Wide Web Consortium or W3C and can be found at the site [1]. It must be acknowledged that the standard (i.e correct) is always a capitalized W whenever referring to the World Wide Web in any form, including: Web, Web site, Web page, Web server, etc. Furthermore, it must be remembered that no search engine (or company), including Google, represents any authority on what any standard is or should be. Anyone should realize that the Internet and Web contains as much (if not more) misinformation as information, as many errors as facts, and a lot of intentional deception (a manifestation of anarchy). Only the foolish believe everything they see, hear, or read, and likewise only a fool would believe that everything and anything one might find returned by a Web search engine must therefore be accurate, or in any way held up as a standard. Google functions are based on statistics, not truth. Enough said. --KnowBuddy

"Only the foolish believe everything they see, hear, or read" ...including the above, I assume. KnowBuddy, the W3 standards don't apply here. While they may set standards forth, they can't enforce them, and they don't hold a copyright on the word "web." And the "standards" to which the non-Internet media adhere to vary widely. Wired, as mentioned above, stopped capitalizing "Internet" several years ago. While I think it still should be, different publications choose whether or not to cap it. Conversely, I don't think "Web" should be capped, for the simple fact that Web != Internet. There are thousands of intranet sites that consist of "web pages" and "websites", but aren't part of the Web. Therefore, to be more general, we should just refer to websites in lower-case, since they do not always refer to THE Web.
As for website or web site, I prefer the former, but that is just me. I know what is meant when "web site" is used.
AFAIK, Wikipedia does not have a standard for whether to use Web or web or Internet or internet (for the latter, I always change internet to Internet whenver I see it, but the same is not true for the former). Anyway, if anyone else wants to chime in on this, please do.
Finally, KnowBuddy, please sign your posts. I added your sig above, but you can do this with 3 or 4 tildes (~~~ or ~~~~). The latter is prefered, since it also adds a timestamp. — Frecklefoot | Talk 16:26, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the discussion and instruction on using the name/time stamping feature here. I'll see if I can apply it this time.

Now what a nice pack of straw dogs you've presented!

Straw dog arguments:

1. (Implied) Some parts of the Web or Internet are enforceable. A: False. The Internet and its Web content, by design and implementation, are under the control of no authority or governance,

therefore the issue of "enforceablility" is bogus and irrelevent to this discussion.

2. (Implied, following from 1. above)

  a.) An unenforceable standard or law is not worth existing, acknowledgment, or adherence.
  b.) A condition of unenforceability, justifies ignoring or violating established standards or laws.

A: False. Structured systems such as the Internet, and civilized society in general, function and succeed, based on well established standards, protocols, definitons, principles, and yes, even rules (laws). To abandon those leads to confusion,

anarchy and dystopia.

3. (Implied) Somehow copyright (law) applies to global international standards in general, or words in particular. A: False. Copyright applies only to created works or intellectual property, not to words or linguistics, AFAIK. A word or phrase may be trademarked for commercial purposes, but that doesn't make a trademark any kind of a standard for anyone else outside that commercial entity. Furthermore, the concept of copyright is irrelevent to this topic of international standards or syntax of technical terminology. Example: It's ludicrous to pose a question of whether or not there is any copyright on a technical term such as "Internet" or

"CPU".

4. Syntax and capitalization of terminology somehow has something to do with technical equivalence of terms or components. (Web does not equal Internet) A: Again, irrelevent. The global standard IP does not equal the standard TCP/IP (of which it is a component subset), but that technical fact has nothing to do with whether or not either globally recognized term is capitalized correctly. Likewise, whether

or not the standard term Internet is correctly capitalized (or not) is irrelevent to whether or not the standard abbreviation Web should be capitalized and adhered to.

5. Because one or more established commercial media publishers (Wired was a paper periodical before they expanded to

e-publishing on the Internet.) may change their corporate style manual or ignore their own established standards and practices

at any point in time, that somehow makes them a public authority on standards useage outside their individual company.

