Talk:Pedophile movement

This is messed up...

See, Wikipedia thinks the only articles that are neutral when talking about controversial issues, are the ones written by the ones on the hated side. In this case, an article written by pedos. ForestAngel 07:12, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

As already discussed, Wikipedia actually blocks pedophiles, pedophile sympathisers and suspected pedophiles from editing any articles. Would you call this article biased? If so, in what way is it? Samantha Pignez 07:29, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

No, Forest, we dont all think that, but its an uphill struggle. Wikipedia blocks self identifying pedophiles it doesnt block people fopr making pro pedophilia edits, SqueakBox 22:34, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Where can I find the policy about blocking pedophiles? Martijn Hoekstra 22:47, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

You need to write to the arbcom. Drop an email to Fred or another emmber of the arbcom as this policy is not openly stated anywhere but based on a behind the scenes arbcom case, SqueakBox 22:55, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Is there a specific ArbCom case I could have a look at concerning these decissions? Martijn Hoekstra 23:19, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

To the best of my knowledage there isnt such an available case, its all been done behind the scenes, for reasons that appear reasonable to me; ie I dont think self identifying as a pedophile, by which I mean someone who says "I am a pedophile" on their user page, is acceptable and as far as I know nobody has ever been blocked for what one could call pro pedophile activist edits to the main space. There is a long discussion in one of Jimbo Wales archive talk pages that could shed some light on the issue, SqueakBox 23:27, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

I read some discussion on Jimbos talk page archives, which at least shed enough light on it to show it is a controversial issue, with a lot of discussion around it. I'll see if the questions I have regarding it can be cleared up through email. At any rate this is not the place for a long discussion about it. Martijn Hoekstra 23:45, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Well feel free to mail me or drop a note on my talk page if you want further clarification, SqueakBox 00:55, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Page protection

Right I applied for Page protection to be unlocked. it was declined with the following explanation

This article had to be protected twice last month due to edit warring. Looks like edit warring just resumed once the protection wore off last time so it seems likely that will happen again. Discussion on the talkpage seems needed so that a consensus can be reached before unprotection - perhaps avenues of dispute resolution could be explored. WjBscribe 21:16, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

What will it take for us all to be inagreement? Do we need dispute resolution. Your comments are urgently required, all of you, SqueakBox 22:27, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

A number of people including myself seem to think that the current state of the articles (barring the size of the now growing anti pedophile article, etc) is fine; fair and balanced. Others, I'm less sure about. Others including yourself and two now banned editors, unlike the majority of recent voters, seem to be constantly in disagreement with the mere existence of some of these articles. It is very hard to defend what is clearly a neutral article against people who think that it is an abomination that the issue concerned even be discussed. And I don't think that anyone is going to change their minds anytime soon. ●Farenhorst 15:32, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

I can't see anything productive happening between now and two weeks time that will improve the fortune of this article. I think that it should be unlocked. Samantha Pignez 17:09, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for that Sam. Farenhorst has also been indefinitely banned now and Mike D78 hasnt been around for 2 weeks so I think an unlocking would be entirely appropriate, SqueakBox 01:13, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

If you think my inability to spend as much time at Wikipedia as of late is going to enable you to carry out your typically disruptive and out-of-process edits on this topic, then think again, Squeak. Mike D78 06:04, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

Reorganized draft

A few editors are already aware of this, but I have been working on a draft version of this article for sometime now. I initially intended to enlist the help of a few other editors in working on this draft before I presented it to everyone else, but few others have seemed to have the time to do much with it, so I'm going to go ahead and seek everyone else's opinions.

This draft reorganizes the information in the article in a few places, the most significant change being the merging of the currently seperate claims and scientific views sections. This draft at this time is a bit longer than the current article; I added some more sources that I thought were of relevance, with the intention that others could help me make everything more concise (I have trouble doing this).

While we are discussing the future direction for this article after it is unlocked, I hope everyone will consider the substantial amount of work I have put into this draft. I believe the reorganization of information, as proposed by another editor, really improves this article, and I hope that others can help in fixing any problems some editors might have with this draft. Feel free to edit as you wish on this draft, as I have another copy saved elsewhere. Just try to make sure that all edits are constructive and keep the general ideas expressed in the article intact. Mike D78 08:20, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

The draft is fine. It's just that I don't know what else can be done to improve this article without going against consensus. ●Farenhorst 16:38, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

obsession causes uselessness

Reading the original - now blocked - article and all the discussion it provoked I can only conclude that the incredible obsessiveness to this subject which started in the USA and now seems to have spread worldwide makes any kind of normal objective description impossible.

People tend to forget that through the centuries sexuality tended to be linked to the process of maturity, or better said, being of child bearing age. This is/was still true in lots of cultures that aren't linked to our western civilization. Let's remember that Marie-Antoinette was 13 years of age when she married; this was quite normal for those days and it's not a very long time ago. Nowadays in many western countries kids have their first intercourse at age 14 or 15 even though we, their parents, would have preferred it to be different.

If we were capable of separating pedophilia more clearly from hebephilia, I think many of the senseless discussions would stop. For now I would suggest an honest but simple and factual description of the points of iew of those who violently oppose the existence of this phenomenon (in as much as you can oppose something that seems inbred in some people, similar to homosexuality and a lot more diversions) and those who feel that these sexual preferences have a right to exist.

In any case the topic should be concise and objective. If you make a total mess out of it that lastst many ages, only those who are totally obsessed with this topic themselves would take the time to read it all. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.95.42.204 (talk) 18:44, 2 September 2007 (UTC)