Talk:Nova Scotia

Motto

Does the translation of Munit hæc et altera vincit as "One leads and the other conquers" have any sort of official sanction or preference?

What it says to me is, "One defends and the other conquers." -- IHCOYC 04:15 Feb 28, 2003 (UTC)

The motto is translated as I'd expect it to be here: http://www.gov.ns.ca/legi/pubs/provhouse/symbols/coat.htm

I will change it. -- IHCOYC 04:20 Feb 28, 2003 (UTC)

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worth noting that NS is Canada's easternmost province, by virtue of the fact one square yard is on the grounds of Edinburgh Castle. And Lunenburg itself was on the back of the $5 for awhile. Kwantus

Is there any real reason the american colonization template is on the nova scotian page outside of the fact that Nova scotia was colonized by the french and english? I don't see the specific or unique connection to the province over any other colonized place. PullUpYourSocks 19:45, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)

without any agenda but to see the truth told from a global perspective, i have considerably altered and will continue to alter piece-meal the history section of the article. i am more than willing to discuss the rationale i have had for these alterations. i found how the article was written to suggest that nova scotia is today some "new scotland", which seems to me a tourism push to have it seen so, not the reality. moreover, i could find no evidence of there being any community of scots (lallans) speakers and any prevalence of scottish gaelic speakers (as opposed to individuals who use gaelic as a heritage language), so please let me know what material is available on this. regards, matthew

Matthew, I can agree with the sentiment. The tourism type push to "re-engineer" the history of the province into something it is not seems to speak loudly on wikipedia. Please review my changes on Music of Nova Scotia to see what I mean... facts as I have been able to find them 1) scots were here second out of the europeans (unless you count the Henry Sinclair story, which is not considered proven). French were first. BUT the scots settlement was withdrawn after only 3 years in 1624 when the place was handed back to the french. 2) there was no more significant scots settlement than any other part of north america/new england until much later, and I mean MUCH later, like highland clearances times, though to be fair 3) there were concentrations of scots of note, in Pictou, the north shore (gulf of saint laurence area) and by regiments of scots here and there who settled here. 4) The province was pretty much mainly settled by New Englanders, both opportunistic settlers moving in when the Acadians were expelled, and then a huge influx after the British lost the war... the loyalists. 5) it is real, they really did speak Gaelic in Pugwash, New Glasgow, Cape Breton, as late as the 1940s!! and I even read that low land Scotch was spoken in communities all over mainland Nova Scotia. 6) Its Not True to say Nova Scotia is New Scotland. As someone who can trace his ENGLISH PEASANT roots back 225 years in the soil of Nova Scotia and PEI I really have a problem with the idea that "we are all scots here". IF we have the energy some time we should start a myths of nova scotia page, or something. Until then, I will continue to try and make sure the MULTI CULTURAL nature of Nova Scotia appears on the pages of Wikipedia. WayeMason 19:40, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

I would agree with the fact that Nova Scotia is a not a purely Scottish settlement. The truth of the matter is that people from many places settled and continue to settle in Nova Scotia. I have highland scot, loyalist and ulster scottish roots, which seems to be a direct function of the area that I am from, the North Shore. I have also lived in the Halifax area where I learned about the German settlers on the South Shore, and the planters and Loyalists in the valley. Now having lived away for about 7 years in Saskatchewan, Alberta, and Manitoba, I realise that Nova Scotia is a lot more unique than I had known growing up. I am very proud of my predominantly Scottish heritage, and have taken the time to also visit Scotland. I was surprised to find out how similar the country looks to NS, and how Scotland is actually a mix of different peoples. I met many east indians, slavic people, and a whole lot more Irish than I would have expected there. So in fact I do find the name "New Scotland" quite appropriate. Broad generalisations like "Nova Scotians are all of Scottish decent" are never true, but living away and travelling I have found the more common myth is that Nova Scotia is some how the same as or part of Newfoundland, and I have been called a Newfie more times than I care to mention. In order to give a good picture of the culture of the province one needs to explain how Nova Scotia is not so much a melting pot as it is jigsaw puzzle with certain cultures predominating in certain areas. I doubt there is any sort of movement afoot to re-engineer the history of the province in favour of the Scots. But it is a unique thing that the scottish culture has survived in Nova Scotia in a way that it hasn't in other places settled by Scots. I live in Winnipeg now. The first white settlers here (Kildonan, Selkirk, and Red River) were from Scotland, but there is no trace of the music and language left to indicate that. Compare to the north shore communities in Nova Scotia where, people like my great great grandmother, who was born and died in the province without ever knowing english (gaelic only, as indicated by her will from the 1800s). Of course I don't know a word of gaelic, but I do know the traditional music because it was played at community dances, etc... I'm sure an Acadian person could tell a similar story. I think the article should definitly reflect all the different base communities in the province, and also the new ones. I know donairs aren't scottish, but it is the first thing I go for when I get home. Tourist oriented material is always full of broad generalisations... isn't all of Canada just Lake Louise and a singing mountie? --Mf135gas 06:13, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

