Talk:Karachays: Difference between revisions
HagermanBot (talk | contribs) m 81.196.150.157 didn't sign: "Not Alans, but Turks !" |
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Actually I believe that Dr. Tavkul is a Turkish national, but has close relations with Karachays. It is also true that Karachays dominantly live in Paterson, NJ. Please ask your other questions regarding Karachays. Did someone have a chance to meet Karachays is USA? If so, what is your impression? Regards, Kemal |
Actually I believe that Dr. Tavkul is a Turkish national, but has close relations with Karachays. It is also true that Karachays dominantly live in Paterson, NJ. Please ask your other questions regarding Karachays. Did someone have a chance to meet Karachays is USA? If so, what is your impression? Regards, Kemal |
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== Not Alans, but Turks ! == |
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It is well known that the Alans was an more than 3000 years old and prestigious north-western iranian people of indo-european descent. During the first centuries AD, they competed with the other north-western iranian peoples of indo-european descent -the Sarmatians- over the stepe territory between the Don and Volga. After them defeat on the hands of the Huns in the year 370, they begun their westward migrations together with the Vandals, Goths and other migrating peoples. Some of the Alans settled in Ukraine, Pannonia, Gaul, Hispania and Africa (modern day Hungary, France, Spain and Tunisia) and assimilated with the local peoples. |
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Some of the Alans, retreated from the stepe into the Caucasus Mountains and become the modern - day Ossetians. It is remarcable that the modern-day Ossetians are still using the north-western iranian language and they are still calling themselves "iron" (meaning "of iranian descent"). But some of the Alans, retreated into the actual area of Karachay and settled on the northen slopes of the Caucasus Range. |
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After abb. 800 years, during the middle 11-th century, the Mongolian Invasion pushed the Turkic warriors of the stepes toward the Caucasus Mountains (as previousely the Huns pushed Alans)and the newly arrived Turkic tribes mingled with the Highland Alans. |
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The resulting people, the actual Karachays, are a Turkic - speaking people who adopted Islam in the 15-th century. Therefore, the Karachays have some partial Alan ancestry and they did not remained faithfull to the indo-european and iranian language, as the Ossetians did. Unlike the Ossetians, they preffered to bow in the face of the Turkic warrior's force and to forgive the language and the faith of them ancestors. Even today, the Karachay are not willing to re-descover the ancient Iranian languages but they preffer to mantain the turkish speach. |
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Therefore, they are not really entitled to call themselves "Alans". Maybe "the Alanic slaves of the Turkish nomads" will be an appropriate name for the Karachays. <small>—The preceding [[Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages|unsigned]] comment was added by [[Special:Contributions/81.196.150.157|81.196.150.157]] ([[User talk:81.196.150.157|talk]]) 12:14, 10 May 2007 (UTC).</small><!-- HagermanBot Auto-Unsigned --> |
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Revision as of 06:12, 16 May 2007
I only do this to help edit the text for Wikipedia. I have not touched the content of it whatsoever.
