Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Higher education

WikiProject Higher education
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Statistics
Higher education pages by quality Quality Total FA 44 FL 55 FM 17 A 1 GA 221 B 1,087 C 3,829 Start 16,751 Stub 15,833 List 1,676 Category 27,812 Disambig 130 File 5,268 Project 48 Template 1,944 NA 1,946 Assessed 76,662 Unassessed 2,350 Total 79,012 WikiWork factors (?) ω = 197,768 Ω = 5.24
Things To Do
Work on articles that need cleanup. Create a page for every university and college and add {{infobox University}} for it. See the missing list for those institutions still awaiting articles. Place {{WikiProject Higher education}} on every related talk page. Combat boosterism wherever it appears Ensure all articles, including Featured articles, are consistent with the article guidelines.

Texas Tech University Featured article review

I have nominated Texas Tech University for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. FemkeMilene (talk) 08:01, 20 June 2021 (UTC)

Assuming that this ends up getting delisted, that'll leave us with only five remaining FAs for full institutions (as opposed to subpages). All in the United States. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 08:40, 20 June 2021 (UTC)

Linking WP:UNIGUIDE from our talk banner?

What would you all think of adding a quick link to WP:UNIGUIDE from Template:WikiProject Higher education? It's a great resource we've developed that should be relevant to any page we've tagged, and I think putting it in the banner would help more editors who could use it find it. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 08:15, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

Sounds like a good idea to me. Robminchin (talk) 04:50, 30 June 2021 (UTC)

Sandbox at Special:Permalink/1031189004. I'll implement in a day or two if there appears to be consensus. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 07:47, 30 June 2021 (UTC)

Implemented. I'll try to remember to check in a week or few to see if it has much impact on the number of views UNIGUIDE gets. If it doesn't move the needle much, we could consider bolding the link. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 22:07, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

Athletics and traditions as subsections?

One thing I've seen on many pages is for traditions and athletics to have their own level-2 section. Sometimes this is the result of cruft, but in any case, these things are aspects of an institution's student life, so with rare exceptions, I think they ought to be level-3 subsections of the level-2 student life section. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 08:18, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

I truly hate it but intercollegiate athletics at many U.S. institutions, particularly NCAA Division I institutions, is so prominent (massive budget, large staff, ridiculously high public profile and public interest, etc.) that it warrants its own section. I don't know if it's better for us to strive for consistency and keep this as a section for all U.S. colleges and universities or if we should distinguish between institutions that place more or less prominence on athletics (NCAA Division I and II gets a section and everyone else gets a subsection?) and structure the article accordingly. I like the idea of consistency as it makes things easier for both editors and readers. But I would also have sympathy for an argument that article layout and structure should, to some degree, reflect differences between institutions as that is a great way to make those differences apparent to readers. ElKevbo (talk) 21:16, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

That's fair. At least within the U.S. context, the NCAA divisions give us a very helpful dividing line. I'd be fine with a WP:UNIGUIDE note that generally Division III should be a subsection and Division I should be a section. I'm not familiar enough with Division II to know whether it's more similar to I or to III; what's your view on that? {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 23:39, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Is Ashland University a Christian university?

There is a dispute among editors of Ashland University about whether the lede sentence should label the university as "Christian." There is a relevant discussion open in Talk; additional opinions and suggestions are welcome!

(For what it's worth, this general topic of labeling institutions as <adjective for a specific religion> (e.g., Christian, Baptist, Jesuit) has been on my mind for a few years now because we are inconsistent in our practices. It's often an easy decision to make when the institution makes a very clear claim to such a label and other sources follow suit. It's much more difficult when an institution claims that there is nuance e.g., the institution is "sponsored" by a religion or religious organization, the institution claims that it only has a special relationship with a specific religion. This specific example is a very good one as it has some common elements of these decisions. But it's worth holding a broader discussion on this topic so we can establish some clear guidelines and examples for those of us who edit in this space.) ElKevbo (talk) 21:24, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

That's a good question to raise. I'd say that we should first look to what RSes say. Given that these labels are the sort of thing typically brought up in the first sentence when introducing an institution, sources should hopefully be available for most institutions. When that's not enough to determine the wording we should use, I'd say it's okay to give some amount of weight to what an institution says about itself. When there's a clear religious connection but it's not formal, the phrase "de facto" can be very useful. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 21:11, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

There is a bit of a challenge in that many journalists appear to be content to copy or follow an institution's self-description without any critical analysis or context; I suspect this is even more common for local journalists or those who don't specialize in education particularly higher education. So we need to be a little bit wary there. ElKevbo (talk) 17:37, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

I hate to say this, but many sources follow what Wikipedia says without independent verification. 96.255.253.95 (talk) 11:04, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

Globalize First-generation college students in the United States?

I just searched for if we had any coverage of first-generation students to wikilink, as it's an unfamiliar term. It took a bit of searching as it had no redirects and wasn't linked from the first generation dab page, but I eventually found it at First-generation college students in the United States, and it seems to have Educational interventions for first-generation students as a companion article. Is the idea of first-generation students something that exists outside of the United States? If so, the article may need to be globalized. If not, "in the United States" is probably an unnecessary disambigufier in the title. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 20:33, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

Oh, and there's also Blue-collar scholar. This area is ripe for cleanup if anyone wants to take it on. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 20:37, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

User:Sdkb, a google search suggests that the equivalent term in the UK is first-generation (university) students. To me the article reads more like an academic paper than a wikipedia article so I would recommend starting a new global article rather than using this one. Perhaps that could be a challenge for another US university class. Educational interventions for first-generation students also seems to be US based. TSventon (talk) 22:41, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

reads more like an academic paper than a wikipedia article Tell-tale sign of student editors haha; if the style problem is bad enough, you can tag the pages. I went ahead and tagged the interventions page for globalization, as it doesn't try to restrict its scope in the title. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 00:49, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