A: False. Media publishers (commercial or not) are a priviliged subset of society that is able to compose, publish, and somewhat

enforce their own style manuals, intended for internal application. It is society at large, or else certain industry specific

consortiums which must choose, establish and attend to any designated authoritarian entity on standards. Countless many of those

exist, e.g. SI, ASCII, etc., and apply to global society as well as to technical realms including the Internet. As

stated in the intro to this Wiki article, it is the Associated Press which society (at least in America) recognizes as the current

standard bearer for journalism (including e-publishing on the Web). Wired can freely do as they please, without being burdened

unjustly as any kind of standards bearer.

6. Somehow global Web standards don't apply to this Wikipedia Web site, or the work of the W3C doesn't apply to what we

are doing here.

A: False. W3C standards are intended for the entire WWW and are globally acknowledged and applied to most sites both public

and private. Wikipedia is a public site on the WWW and functions because of W3C standards and protocols (among others). And yes Wikipedia does have published standards, if not a set style manual.

7. Somehow common malpractice in public forums represents justification for further neglect, abuse, or malpractice, particularly abandoning widely accepted standards.

A: False. All over the Web and in interpersonal communications, there are accelrating occurences of individuals failing to use capitalization, punctuation, or even automated spell-checking. that doesn't make it tolerable acceptable beneficial admirable or even comprehensible does it do you intend to emulate that common practice as well

OK, moving on, some may think it inconsistent (self contradictory even?) that you choose to capitalize Internet, but not Web. I'll just grant you that as freedom of personal choice.

I could go on, but have run out of time. One more point (this one of merit) to address later, perhaps tomorrow if I have time. KnowBuddy 21:34, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Knowbuddy, you've presented a lot of arguments here that you've tried to back up, but, in truth, Wikipedia doesn't have to abide to any of them. If we decided to spell web site as "WeB sIghTT," we could and no one would come along and slap us in jail for not adhering to a standard. The truth is, you prefer Web site, while some of us don't. In the meantime, I'd appreciate you wouldn't going through articles (as you've been doing) and only making the change of "website" to "Web site." It's unnecessary and it doesn't adhere to any standard we have here on Wikipedia.
Now, if you want elevate this, I suggest you bring it up on one of the Village Pumps where these types of things are discussed and resolved.
And, yes, Wikipedia does have a WP:Manual of Style, but I don't think "web site" vs. "Web site" vs. "website" is covered in it yet. Maybe you could be the impetus to get it covered (via the Village Pump, for starters). — Frecklefoot | Talk 21:45, 11 August 2006 (UTC)
Web site is simply short for World Wide Web site. Very few people would argue World Wide Web should not be capitalized. It's a proper name, and like all proper names it is capitalized. Likewise, I don't know of anyone who would write World Wide Website. ~ UBeR 01:49, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
Quote "If we decided to spell web site as "WeB sIghTT," we could and no one would come along and slap us in jail for not adhering to a standard." This is true but it is not within the interest of wikipedia and its' community to use the site to monopolize the use of words and to bring new words into the english language. The name "web site" is fine and it's just plain lazy to use "website" or to try to bring it into existence by having it as this sections title. I really think it would be better to say "web site (also referred to as 'website' by those in the technologies industry)" this in effect is true , most normal people call it web site and you will find only people involved with technology and web work in general would call it the other (which wikipedia is edited by a vast number of these techies and thus it is biased). I'm sure you'll edit this out as I'm not a member of your arena, but please consider your ability to influence the english language and your positions as custodians of it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.9.47.106 (talk)
I won't edit your comment out—that's just plain rude and un-Wiki. But I still don't understand your opposition. The English language is dynamic, as are most other modern languages. Why oppose the introduction of new words to an expanding world? The word "computer" didn't exist 50 years ago, but I don't think any of us would contest its utility. "Website" is a perfectly valid term, though it is a conjunction of two previously separate words. The issue of moving "website" to "web site" was brought up and opposed. So, I'm not the only one who feels this way. — Frecklefoot | Talk 15:48, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
Using misinformation to support a fallacious argument most definitely can only hinder credence and intelligibility. Computer has been around since at least 1650. Frankly, you're few hundred years off.
Needless to say, the English language is dynamic. But it has a set of rules. It's called formal language, and it's nothing short of expected in an encyclopedia. This precisely why articles at Wikipedia aren't written in a slang, Internet jargon, or the likes. It sets up a certain amount of formality expected from browsers at an online encyclopedia. And the unsigned comment brings up an interesting point in which it's quite possible "techies" are biased toward the single worded version of Web site; ergo it's prevalent within this article. In academia, however, this is not the standard. Nevertheless, I've realized it is mostly a culture difference and therefore a trivial and moot in arguing within the context of a Wikipedian discussion. ~ UBeR 21:45, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
I write articles and contribute to press releases that get published in technical journals, and I can confirm that the standard usage is to captialize "Web" as a proper name (abbreviation of World Wide Web) and to write "Web site" as two words. I agree that many people do use the colloquial form "website", but in an encyclopedia I expect to see correct usage given precedence. I am surprised to see this issue still being debated, in the light of the very convincing arguments presented above by KnowBuddy. Chris Loosley 02:45, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
Although oft quoted as not being a democracy or not favoring majority, that seems to be exactly what the case is here with Wikipedia. It's quite clear they favor quantity over quality. They willing accept numbers over rationality. ~ UBeR 03:42, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
But can't we just correct this with an edit at the page level, together with some redirect pages to re-route any links to "website" to the page renamed as "Web site"? Chris Loosley 04:46, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
Tried, but gets reverted. ~ UBeR 20:32, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

