My talk page / ma page de discussion / 私 の 会話ページ
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My talk page archives are here.
Please follow these guidelines for my talk page:
1. If you want to pressure me into editing the Esperanza essay, don't. Just don't. If you persist, I will consider it harassment and seek administrative action.
Wikipedia is at heart a volunteer project; people freely offer their work because they want to. They're not obligated to work on a specific article, or to do any work at all. Because of this, insisting that someone else participate on a page such as the Esperanza essay is simply rude, especially when that other person has repeatedly said no. Behaviour like this makes Wikipedia an uncomfortable place for me right now, and there's simply no excuse for it. If this is what passes for community building, then leave me out of it.
2. Please be civil and respect that this is my talk page. That means avoiding excessive images (barnstars and smileys are fine, within reason), not treating my talk page as your personal chat room, and not altering your comments after the fact.
3. Please sign your messages by typing ~~~~ or by using the edit toolbar. The automated signature button is the one to the right of the crossed out "W".
Please understand if I do not respond immediately. Also please be understanding if I do not answer your message in the order that it was received, or if I do not answer your message at all. I just don't have the time or energy to respond to everyone, so please accept my apologies if your message goes unanswered.
I will ordinarily answer on your talk page, unless requested to do otherwise. Thank you!
- —Kyoko
Wonderful Kyoko, your thoughts reveal, as always, what a sweet and wonderful person you are. And also, that there is no doubt we hold some sort of empathic bond, for you caught me in the act of emailing you! :) I've been planning to do so for a few days now, so please, check your mail tomorrow morning, ok, sweetie? I'll make more sense there, you'll see - but I won't end this very brief note without telling you what we, all your friend feel: you are a blessing, and a warm light for all of us. Whenever we feel down because of the hardships of this project, you are always at our side with a sweet and thoughtful word, and everything looks brighter and makes sense once again. Thanks for being you, dearie! :) (don't forget, meet me at your mailbox later! ;) Love you, Phaedriel - 04:42, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
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Hello, Kyoko! Here is one of my very last smiles in my old theme. While I always loved my burgundy, gold, black, and creme colours it has been a good year now, and I am starting to tire of it. I will have to drop by when I've redesigned my smile so you can see :)
I want to thank you for being so kind and patient, my dearest Kyoko - I really am terrible at writing consistently and I really do need a swift kick on occasion. Know that I can hardly do anything other than think of you often, and wish there was something I could say that would really let you know how much I appreciate your patience and kindness.
I hope things are going well and continue to go well for you, and feel free to write me whenever you feel like it. My ears are always open and my message box always ready to hear from you! Love much, --Editor at Large(speak) 14:04, 25 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
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- Oh I know it wasn't a "swift kick"; I was indicating that in the future if I don't write back in a timely fashion you should give me a swift kick! Your message was a very lovely gentle smile, nothing the least bit kicky about it! ^_^
- Much love, — Editor at Large(speak) 14:16, 25 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- A drastic change indeed :) My page on Commons kind of turned white and blue as that was the existing theme there, so I decided to use those colours for my new userpage here as well. Now I need to create a new talk page, and then move on to fix up my Commons userpage!
- I love your userpage just how it is, but I know if you changed it the end result would be something just as lovely as the one you have now :) — Editor at Large(speak) 04:54, 27 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Kyoko - I've blocked the user as a sockpuppet - anyone who does that on their third edit is pretty much shouting it from the rooftops ;) This user and his socks are fairly destructive, from what I can tell, and this user's edits have all been useless, so I'd say we're not blocking tomorrow's next FA writer. And nothing bitey about cautioning a user for an edit like that, at all, so set your mind at rest :) My Internet's incredibly slow, so I'm going to have to stay away until I manage to fix that, but I'll try to check messages once a day. Take care, Riana ⁂ 06:21, 26 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Should I tell you what that means? ;) Love you! Phaedriel - 23:17, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
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I did notice, :) because the other day, this edit happened. I welcome people to read my talk page content, but it seems this person takes it to the extreme by reading all my interactions with female users (administrators, actually, though you may become the exception). I'm not offended by it (no reason to be offended by vandalism or trolling anymore), it's just that I thought this user decided to drop it a few weeks ago. Obviously they moved on with Persian Poet Gal, Alison, and Natalie Erin, and have gone to Phaedriel. Acalamari 23:42, 26 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I haven't seen you in quite a while Kyoko. I was a little worried when I viewed your userpage and stuff. Are you feeling better Kyoko?--PrestonH(Review Me!) • (Sign Here!) 06:55, 27 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for your quick reply, I read the essay and the users that vandalizise Phaedriel's talk page, I think its more of trolling but anyway thanks, Take CareArnon Chaffin Got a message? 13:24, 29 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- If you look at this eases me down posted this on User talk:Phaedriel and also User:She eases me down may be a sockpuppet too , but I can't find the sockmaster.Arnon Chaffin Got a message? 13:38, 29 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Dear Kyoko, thank you so much for sharing that sad, but beautiful poem with me. I didn't know it, but it sums up perfectly the way in which I understand Charlotte was affected by the death of her younger sister. I spent the last few minutes searching for a website I stumbled upon yesterday, but I seem unable to locate it now; it features a few stories and pictures of Anne's grave, and drawings of the Bronte sisters; and it tells that, after Anne's funeral, only Charlotte went to see her grave once, several years after, and was so saddened that she even ended up moving to a different town. Emily and one of her brothers had also died just month before, and the constant struggle with these tragedies marked Charlotte's works.
