User talk:Dissectional

License tagging for Image:Toolbandlogo.jpg

Thanks for uploading Image:Toolbandlogo.jpg. Wikipedia gets thousands of images uploaded every day, and in order to verify that the images can be legally used on Wikipedia, the source and copyright status must be indicated. Images need to have an image tag applied to the image description page indicating the copyright status of the image. This uniform and easy-to-understand method of indicating the license status allows potential re-users of the images to know what they are allowed to do with the images.

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This is an automated notice by OrphanBot. If you need help on selecting a tag to use, or in adding the tag to the image description, feel free to post a message at Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. 02:11, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

License tagging for Image:Soadbandpic.jpg

Thanks for uploading Image:Soadbandpic.jpg. Wikipedia gets thousands of images uploaded every day, and in order to verify that the images can be legally used on Wikipedia, the source and copyright status must be indicated. Images need to have an image tag applied to the image description page indicating the copyright status of the image. This uniform and easy-to-understand method of indicating the license status allows potential re-users of the images to know what they are allowed to do with the images.

For more information on using images, see the following pages:

• Wikipedia:Image use policy
• Wikipedia:Image copyright tags

This is an automated notice by OrphanBot. If you need help on selecting a tag to use, or in adding the tag to the image description, feel free to post a message at Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. 01:10, 29 July 2007 (UTC)

Recent image change in System of a Down

Hi. Recently you changed the image in the SOAD article, without leaving any copyright information on the image in question. The image is copyrighted so it will need to be removed and replaced with the previous image which was a "free" image from the commons. If you have any questions to ask me or need any pointers, feel free to leave me a message at my talk page, which can be done by clicking the "Whipp" part of my name. Happy editing!

Seraphim ^Whipp 10:35, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Hey. I also just checked your contributions. When editing a page, in the "Edit summary" box, it's good practice to leave a short statement of the changes you've made to a page; this lets other users know what changes have been made. :-)

Seraphim ^Whipp 10:53, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Hi. I notice you still haven't started to fill in the edit summary box each time you make edits. For a better understanding of why this is done, please refer to Help:Edit summary. Thanks.

Seraphim ^Whipp 16:04, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

SOAD talk page deletions

You should be archiving rather than deleting old discussion. Let me know if you need help. Flyguy649 ^talk _contribs 05:09, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi, you are still deleting old discussions instead of archiving them; as a result I reverted your edits. The page was archived recently by Flyguy649 so it's probably best left the way it is for now.

Seraphim ^Whipp 20:11, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

As you're new here, you're probably not aware that we don't remove any messages from the talk pages. If you need some help about understanding wikipedia procedure, feel free to ask.

Seraphim ^Whipp 13:10, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Welcome

Hi Dissectional, and Welcome to Wikipedia!

Welcome to Wikipedia! I hope you enjoy the encyclopedia and want to stay. As a first step, you may wish to read the Introduction.

If you have any questions, feel free to ask me at my talk page — I'm happy to help. Or, you can ask your question at the New contributors' help page.

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Good luck, and have fun. --Seraphim ^Whipp 16:08, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Re: System of a Down and Nu Metal

I have read some of your comments both on the SoaD talk page, as well as other user pages, and i still feel they are not a Nu Metal band. I would also like to point out that you mention SoaD labeling themselves as a metal band, but in reality they don't beleive they are a metal band, which is cited in the band's article. I think User:Revan made some good points responding to your thoughts of why you think SoaD fits Nu Metal. He's a little rude at times, though.^^ Here is what he said:

I read the similarities that guy did between nu-metal and SOAD. First of all, I laughed out loud while reading them, your point being as shallow as glass, ignorant and plain stupid. What the hell are you trying to do, you little wiki-nerd. I HAVE AN IDEA! Why don't we compare another band to the nerd's genre-definitions. Like... TOOL! Yea, let's turn Tool into a nu-metal band! Hm.. 'motivating a crowd to move with the beat'. Check. On the song 'Vicarious' singer Maynard James Keenan repeatedly sings with a raised fist (lyrics being generally angsty and somewhat hostile) 'why can't we just admit it, why can't we just admit it' with a very, very catchy 5/4 guitar/bass/drum-pattern in the background. I sure get motivated to move with the beat. Nu-metal!