From a morphological/phonological point of view, website is one word. There is a difference of accentuation between two-word compounds (e.g. black board, blue bird) and one (blackboard, bluebird). When there are two words, the accent falls on the second one; if it is only one word, the accent falls on the first (I'm talking of one-syllable words). The way website is (now) pronounced, it is clearly one word. 216.16.236.133 17:08, 22 February 2007 (UTC)Marc André Bélanger. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 216.16.236.133 (talk) 18:08, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Web site vs. Advertising/Malware[edit]

There's a bit of discussion about the pitfalls of modern Web browser, cursor trapping, etc. I think this stuff should be moved to a seperate article, linked to from this one, such as Web site Hazards or Web browsing hazards. --Overand 20:18, 13 May 2005 (UTC)


Oh no! It's uppercase![edit]

What is the deal with the warning at the beginning of the article? I deleted it once, but it keeps getting re-inserted. ALL Wikipedia articles begin with caps! We don't have to warn users that it's normally lowercase. Most topics in Wikipedia are normally lowercase. Should we go through ALL the articles that are normally lowercase and warn users about them? It's usage in the openining demonstrates that it's normally lowercase: it's lowercase there. Can we get rid of it for good now? Frecklefoot | Talk 13:53, August 26, 2005 (UTC)

Agreed. I've removed it again. Please discuss it here before reinserting it. Taco Deposit | Talk-o to Taco 19:39, 16 September 2005 (UTC)
Disagreed, consult basic English rules regarding beginning of the sentence and pronouns. Unless website is referring to a specific website there is no excuse as to why it would be posted in uppercase. As long as the template that allows the limitation note to exist then this page will intentionally look inconsistent with other articles that note the normally lowercase. Quadra23 September 17, 2005.
Let me ask you something. Do you think the template should be at the beginning of Dog, Cat, Umbrella, or any other article about a common, lowercase word? What's different about Website?
Let me also ask you whoever writes Web (as in Web site) as a pronoun as demonstrated in the second entry on the top of page? That for one shows an inconsistency with the idea of website being assumed lowercase. Unless it denotes a specific website or part of the name of one, there is no reason that is in caps either. I suppose that's the majority of what I see wrong with the removal of the note -- fix that and I'll agree that the lowercase is assumed. Quadra23 September 18, 2005.
It shouldn't be there at all. violet/riga (t) 08:59, 17 September 2005 (UTC)

We use Web site when we are specifically talking about Web sites overall. When we talk about a specific website (for example Wikipedia) we use website. Lenny 15:58, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