I decided to put that little shrine there yesterday, as it was the anniversary of Anne's death; those were the last lines she wrote before her passing at the young age of 29. I personally love all the sisters' works, but I feel specially moved by the spirituality and sadness of Anne's poetry. I've posted all her poetry at Wikisource, and I hope to do so with her two novels asap. But let's continue this by mail; I was about to write to you, and now that my fingers have warmed up after this long message, it's the perfect time :) See you there sweetie! Love, Phaedriel - 17:42, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
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Hello. I'm just dropping by to give you this message because I think it's the right thing to do, and after this, I will leave you alone: I'm sorry if I've hurt you with any message or email I've written to you. I wish you the best luck. Will (We're flying the flag all over the world) 18:26, 29 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2007 May 30#Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/User:Cool Cat -- Ned Scott 05:16, 30 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
...and your mailbox rings again! ;) Love you, Phaedriel - 16:56, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
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Kyoko, if two previously uninvolved users already think that a paragraph on community building is important, then I think that that demonstrates the necessity of such a paragraph. The issue of community building was something that we all eventually agreed with. I agree with your proposal for the paragraph, and I would seriously recommend its addition into the essay. Also, I proposed the other edit regarding Esperanza's programs because the sentence in its current form is a stand-alone sentence. (Therefore, it is not a paragraph). Please reconsider the options.--Ed ¿Cómo estás? 18:10, 30 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Please remember that something good can always come out of something bad. While our mediation was a constant reminder of Esperanza's divisiveness, a temporary state of agreement came out of it in the end. One can only hope that good things come of the new debate as well.
- I am still disturbed, however, by the fact that nobody bothered to address concerns about community building and Esperanza's history, despite the fact that two users previously uninvolved in Esperanza's affairs expressed a desire to edit it. Are we going to ignore the growing importance for community building?
- I hope that we all don't have to make our own essays, since that will only lead to several publications expressing each editor's point of view.--Ed ¿Cómo estás? 21:59, 30 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- You said, "Try as we might, we all have our own opinions of how Esperanza was and how it should be remembered, and it's simply too difficult and too time-consuming for us to try to find common ground." The thing is that we already found common ground regarding the issue of community building. As you can see on this thread and its subheadings, Dev, Moreschi, and I have already stated the importance of community building. Your proposal on WT:EA is agreeable to Dev's, Moreschi's, your, and my ideas. I do not see how such a paragraph can cause problems on this essay, since now Kylohk and Kaypoh both want something about community building in the essay. I see no reason to oppose this paragraph. Therefore, I feel that we have a common ground on this, and that user essays are unneccessary.--Ed ¿Cómo estás? 18:33, 31 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Really??? Does that mean that we're just going to stop discussing, even if it means keeping two editors unsatisfied, giving the rest of the Wikipedian population the wrong idea about the importance of community, or neglecting to give a detailed account of what Esperanza actually "did"? If we walk away now, a lot of issues will still remain on the table and other editors might come over and express their concerns. Are we going to neglect the other Wikipedians just because we have to be so divisive? You know as well as I do that all of us have found common ground; why are you ignoring it?--Ed ¿Cómo estás? 22:02, 31 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- If you think about it, Esperanza was already known as a troublemaking organization as demonstrated in the 2nd MfD. We don't have to worry about making Esperanza's image worse, because it's already been defaced by the people who what the essay to say that Esperanza was bad. Now, as ex-Esperanzians, we both know about the good that Esperanza tried to do; why are you trying to hide it? Do you really think that Wikipedia will become a better place if we give people the wrong idea about community building?--Ed ¿Cómo estás? 22:44, 31 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Bet you a dollar you start removing his messages. ;) DevAlt 22:17, 31 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Well, let it stand for a while, and see what happens. :) Shall we donate to charity, whoever loses, to save us the trouble of trying to send each other money? (Hell, I'll think I'll go donate a dollar right now anyway) DevAlt 22:35, 31 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Sadly, it seems that another can of worms has been opened for you, Kyoko, that I cannot do anything about. Please do not get stressed over this. I am always here for you as I am for all my friends. — $PЯINGrαgђ 12:33, 1 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