Hm.. Guitarists making use of liberal palm muting. Man, If you tried to make yourself look like a fool, you succeeded. ALL OF METAL USE PALM MUTING!! Then, according to you, all metal bands in the world should be called nu-metal! Has it ever occured to you that maybe, uh, a band called, like, BLACK SABBATH influenced some metal bands in the world with that technique? You might as well say, like, 'Nu-metal makes use of distortioned guitars, whereas SOAD is a nu-metal band'. And Tool too, making more than just a liberal use of it. Check!

Hm.. First of all, B.Y.O.B. is dropped C#, a tuning which Tony Iommi used on 1972's genre-defining masterpiece 'Sabbath Bloody Sabbath'. Tool also have dropped guitars. And probably EVERY FUCKING METAL BAND IN THE WORLD! Not every, but you get my point. Once again making a fool out of yourself. Check! Hm.. Yea, solos. Tool guitarist Adam Jones does even fewer solos than Daron Malakian, which basically (according to you) makes Adam more nu-metal than Daron. You claim that the solos that are there don't emphasize on technicality and that most metal bands do that in general. Once again, making yourself look like a fool. I suspect your metal-knowledge doesn't reach any further than Iron Maiden's 'Belly of the Beast' or Sabbath's 'Paranoid'. Have you even hard Daron's solo on 'Lonely Day'? That's a hell of a technichal performance, if you ask me. Much more technically difficult than Adam's solo on 'Jambi'. Hell, it's going real good for Tool here! Check!

Hm.. 'Nu metal bands often feature aggressive vocals that range from melodic singing akin to pop and rock, guttural screaming and shouting from various forms of metal, hardcore punk, and rapping'. You say that the link between the VERBAL DECORATIONS on 'Chop Suey' should be considered. I'm turning you into a retard, sorry, but when one relies that much on a stupid article and with, obviously, no knowledge at all, it's hard to avoid. Tool will have no problem with this one. The 'rapping' and guttural screaming on 'Ticks & Leeches' is, like, nu-metal. Not to mention the contrasts between soft vocals and pure screaming on 'The Grudge'. Not to mention the 'rapping' on 'Rosetta Stoned'!! Geez, this covers a hell of alot bands. Nine Inch Nails! Nu-metal?? Nu-metal! Hm.. Yea, the song structure thing. The only 'nu-metal characteristic' (lol) that Tool ain't THAT big part of.. But we can't forget the verses on 'The Pot' and the many different verses and choruses on 'The Patient', 'Parabola', 'Ticks & Leeches' and the title song 'Lateralus' from 'Lateralus. In case you didn't know, man, verses and choruses existed a hundred years ago and your point weighs as much as helium. Geez, it's barely worth commenting.

Hm.. 'It is generally louder in the instrumental parts and the choruses than in the verses'. FOR FUCK'S SAKE! IS THIS ALL YOU GOT?! Oh man.. what a big genius you are, it's louder in the chorus than in the verse... Yea, wikipedia deals with absolutes, didn't you know? Hmm.. so to prove Tool also does this. Listen to the title song on 'Lateralus', you'll hear that the chorus is louder than the verse.

Hm.. Yea, Serj Tankian's work with other artists, nu-metal artists and hip hop artists. THIS SHOULDN'T EVEN BE CONSIDERED. WHAT A BAND MEMBER DOES OUTSIDE THE BAND DOESN'T MATTER! Did you know that Serj also've worked with Tool? In your case, that's a CLEAR proof to add 'progressive metal' to SOAD's infobox. Saul Williams did guest vocals on Nine Inch Nail's latest album, let's call Trent Reznor a hip hopper!