So shouldn't the title of this article be Web sites (based on Lenny's comment)? ~ UBeR 21:25, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

The image[edit]

I object to the self-referential image. This is not an article about wikipedia. Its an article about websites. We should use a screenshot from a different website. savidan(talk) (e@) 05:05, 24 February 2006 (UTC)

Everyone would want their website featured as the "official" website of the wikipedia article. May I suggest Google?
I like the image; it's recursive! Anyway, it's not of the Wikipedia main page, it's of the article the person is currently viewing. It's only advertising something they're already reading anyway. Google would be neutral enough, but any other website I can think of would indicate endorsement. --Galaxiaad 01:46, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
I would say take some ancient browser (NSCA Mosaic or something; at least anything not IE/FF), browse to the 'first web site made' already linked in this article and make a screenshot (on Windows, press ALT+Print Screen to only capture the browser screen). Then slap it up there with a nice caption like 'The first {Web site/website} viewing in a web browser'. :) That's neutral, informative and helpful.

History[edit]

  • Could someone knowledgeable write a small history section? When did the website come into existence? What was the first website? etc etc
  • I'm prepared to bet that in a few years website (one word, lower case) will be the standard spelling. Usage dictates correctness, not vice versa. So let's stay ahead of the curve. Adam 03:14, 4 March 2006 (UTC)

First ever Web site[edit]

Although this is hard to determine precisely what were the few very first Web sites out there? 86.129.71.11 15:38, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

The first Web sites were by the military to relay signals and information to each other, once technology advanced they stopped it and the Internet as we know it today was born. Lenny 15:55, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

The first Web sites were used in CERN to share information helpful to particle physicists. The Web was invented by an Englishman, Tim Berners-Lee. Stephen B Streater 06:45, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Losing Web sites[edit]

The StrongFans Web site won't work for some reason. Does anyone know why it can't be displayed? Gm1121983 20:31, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

chekking this intersting site out :)


Game Sites[edit]

I removed "and the MMORPGs EverQuest and World of Warcraft'' because the term Game site refers to a site where I actually log into to play a game. While World of Warcraft and EverQuest are both popular games, they both use their own interfaces allowing players to enter the game world... they do not go through a traditional site to log players in as a lot of the card game sites that have appeared all over the web in the last 5 years.


Reverting Edit[edit]

Revision at 17:36, 12 November 2006 by user Wangi, reverting edits by uBeR, creates inconsistencies throughout (uses both "Web site" and "website," etc.), grammatical and vocabulary errors, and double internal linkings. Nevermind fixing these, as he will simply revert and vandalize it, as per usual. Moreover, is there any consensus at discussion of the Web being capitalized and discussion of the title? ~ UBeR 01:02, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

I simply reverted things to their existing state - any inconsistency has existed for a while already. You have requested a rename of this article to "Web Site", please wait until this matter it resolved before mass editing the article to match your desired naming convention. Thanks/wangi 02:14, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

Website layout[edit]

There should be information in the article about a general layout of websites (menu positioning, information, logo, sitemap, bottom textual menu), and maybe some things on web standards and web accessibility. --70.111.218.254 15:54, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

Web site layouts are quite dynamic and completely under control by the discretion of its creator. ~ UBeR 20:43, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

Categories[edit]

Do we really need all those categories? I mean, we've even got "wedsite" in there now as a site that deals in wedding related info. We've got category bloat. :-( Poweroid 20:07, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

External links[edit]

Hi,

I had added an informative article on this page with the title Defining a Website. The extrenal link stayed www.templatesfactory.net/blog/2007/01/what_is_a_web_template.html for 1 month or so and now it is gone.

