Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Qazi Shibli

Qazi Shibli

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Qazi Shibli (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

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Trivial mention in Time, apart from that no other wp:rs, all sources mostly from kashmiri news agencies which are highly manipulated by these journalists. -- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 07:14, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Keep: Time never is a trivial mention, and it is not right for you to assume that Kashmir journalists are being manipulated whom I think you should apologize to. As you say on your user page, you edit with a Pro-India sentiment for articles related to Kashmir.--Lohen11 (talk) 07:48, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

• Lohen11, The TIME source has no byline, And isn't a significant coverage of him. Kindly share how does this meet WP:GNG. -- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 11:01, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Shibli was ranked fifth on Time's list (not a local little newspaper) of "10 most urgent threats to press freedom." You want to make the article disappear to deny a reality of this state.--Lohen11 (talk) 11:10, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Journalism-related deletion discussions. -- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 07:14, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Delete: Notability requires "multiple" examples of "significant" coverage. A single mention in a listcruft article with no real byline that is clearly a piece of propaganda against American geopolitical enemies doesn't count as significant. Every other source is just reporting on him being jailed or being released. That isn't enough to make him inherently notable as it isn't significant coverage. Macktheknifeau (talk) 07:59, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of India-related deletion discussions. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 08:15, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 08:15, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Comment: The nominator has a bias regarding articles related to Kashmir as stated on their user page. Seemplez ^{{{ping}} me} 09:55, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

• Seemplez, Ive mentioned that i might sometimes ' ' ' edit ' ' ' with a pro indian sentiment, that clearly doesn't mean that i put up these article for deletion because of it. There are 100's and 1000's of other article's out there related to kashmir, if i was biased to kashmiri article's i'd have posted all of them for deletion.I Check thoroughly the article's before putting them up for AfD, If i was biased i could've PRODded or CSD'd them. I am trying to clean up the wikiproject:jammu and kashmir, and clearly i've nominated multiple article's earlier which were unfit for mainspace and hence deleted. Please read WP:NPA and WP:AGF. -- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 10:49, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Jammumylove, this is neither a personal attack nor an assumption of faith. You have disclosed a bias on your user page and I have transcluded it here. Also your point that you don't have a bias because you didn't put every Kashmir related article up for deletion isn't really a point. You have disclosed a bias in editing. Why wouldn't your bias extend to AfD? Seemplez ^{{{ping}} me} 11:10, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

You have been nominating a lot of Kashmir related articles/articles about Kashmiris today. Seemplez ^{{{ping}} me} 11:35, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

• Seemplez, As mentioned i'm trying to clean up the unfit article's. There are plenty of them that don't fit the encyclopaedia 's standard and must be removed or corrected. What's wrong in there? I've done the same earlier as well not just today, check my AfD history. Why are you making it like a PA? -- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 11:49, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

• Seemplez, My Bias wouldn't extend to AfD because i properly write why it just be deleted. i don't give out biased opinions, i state the WP policies. and i am a human as well i make mistakes sometimes while nominating but i immediately rectify them and withdraw my nom. This article clearly has no Significant Coverage and hence i've nom it for AfD. -- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 11:54, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

User:Jammumylove, I do not wish to continue this. Happy editing. Seemplez ^{{{ping}} me} 12:05, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Comment By Nominator: By Manipulation of these article's i meant that the source are from local jammu kashmir based media agencies and these journalists can easily get themselves posted on there. There are no proper significant WP:RS. Also this article looks more of an WP:BLP1E i-e Significant for the Arrest of Qazi Shibli. And it can be redirected to it just like Arrest of Kamran Yusuf if not deleted. Also the only WP:RS Time Has no byline. Thanks. -- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 10:58, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

• Comment: Despite having some concerns regarding this subject's notability, I strongly recommend not to have any assumptions like Kashmir journalists are being manipulated. Regards. Kichu🐘 ^{Need any help?} 07:19, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