- Yours truly, I am Ludvikus 21:03, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
Customary Law of the Caucasion Peoples
THE CUSTOMARY LAW OF THE CAUCASIAN PEOPLES
Dr. Ufuk TAVKUL
Resume:
Social relations play an important role in social systems and they have been organised for a purpose. The social institutions, believes, customs and values of society are the parts of the social system. All of the customary values of society have been put in order by cultural norms. Those are the norms which have been adopted by the members of society. Norms determine prize or punishment for the members of society and they maintain the continuity of the social life and culture. The rules of the customary law are different according to the social structures of the societies. The customary law of the Caucasian peoples is related to their social structures, old believes, customs and economic structures. In the beginning of the 19th century if a man has violated a woman or a girl in Karachay-Balkar, he has been seized and has been judged by the court of justice which has been formed by the elders of society. He has been banished from society and he has never turned back to Karachay-Balkar. Some times the court of justice has executed the guilty man. In the beginning of the 19th century blood feud (vendetta) was an important custom for some noble families in Karachay-Balkar but it was not extensive as in Circassians, Ossets and Chechens. Sometimes the prince families of Karachay-Balkar reconciled the adversary families by organising a feast in the village. The promise has been so important for Karachay-Balkar people. If someone has not keep his promise he has paid 10 sheep to the people of his village. To marry within the same clan has been certainly prohibited in Karachay-Balkar. The members of the same clan have been accepted as close relatives and because of this kinship to marry within the same clan has been forbidden. To marry to the son or daughter of the foster brother or sister has been prohibited also. The court of justice in Karachay-Balkar has been named as “Tore” and the members of “Tore” have been named as “Aksakal” (White bearded). “Tore” of Karachay-Balkar has given its judicial decisions in respect of the customs of society. According to the change of the social structure of society “Tore” has changed its decisions. All of the individuals of society have had the right of being the member of “Tore” except the serfs and the slaves. The members of “Tore” have been elected for seven years. After the election of the new members of “Tore”, the new members have promised to be equitable and to judge justly in the presence of the people as below: The God of Sky I promise for the sun, the moon and the earth For the soil and the water of my earth For the stone and the bone For the wheat and the grass of my earth I promise to keep on justice The blood feud (vendetta) has been named as “Tlil Vasa” by Circassian people. If a prince has killed a serf the relatives of the serf have no right to revenge from the prince. The blood feud has been so important for the princes and the noblemen of Kabardins. The court of justice has promised to judge justly and after that has sentenced the guilty. In the 19th century if a Circassian has gone to a Russian castle for buying salt or some thing else, he has sentenced to pay six cows by the court of justice of his village. If he has repeated it he has to pay 24 cows. If he has promised not to be in contact with Russians and he has not keep his promise he has sentenced to death by the court of justice. Bu if he has accepted to pay 200 cows he has saved his life. The punishment of perjury has been 200 cows for a Circassian. A thief has paid 17 cows after he has paid the value of the goods which he has stolen. The punishment of murder has been execution for Circassians. The feet and the arms of the murderer have been tied up and he has been thrown to the river or the sea. To use a weapon to execute a murderer has been prohibited. After an executing sentence of a murderer the Circassians have burned the building of the court of justice. By doing this, the people has desired to forget the memories of the murder. There has been a prince family in every village of Kabardey and all Kabardin people have to submit the decisions of the princes. If the people have not agree the decisions of the prince they have had the right to object and right of petition to the Great Prince Of Kabardey. If a Circassian has been afraid of battle against Russians he has to pay two cows to his community. Among the Abkhasians the rules of the customary law has been named as “adat”. Among the Chechens the name of the court of justice has named as “Khiytirçiy”. It has been formed by the elders of society. The blood feud has been so important for Chechens. The punishment for killing a man has been 190 sheep, for a woman 130 sheep among the Chechen people. If the murderer has not approve to pay this punishment he has to leave the country. There is similarity among the Customary law rules of the Caucasian peoples. That indicates the common ethnicity, social structure and culture of the Caucasian peoples.
Dr. Ufuk TAVKUL
- It is a pleasure for me to assist in editing
the Karachai page.
- It would be useful to have someone to talk/write to
if I'm to smooth out some of the English. And the only name posted on this talk page is that of Dr. Ufuk TAVKUL. Are you--or is he--Karachai by any chance? Also, I'm just curious.
- I think I am a of Khazar descent!
- Therefore am I related to the Karachays?
- Yours truly, Ludvikus 21:28, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
- Therefore am I related to the Karachays?
The Karachays in the United States
live mostly in Paterson, NJ. Correct? Yours truly, Ludvikus 22:34, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
Dr. Tavkul and other points
Actually I believe that Dr. Tavkul is a Turkish national, but has close relations with Karachays. It is also true that Karachays dominantly live in Paterson, NJ. Please ask your other questions regarding Karachays. Did someone have a chance to meet Karachays is USA? If so, what is your impression? Regards, Kemal