Can I please know the reasons for it? Thanks, Hasan —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hassansaleem (talkcontribs)

As the editor that contributed it, it is your responsibility to justify it's inclusion. Without your providing the diff of it's inclusion or removal, I'd guess that it was removed because of WP:EL or WP:SPAM. --Ronz 16:25, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Dear Sir/Madam,

I haven't spammed or anything. The link stayed on wikipedia for like 40 days or so. I would request you to please consider it again as it provides extra knowledge on the subject and is valuably different from what has been mentioned there

Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hassansaleem (talkcontribs)

It violates EL and SPAM. Please see WP:COI as well. --Ronz 18:30, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Regarding the removal of the link and info for homeowners association website central, this is clearly a type of website, and a relevant link that explains indepth portions of information on hoa websites. Again, the page never mentions a product to buy or a company. mar 17thEdenrage (talk) 14:24, 17 March 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Edenrage (talkcontribs) 14:21, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

Spelling section[edit]

What happened to the section over the spelling of the term? Peace. (MuzikJunky 06:10, 7 June 2007 (UTC))

My two cents: Google pulls 1.48 billion results for "website" and 439 million for "web site". This means that people currently refer to Web sites as websites. It's great that The Chicago Manual of Style still suggests Web sites, but that's not how the majority writes it or searches for it. I think we should consider using website across the board for Wikipedia too ;D Strictly Business (talk) 01:42, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

For other technical terms, I have tried using Google to decide whether a term should have a space or not, but on closer examination of the Google results realized that anything computer-related skews strongly toward the spelling that eliminates spaces for at least two reasons. First, many coding scenarios are more likely to break if you use spaces, so devs eliminate the spaces in a URL, directory name, XML tag, etc. Then, those devs document or blog their work, crawlers index their URLs, visitors send the URLs, and along the way all become habituated to the spelling that lacks a space. It's not that it's correct, it's just familiar -- i.e., WP:ILIKEIT. My conclusion has been that I'm on firmer ground not using Google, and also not taking Wikipedia article names as authoritative because those spelling battles tend to be won by the most persistent editors. If I want technical rigor (and I always do for my particular purposes), there's one approach that lets me drill down past the loud voices to the reliable sources that have carefully reviewed the origins, history, and usage of the terms and passed them through the filters of knowledgeable, impartial panels. Currently, this article contains a great example of such information: "The Associated Press Style book, Reuters, Microsoft, academia, book publishing, The Chicago Manual of Style, and dictionaries such as Merriam-Webster use the two-word, initially capitalized spelling Web site." Thirdbeach (talk) 00:35, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

Perhaps the section on 'spelling' is approaching the issue from the wrong angle. Admittedly, if you were writing a piece of text, the question you would ask is 'how do I spell it?' However, 'Web site' is the free use of two separate words; it is short for 'World Wide Web site' or 'site on the World Wide Web.' So long as those two words exist, 'Web site' cannot be wrong. The only real question is, 'is 'website' a word?' and it seems that most dictionaries say it is. Thus, so long as you are satisfied that 'website' is a word, it would not be wrong to use 'Web site,' 'website' and even 'site' in the same piece of text. (Although it would be best to keep to one as a matter of style.) Pololei (talk) 12:32, 14 May 2011 (UTC)

Overview is garbled[edit]

The sentence on line 6 of Overview is not intelligible. "It could not be the work of an individual, because its harder to do a business or other organization and is typically dedicated to some particular topic or purpose." I have no idea what it is supposed to mean, so I cannot correct it. Soler97 (talk) 21:08, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

structure, and terminology or lingo[edit]

Definitions in article lede rewritten[edit]

The definition of 'web site' in lede was poor and in fact incorrect. A web site is more defined by its pages' common domain name in the URL, than being on one server. In fact, many busy sites employ large server farms with dozens or hundreds of servers at different IP addresses possibly. The article contradicted itself in mentioning that the homepage is usually on the same server, implying the site might not be on just one server.

In addition the following definition of a web page is also imprecise in that it is not 'written in HTML'. It is written in plain text or even other formats, HTML is only a markup of the text to specify formatting. A web page consisting of only text without any markup will be displayed just fine.

The home page of a site is not a common URL, i.e., it's not contained in all page URLs, but is a 'simple' URL usually.

The term 'web traffic' has little to do with the navigational aspect of the page, but navigation causes web traffic for sure.

The term 'intranet' was incorrectly attached here to sites that require authentication.