'Now with all these similarities between System of a Down and the nu metal sound and scene, I think that it is more than legitimate that nu metal remains in the infobox while progressive metal departs it'. Well, I object. I object as hell! These so called 'similarities' are as cheap as Bush is intelligent. If you all are okay with this, I'll go right away and add 'nu-metal' on Tool's infobox. Because what the fool did was stupid as hell, pure incompetence, relying on a stupid, shallow article. What we all know is that SOAD is an organic band with organic sounds. Their sounds and atmospheres don't recall the studio over-production that flourish Nu-metal, SOAD's atmosphere recall politics and action, in the name of themes, and influences from armeninan, greek and world music, pure creative freedom, in the name of music. As far as Mezmerize/Hypnotize go, they're a hell lot of more prog metal, than their previous albums are nu-metal, which they are not.Revan ltrl 23:43, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Now, as you can see, he did an extensive job of proving your similarities wrong. i would also like to point out that if you go to the palm muting article, it says the technique is most commonly found in thrash, speed and death metal. also, what you said on the SoaD talk page about BYOB and its verses everybodys going to the party..... being pop-like, those lines are metaphorical. the party is the war, dancing in the desert and blowing up the sunshine is like dropping bombs and going to war in iraq. BYOB stands for bring your own bombs. so i feel that the info box should be limited to alternative metal and the various influences link, and maybe experimental rock due to the different genres and elements they have brought into their music. Dissectional 04:50, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi. Thank you for sending me this message. I have nothing to add to my comments on System of a Down and the nu metal musical genre, and this is for the simple reason that this will never end. However, I think I will comment on the uncivility of the Wikipedian who wrote those counter-arguments. Calling my arguments stupid, I can accept. But the user goes on to call me names! This goes against WP:CIVIL, which is an Official Policy adopted by the Wikipeedia Community. These comments show an incredible amount of immaturity. Finally, the user threatens to harm another article's quality (Tool) to make a point. If this threat was to be put into execution, it would sound pretty much like something that would go against Do not disrupt Wikipedia to illustrate a point, a well known behavioral guideline in the Wikipedia Community. The user you describe (User:Revan ltrl) has had previous disputes with Wikipedians. Here, the user does not take into consideration another user's point of view and does not attempt to reach Consensus as the Official Wikipedia Policy suggests. The user ends his message with "fuck you", and I don't think I really need to explain how uncivil that is. Here, the user chooses to edit right away before trying to discuss what could be a very important part of the article. He/She claims "we all know" as if everyone agreed with him/her. Here, the user claims "It IS the turntables that makes nu-metal nu-metal!", which is factually incorrect (see the Nu metal article). I'm not going to review all of the user's contributions because I honestly have better to do with my time, but so far, I think that this user's way of editing isn't the worst way to get into trouble.

Anyways, have a nice time editing!
Zouavman Le Zouave 05:44, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Please Stop

Please stop. If you continue to blank out (or delete portions of) page content, templates or other materials from Wikipedia, as you did to System of a Down, you will be blocked from editing. Zouavman Le Zouave 05:49, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

im not sure what i did for you to say this, i havent deleted portions of th System of a Down article. Dissectional 06:19, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

This is the diff in question. Zouavman Le Zouave 06:21, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Based on the article discussion, more people agree on removing nu metal then those who think it should be kept. therefore, i felt i should remove the genre. Dissectional 06:24, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

I see. Next time, wait until consensus has been reached to make such edits. This can easily turn into a revert war. Zouavman Le Zouave 06:28, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

I have made a little survey in the SoaD talk page. The users will respond with Keep or Remove based on what they think should be done with Nu Metal. Hopefully we can get quite a few people to make the answer concrete. Dissectional 06:42, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

I just replied to the little survey with an official policy and an editing guideline. I would consider cancelling the "little survey". Zouavman Le Zouave 06:54, 13 August 2007 (UTC)