Kashmorwiki either read things properly or kindly don’t misinterpret. I’ve clearly written that these kashmiri media houses can be easily manipulated by these journalists. Not what you’re saying.-- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 13:59, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

Jammumylove,I havent misinterprated what you said. all sources mostly from kashmiri news agencies which are highly manipulated by these journalists ; this is your comment. You havent said they can be manipulated. You just said they are being manipulated. So its clear who is actually trying to misinterpret the statements. Do you have any evidence to prove your assumption? If dont,please dont make such type of comments in AFD's. Regards. Kichu🐘 ^{Need any help?} 14:20, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

• Kashmorwiki, you’ve written that Kashmir journalists are being manipulated and I’ve written all sources mostly from kashmiri news agencies which are highly manipulated by these journalists the difference can be spotted b/w these two by anyone who can read English which I doubt you can’t. -- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 16:19, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

Jammumylove, whether it is mostly or leastly or whatever it may be,I just wanted to say that you made up such type of baseless argument in an AFD. And in this encyclopedia, you dont have the right to say that they are manipulated unless you provide reliable sources or any other means as proof. Finally, such type of arguments should not be used in AFD discussions and this encylopedia is not a place to show your Pro india sentiments against its policies. Regards. Kichu🐘 ^{Need any help?} 16:34, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

• Kashmorwiki, There’s no way that could prove the internal things with these kashmiri media agencies but being from jammu and kashmir i know how easily jammu and kashmir based media agencies are manipulated. And moreover i never tried to push this as the reason for the AfD, My reason is simple, this article doesn’t have WP:RS and if it has kindly show, or maybe research and add them to this article I’d be happy to withdraw the nom. But until then it’s clearly evident that this article is eligible for AfD, and yes my pro Indian sentiments have nothing to do with this, i never said that kashmiri articles should be deleted for no reason. I have withdrawn many AfD related to kashmir just because they later were improved to be fit on pedia but this one isn’t at this version.-- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 19:07, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

• Jammumylove, As of now, I have no objection with your nomination of this article for AFD. What I said is that you should not add your own findings anywhere in this encyclopedia. See Wikipedia:No original research. This is applicable to everywhere in wikipedia. Your activity here has real consequences, because Wikipedia is in the real world. See Wikipedia:Wikipedia is in the real world. Regards Kichu🐘 ^{Need any help?} 03:42, 23 March 2021 (UTC)

• Delete per nom. Not notable person to have a BLP in WP.Kolma8 (talk) 12:42, 23 March 2021 (UTC)
• Keep per WP:SIGCOV. Particularly significant is a peer reviewed journal article which focuses on Shibli in more detail: Bilal Ahmad Pandow (September 2020). ""The idea is to kill journalism": Kashmiri journalists on what it's like working under lockdown, an internet blackout and a new draconian media law". Index On Censorship. 49 (3): 17-19. The Time article is also significant and there are other sources which I will list here. See Christian Science Monitor, Mint (newspaper), and "India: Abuses Persist in Jammu and Kashmir". Asia News Monitor. August 5, 2020.. All put together and this meets GNG. Appologies for no urls for some of the sources, but I accessed them through my university library and they are not available for free online. 4meter4 (talk) 01:53, 27 March 2021 (UTC)
  • 4meter4, Hi, CS Monitor and Mint is again a trivial mention, it doesn't discuss shibli significantly. Moreover they discuss more about his arrest rather then him. Check out Arrest of Kamran Yusuf, If shibli gets a stand-alone article then most of the arrest related article's deserve it as well. -- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 14:56, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

As stated earlier, the most significant sources are the peer reviewed journal article and the feature in Time. Neither of those are trivial mentions (no matter how much you insist otherwise), and support WP:SIGCOV. The fact that international press in multiple continents is interested enough in this journalist to mention him in context to world events in addition to these two significant sources is enough to satisfy WP:GNG in my opinion. Lastly, you seem to have a WP:POV agenda here which may be impacting your editorial judgment.4meter4 (talk) 15:21, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