Kbrose (talk) 14:52, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

Types of websites[edit]

I would like to get feedback on how example websites are determined for each website type. This seems like a rich area for wikiSpamming or non-neutral treatment of one website over another. Though this applies to all categories my particular interest is in the Commerce examples. Amazon.com is an obvious choice because there is no one else in their league. The inclusion of CSN Stores who is ranked #83 (2008 Data) on Internet Retailers top 500 list (http://www.internetretailer.com/top500/list.asp) and Overstock.com who is ranked #30 (2007 Data). The top three ecommerce websites are Amazon.com, Staples.com and OfficeDepot.com. I would suggest either not providing any examples (my least favorite option) or having an agreed upon system for who can appear here based on some objective criteria. Thanks! Morganeason (talk) 18:21, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

I revised the ecommerce category to be more specific, a site is generally only called an ecommerce site if it actually performs transactions online. I don't think WP needs to provide examples for this extremely common type of site anymore, to avoid favoritism and following of current popularity trends. Kbrose (talk) 16:20, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Contradiction[edit]

WP articles should not contain contradictions. The lead section refers to "website (also spelled Web site..." yet the Spelling section's first mention is "The forms website and web site are the most commonly used forms." Although both statements include "website", one contains "Web site" but the other contains "web site".

Capitalization is an important part of the spelling of this term, as evidenced by the fact that most discussions reported by Google include capitalization.

The contradiction between the lead and 'Spelling' sections should be fixed. I'm not WP:BOLD enough to choose, but I find this contradiction embarrassing in WP. If no one responds, I'll choose "Web site" arbitrarily. David Spector 18:30, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

Hi David, 1) my understanding is that the first letter's case is irrelevant in Wikipedia. 2) Personally I would plump for website as that seems to be the most frequent usage currently. Chris

Cneeds (talk) 18:06, 11 January 2012 (UTC)

Users[edit]

Why is it that this website article only focuses on the technical side of things? I think this is a common mistake in computer science, the users isn't put on the first place, just like it's not even mentioned in this article. I don't have a good suggestion about what to write in it, but, I would say that users are a very important aspect of websites?

217.74.222.212 (talk) 11:04, 12 October 2010 (UTC) EvilWhiteDragon217.74.222.212 (talk) 11:04, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

Good thinking. Space is becoming a premium but maybe a good column to the websites table would be "Typical user". This then opens up a whole bunch of sections regarding user habits, needs, and relevance to the internet. Chris

Cneeds (talk) 18:00, 11 January 2012 (UTC)

Social networking websites[edit]

I am not sure it is a good idea to cite social networking websites as examples of websites requiring subscriptions, as the more well-known ones such as Facebook do not. ACEOREVIVED (talk) 00:13, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

Portfolio websites[edit]

Could we consider adding a section to the table of website types for portfolios? Perhaps this falls under personal websites, but the text there indicates that personal/small business sites are "rare" which isn't the case among artists and designers. 142.1.32.124 (talk) 16:15, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

I have proposed adding a showcase category (see the article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Showcase_website) into which I believe your porfolio category fits; but I'm open to suggestions! Cneeds (talk) 15:25, 3 February 2012 (UTC)

Why can't i post a back link to external website[edit]

Hello, I had added an external link to wikipedia article .But that has been removed may I know why can't I give back links. Thanks & Regards, Sudhir Chaudhury — Preceding unsigned comment added by SudhirChaudhury (talkcontribs) 09:59, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Because Wikipedia is not a link directory. While some external links may be OK to add, many types of links should never be added to Wikipedia articles, and all links must be directly related to the subject of the article. Here is a list of types of links that are not appropriate for Wikipedia, but note that the list is not exhaustive. --bonadea contributions talk 10:12, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Question: is a link directory a type of website? If so, please add it to the list.