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OK. :) I'll keep that in mind. — $PЯINGrαgђ 03:29, 6 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I just read your edit to this talk page. Fine. I don't care if you want to participate in the discussion anymore. Just remember that if you're not interested in discussing the issues, considering the opinions of the opposing side, or continuing in any way the dispute, then remember that your opinions will no longer be respected. Anybody who chooses to discuss in a controversial debate must be available to defend him/herself so that everyone will have a chance to respond to the arguements. If you don't want to discuss this anymore, then fine, I'll implement my edits given the fact that a previously uninvolved editor has recently supported it.
If you don't want to deal with this anymore, then all you have to do is take Esperanza off your watchlist. You don't have to whine about it, you don't have to be too dramatic about it either. Just remember that if you still want the essay to remain the way it is, you should be willing to discuss it. Remember, "If you don't want your writing to be edited mercilessly or redistributed by others, do not submit it." Stop digressing into other topics and get back to the issues at hand, which in this case is community building. Oh, and this applies to you, Dev, as well. If you don't want to discuss Esperanza, then you shouldn't be defending yourself.--Ed ¿Cómo estás? 22:07, 1 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
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I told you that sorrow would fade, friend,
And you would forget half your pain;
That the sweet bird of song would waken ere long,
And sing in your bosom again;
That hope would creep out of the shadows,
And back to its nest in your heart,
And gladness would come, and find its old home,
And that sorrow at length would depart.
I told you that grief seldom killed, friend,
Though the heart might seem dead for awhile.
But the world is so bright, and full of warm light
That 'twould waken at length, in its smile.
Ah, friend! was I not a true prophet?
There's a sweet happy smile on your face;
Your sadness has flown - the snow-drift is gone,
And the buttercups bloom in its place.
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It's been a couple of days since I last saw you... and I already miss you like crazy. I hope you're fine, my friend... please, email me if you need help, or if you just wish to talk, please, dear? And just in case... here's a cascade of flowers to cheer you up! :) Love you, Phaedriel - 07:21, 4 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Hey Kyoko. I feel that an apology to you is long overdue. I realize how stressful this can be, and I'm sorry that I've stressed you. Just, please, don't kill yourself over this, ok?
I don't think you realize this, but I can be a really nice person. The Esperanza debate just made me ditch my politeness in order to get my arguements across to Dev. My position on the matter of community building is still strong. You don't realize the importance of community here on Wikipedia. Wikipedia depends on the existence of a good community in order to improve and succeed. If we didn't have a community, who knows what will happen? The results wouldn't be good. I do hope that Dev will come to her senses and realize that, despite the decentralization of Esperanza, an organization devoted to building the community, the concept itself should not be neglected. She is a WikiProject Coordinator; she should know better. Then again, that's not my problem anymore. If it is still the consensus to write our own essays and link to them on the talk page, please tell me, so that I can write my own essay and leave.
Oh, and regarding the recent message I made here, Kaypoh did say, "Ed, your paragraph is good." I do think you should double check what people say before getting the wrong message about things. However, I should have asked Kaypoh what proposal he was referring to, because things would have been confusing both ways.--Ed ¿Cómo estás? 17:15, 4 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Hi Kyoko,
Thanks for your welcome and comment. It was good to see that you appreciated my contribs to the Don Quixote article, since I was discouraged by other disputing/lecturing me about Cervantes and the Spanish language, since I'm actually a specialist in the area! Thanks again, and take care. Bewtros 12:13, 5 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
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