• 4meter4, I Don't have a WP:POV agenda here, i am speaking on facts only. WP:SIGCOV states that Significant coverage addresses the topic directly and in detail I don't see any of the WP:RS covering this subject in detail. They do cover his arrest in detail and i've suggested that as well. This might certainly seem as WP:POV but you can check my AfD history,Being the nom it's my responsibility to discuss and I always reply to all the comments made to discuss things in detail. And moreover my POV won't be considered, because the closing admin's would obviously be more experienced than me to decide whether my comments made make sense or not. Also as far as Time Is considered, Macktheknifeau has already stated that above Notability requires "multiple" examples of "significant" coverage. A single mention in a listcruft article with no real byline that is clearly a piece of propaganda against American geopolitical enemies doesn't count as significant. Closing this discussion now. Peace. -- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 15:38, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

• Yes, I read that assessment and I disagree with the characterization. The Time article is clearly divided into 10 sections with headings profiling 10 individuals. One of those headings, and it’s succeeding section is devoted to Qazi Shibli. That’s not a trivial mention, but a featured profile. The fact that the magazine chose to simply biline the entire article with TIME Staff is not surprising or unusual in this kind of article, but it doesn’t change the fact that the article would have gone through TIME’s well respected fact checking and editorial review process, and therefore doesn’t diminish the quality or verifiability or significance of the work as a piece of evidence.4meter4 (talk) 16:18, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

• Keep:As per the latest findings by 4meter4. Kichu🐘 ^{Need any help?} 03:31, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Do not delete the article, i am a notable and famous journalist from jammu and kashmir and founder of the kashmiriyat which is the most famous media agency in kashmir, people use wikipedia to read and know about me. Do not delete this. Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2409:4050:2D8D:3916:6159:30D1:6F74:9CBA (talk) 07:29, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Spartaz ^Humbug! 23:10, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

• Delete Not notable, why are we even using the news-site he's associated for an article on him. -- Eatcha 05:34, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
• Delete Needs multiple independent sources giving significant coverage- he has one and several local ones he may be connected to. Perhaps a WP:TOOSOON, but not currently notable. Nightenbelle (talk) 14:59, 4 April 2021 (UTC)
• Note to closer. The offline peer reviewed journal article I cited above is a significant source. The deletion votes have not accounted for the offline reference when weighing WP:SIGCOV. That and the the Time story in addition to the global press coverage is enough to meet the multiple sources requirement of GNG in my opinion.4meter4 (talk) 00:37, 7 April 2021 (UTC)
• Keep Content is irrelevant for determining notability at AfD; limited evidence of BEFORE process. Extensive, multiyear, indepth coverage available, discussed by Amnesty International and in the 2020 Freedom House annual review. UCS, easily meets the GNG.

References

Regards, --Goldsztajn (talk) 12:29, 7 April 2021 (UTC)

• Reply Goldsztajn, limited evidence of BEFORE? how? I've already commented above that the subject Shibli does have SIGCOV but for just one event i-e his arrest which would be a BLP1E. Moreover i've suggest it to be changed as Arrest of Qazi Shibli, Just Like Arrest of Kamran Yusuf. Even the source's you've shared have covered his Arrest. -- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 17:20, 7 April 2021 (UTC)

• Comment The AfD nomination only deals with the content, it does not address the issue of notability, hence "limited evidence of BEFORE". If you wish to have a discussion about renaming the article, AfD is not the place. Regards, --Goldsztajn (talk) 00:15, 8 April 2021 (UTC)

Goldsztajn, AfD arises only when there’s the issue with the Notability. What else venue do you think the notability should be discussed at, if not AfD? As per my knowledge, we raise articles at AfD when they have notability issues and aren’t fir per standard of an encyclopaedia. If i am wrong do correct me.-- Jammumylove Talk to me or ^{CHECK MY RECENT WORK} 01:01, 8 April 2021 (UTC)

• Keep Times article cannot be considered trivial. There is significant coverage available on the subject though the article does require more details.defcon5 (talk) 16:20, 7 April 2021 (UTC)