Chris

Cneeds (talk) 17:52, 11 January 2012 (UTC)

suggestions[edit]

Hi

I have the following suggestions:

  1. Add a date column to the websites table and (optionally?) sort the contents by date first seen on the web
  2. Add educational websites
  3. Add showcase websites

Chris

Cneeds (talk) 17:47, 11 January 2012 (UTC)

Misleading examples; here's some real usage statistics[edit]

"Among major Internet technology companies and corporations..." That sentence implies that tech usage has radically shift, when it has not. The three carefully selected "tech companies" are not setters of tech style nor reflectors of it, they are users of business style with an overwhelmingly general-consumer audience.

Google Ngrams are very useful (when used properly) to illustrate mainstream English usage in (mostly-)professionally edited, non-journalistic publications (i.e., books).

This N-gram, using the search string "the Web site,the website,the web site" (without the "quotes"), is interesting (prepending "the", lower-case, prevents search results from including instances only capitalized because at the beginning of a sentence). The search, repeated with "his", "her" and "their" variants, demonstrates a strong, nearly 1:1 ratio between unspaced and spaced usage i.e "website" vs. "Web site or web site" (other searches demonstrated that unspaced "Website" was statistically insignificant, and another search showed that hyphenated usage, lower- or upper-case, barely exists at all). The averaged results of the "the/his/her/their" searches further show that the ratio between "website" and "Web site", without "web site" being factored in, is only about 1.5:1 (1.4:1, 1.5:1, 1.5:1, and 1.6:1, in each search respectively). This proves that the two-word usage isn't even nearing obsolescence yet and that the one word usage is not "standard", simply increasingly common. That said, the data is only current up to 2008, and the patterns can only be tentatively extrapolated into the future so far. It's still much better evidence than a handful of cherry-picked websites and style guides.

Even more interestingly, using "this" as the prepended word in the search produced the result that spaced use is more common than "website", by about a 1.1:1 ratio, among people authoring sites, i.e. techies, only about about a 1.35:1 lead for "website" over "Web site" by itself, throwing out "web site". To prove this point more fully, using "geekier" terminology essentially throws "website" in the trash can; searching with "Apache" as the prepended term produces a 2.4:1 majority in favor of "Web site" and almost 20:1 for spaced vs. unspaced! Using "Linux" demonstrates no notable use of Template:Anything but "Web site". Using "PHP" as the added term shows a "Web site" to "website" ratio of 1.6:1, and an unspaced total to "website" ratio of 2.1:1. Using "MySQL" produced 2.3:1 and 3.1:1, respectively, while changing the whole search to "a Web site developer,a website developer,a web site developer" produced a roughly even ratio between "Web site" and "website" (1.3:1 spaced total vs. unspaced), after a somewhat recent decline in the incidence of "Web site" (which lead 2.5:1 vs "website" in 2001) without any corresponding marked increase in "website" or "web site"). Removing "a " and swapping in "design" then "development" for "developer", produced patterns nearly identical to this.

An obvious corollary would have to be that corporate flacks would surely prefer "website", and they do: "our Web site,our website,our web site" shows a whopping 2.9:1 lead for "website" over unspaced use, with virtually no difference reported between "Web site" and "web site" (the proper name point is clearly lost on them). This sample necessarily also nets techies sites that refer to "our" site, but most such uses will be corporate, governmental, school or NGO (all of which lean toward business/journalistic style). Speaking of which, using "news" produced similar, though less marked results. Same goes for using consumer marketing terms like "friendly" that might be paired with "website" or "Web site".

Finally, replacing the entire search phrase with the very common parallel construction using "server" instead of "site", "the Web server,the webserver,the web server" (and trying variants like "their" and "a" being added) demonstrates that unspaced usage essentially does not exist, and that capitalized usage is in transition. Using "Web hosting,webhosting,web hosting,Webhosting" demonstrated only very low compounded usage. The abbreviated compound "webcam" was of course ubiquitous, since "web cam" and "Web camera" and the like essentially don't exist (much like "weblog" is barely a word any longer, having been supplanted by its abbreviation "blog").