User:Sdkb, do you know why first-generation students are so prominent in the US (and US university articles)? Only one English university article seems to mention them, University of Sussex. Perhaps they are not a priority for the Office for Students. TSventon (talk) 01:34, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

@TSventon, I'm not sure. I know that issues around socioeconomic status are approached differently in the U.S. than in the UK, with class considered a more rigid concept in the UK. I imagine that there's some sort of discussion about class-based affirmative action there, but perhaps it's not as centered around the idea of first-generation status. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 01:44, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

Apologies for butting but I suspect that this has to do both with U.S. culture and access to U.S. higher education. I suspect - but defer to those who are more culturally and historically informed - that the United States purports to allow more class and wealth advancement than many other countries (the "American dream") and for the last 80 years or so this has expanded to include attending college. I am much more certain in saying that this is probably also linked to the much expanded access to college in the United States that began in the middle of the 20th century, first with the post-World War II GI Bill that provided access to veterans, many of whom were not from families who could afford and expected their kids to attend college, and then continued with expanded access to women and people of color. Expanding access has continued to be a priority for many people, particularly those who work in higher education, with those on the left focused on ensuring that people of color and women continue to have access and those on the right somewhat focused on ensuring that people in the lower and middle classes continue to have access. The number of people participating in higher education and the number of colleges and universities in the U.S. exploded in the 20th century and this was - and continues to be - a very prominent population in that growth. ElKevbo (talk) 01:53, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

Sdkb, I don't generally tag articles. My feeling is that if it is too difficult or time consuming for me to fix, the next editor will probably feel the same. Rewriting this article is a good example of this.

ElKevbo, what I meant to ask, but didn't put into words, was whether first generation college students have been made a priority due to US government policy at state or federal level? I found a partial answer in Upward Bound, a federal scheme which has existed since 1965 and does focus on FGCS. The UK Sutton Trust is not a government scheme, was founded in 1997 and does not appear to focus on FGCS. TSventon (talk) 19:39, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

University of California, Riverside Featured article review

I have nominated University of California, Riverside for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. ~ HAL333 21:06, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

"New York Chiropractic College" name change

NYCC has changed its name to Northeast College of Health Sciences, but the old name is still displayed on the List of Colleges in New York State: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_colleges_and_universities_in_New_York_(state)

@1charliedw:  Fixed; thanks for pointing out the need for an update. Next time, feel free to be bold and make the change yourself! Cheers, {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 19:02, 13 July 2021 (UTC)

University of the People and College Navigator

An editor on the University of the People page keeps removing College Navigator (diff, diff) as a source. He argues CN uses the word "campus" to describe the school's setting, so it is "deceptive" because the university is online only. He keeps substituting a link to an office real estate website, LoopNet, instead. I am done with it, so perhaps more experience editors can deal with this. SimoneBilesStan (talk) 14:38, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

I think that I gave up trying to edit that article because of the persistent POV pushers who have dominated the article for some time now. It may be time to ask other editors for help at another noticeboard e.g., WP:NPOVN, WP:RSN, WP:COIN. ElKevbo (talk) 22:41, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

Pomona College FAC nomination

 You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Pomona College/archive1. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 22:06, 15 July 2021 (UTC)Template:Z48 {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 22:06, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

Request to review a COI edit

Can someone please review this edit to University of Dayton by one of the university's marketing employees? I've left him a message on his Talk page and I worry that if I also review and partially revert or edit his edit he might think I'm bullying or harassing him. Thanks! ElKevbo (talk) 19:33, 16 July 2021 (UTC)

Dispute at Tulane University; additional input requested

An editor with a tight focus on Tulane University is insisting on including misleading and promotional information in the article's lede. Additional input would be appreciated as he or she is edit warring with little participation in an ongoing discussion in the article's Talk page. ElKevbo (talk) 01:07, 21 July 2021 (UTC)

Peer review for University of Mississippi

I have a peer review open for the University of Mississippi. Any input would be appreciated. Thanks! ~ HAL333 17:36, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

Should dining services be covered in student life sections?

Over at the Pomona FAC, Nick-D has challenged whether it's appropriate to include a paragraph on the college's dining services in the student life section. Copying our exchange:

*Delete the para starting with 'Pomona's dining services are run in-house' as it's basically trivia. If anyone wants to know what they can eat here, surely the college's website has this.

• I have to disagree that we should remove all mention of dining services from the article. Nearly all students are on the meal plan and eat nearly all of their meals from the dining halls, so it's a major aspect of student life. Dining services also employs a sizable percentage of Pomona's staff. The fact that the services are run in-house is mildly noteworthy, as it's much more common for institutions to contract out to a provider like Sodexo. This is a single paragraph pretty far down the page, so it doesn't have a huge bar to clear to be due, and I think it meets it. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 02:00, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

  It's trivia. Delete it: this is something I'd expect to see on the college's website in material aimed at prospective students, but I don't see how it's encyclopedic. Nick-D (talk) 10:30, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

Whether or not we ought to cover dining services in college articles is a broader question where we should be consistent between institutions, so I'd like to seek wider input here. I still feel that it's relevant for student life sections. What do you all think? {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 19:02, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

I would say so. Anyone who has ever been on a college tour knows how much schools emphasize (or should I say sell) dining amenities. ~ HAL333 19:32, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

Pretty sure we should include it. Dining is an aspect of college that people will research, so a Wikipedia page should help address that by at least including some information on it. While we don't need a menu or anything, it should be mentioned under student life. PoliticsIsExciting (talk) 22:35, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

Notice of Featured Article Review

I have nominated Texas A&M University for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. ~ HAL333 23:00, 22 July 2021 (UTC)