In summary, this article needs to be updated with actual usage data instead of nothing but a) argument to authority and b) blatant original research in hand-selecting a few examples of companies to analyze for usage. — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ɖ∘¿¤þ   Contrib. 20:55, 15 March 2012 (UTC)

How do I edit this page?[edit]

How do i edit this page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.22.191.186 (talk) 16:48, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Lede image[edit]

I think it's partisan and America-centric. I suggest an .edu or maybe an .org about gardening or something. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 17:20, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

America-centric, perhaps, but what website wouldn't be *-centric? Some obscure gardening website would be garden-centric, and the issue there would be which gardening website to choose? Other gardening websites would be rather upset about Wikipedia promoting another gardening website and not their own. The same could be said for an .edu website. There are other concerns as well. Most websites that we could use as an image would be (1) under the owner's copyright, so it would fail WP:NFCC and (2) have competitor websites that would be (rather correctly) upset that we'd choose website X over website Y. The POTUS bio is US-GOV public domain, most other websites wouldn't be. - SudoGhost 18:33, 26 June 2012 (UTC)
Good points. But if it has to be -centric something, why politician-centric? Nonprofit would be best. How about NASA? Could we use that? Anna Frodesiak (talk) 21:21, 26 June 2012 (UTC)
NASA is public domain, so I'd certainly not object to it. - SudoGhost 22:32, 26 June 2012 (UTC)
Okay. Now, should I take a screenshot that includes the browser showing the url too? Anna Frodesiak (talk) 15:25, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

Yes check.svg Done Anna Frodesiak (talk) 13:39, 29 June 2012 (UTC)

How about changing it to http://india.gov.in/ now considering how huge Wikipedia is there, plus the whole global thing. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 13:28, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

I'm not familiar with Indian law, but would that website be public domain, or at least not under a restrictive copyright that would cause it to fail WP:NFCC? - Aoidh (talk) 08:26, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
According to this, the website doesn't use an ideal copyright license. It requires written permission to reproduce, which wouldn't be ideal for a website (like Wikipedia) which uses a CC-BY-SA sharealike license, meaning anyone can ideally copy the content from our website. One of the primary purposes of the WP:NFCC policy is to "minimize legal exposure by limiting the amount of non-free content", so using the india.gov.in website wouldn't be ideal. - Aoidh (talk) 08:30, 19 May 2014 (UTC) (Sorry, apparently with Benadryl I am compelled to write "ideal" as many times as I can in a single sentence...) - Aoidh (talk) 20:20, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
Good point. I just went shopping at Category:Cultural organisations based in India and Category:Non-profit organisations based in India and didn't see any cc sites. Also, there's the issue of the organization's agenda, regardless of how good the cause is (like http://www.peopleforcattleinindia.org/ for example. Who doesn't like cows?). I would still like to see a change, though. NASA has had its time (2 yrs.). Why not give another site and another nation a go? Anna Frodesiak (talk) 08:45, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
How about http://creativecommons.org/ ?
Anna Frodesiak (talk) 08:48, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
What about this already existent image? A bit meta perhaps...
Wikipedia Main Page.png
Sailsbystars (talk) 13:06, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
I thought it had been discussed before but I can't find any reference to that discussion, but I think it was changed from an image of Wikipedia per Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Self-references to avoid, but maybe not. Either way, I think the current image, the NASA website, is a good one because it contrasts well with Wikipedia itself; they're (presumably) visiting Wikipedia as a website, so it's not very helpful to include an almost recursive image of what they're already looking at. - Aoidh (talk) 20:24, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
Well, that's true, but it's the #6 ranked site on Alexa and the only website in the top 30 with a CC compatible license. If we did the homepage (www.wikipedia.org) instead of enwiki it would also have several different languages displayed. The essay you link to says referring to wikipedia is okay if it's in a relevant context and I'd argue the #6 website is pretty relevant to an article on websites. If you still object, I can also suggest kernel.org which has a compatible license as well, although the cc website would make sense as well. Sailsbystars (talk) 02:06, 20 May 2014 (UTC)

Support Sites[edit]

I think Support or Customer service sites should be added to this list — Preceding unsigned comment added by 23.16.34.207 (talk) 15:51, 22 August 2012 (UTC)

website is a world of advanced tecnology.... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.214.28.53 (talk) 11:14, 12 September 2012 (UTC)