Population & area

Where did some of these statistics come from? Statistics Canada reports a population of just under 937,000 as of April 1, 2005 (estimate only). Area is said to be 55,500 sq km (which does not match the table total of 55284 sq km). Density is either 16.88 for 55,500 or 16.94 for 55284.--BrentS 21:10, 14 July 2005 (UTC)

I changed some demographics information using the NS Dept of Finance. That stuff wasn't off by too much. --Jtn5 05:29, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

Settlement

Although the Foreign Protestants came to Nova Scotia starting in 1749 (and mostly from 1750 to 1752), they did not settle at Lunenburg until 1753. (They sojurned in Halifax and Dartmouth until the Spring of 1753.) And they didn't really settle "along" the South Shore so much as settle at Lunenburg initially and then inland. Hebbgd 17:27, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

This page states that Port Royal was founded in 1604 as the first European settlement in North America north of Florida. The page for Port Royal states that it was founded in 1605 as the second European Settlement in North America north of Florida. Which one is it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.204.96.130 (talk) 10:53, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

The _first_ european settlement on the North American continent (IMHO) was in Newfoundland about 600 (?) years prior to Port Royal and about 500 years prior to Columbus's trip. Lost Boy (talk) 18:53, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

Cabot

"The Italian explorer John Cabot did not visit present-day Cape Breton in 1497 as was previously claimed. The first European settlement in Nova Scotia was not established until 1604. The French, lead by Pierre Dugua, Sieur de Monts established the first capital for the" Anyone know why this change? Can we get a footnote about whether he came or not.... WayeMason 18:44, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

The evidence is terribly scare, beyond the fact that Cabot made it to some place in North America. The consensus is not that he landed in Nova Scotia (as currently pushed by said article and it's citation link, http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/journals/EH/EH33/croxto33.html). The continuing 'most-likely' location is still the island of Newfoundland, though a good half-dozen locations make some claim of note. Further, the only scholarly content of said link I can see is that it lists some references, and is hosted on a university website; it's nearly all conjecture (much of which is absurd and denotes a strong lack of familuraity with the Eastern Canadian landscape). Perhaps more appropriate would be "Cape Breton is considered by some scholars to be the first landing site.." or simular language that is more neutral? Either way, that link should be dropped.... Anonymous 22:00, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

The many names of Nova Scotia.

I removed the line "and Neuschottland in German." from the article. I think it is only appropriate to use names from the protected cultural groups in the province, Gaelic, French, Mi'kmaq ., and the translation of the name from Latin to English. I understand there is a large number of German descended people settled in south shore areas, but French group has its own province wide school board and protected rights under provincial law, Micmaq has treaties and reserves and protected rights, Gaelic has a college where it is taught, we have the MOU with Scotland, etc etc... I think German is important, but there are many groups (Polish and Arab come to mind) that are as large or almost as large. Logically we could end up with dozens of names on the page for each immigrant group. Thoughts? WayeMason 02:14, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

Absolutely no argument. A particular user, though I'm unsure if the same one as here, was on a recent campaign to add German notations to various Cdn. articles (e.g., the same for BC). I nixed each of them: one of them, however – for New Brunswick – was restored (and perhaps justifiably, which I've left alone) given the root of the name. E Pluribus Anthony | talk | 02:47, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

Why New Brunswick? As far as I know, as little as it may be, New Brunswick does not have a huge affiliation with Germany. Well, not one that most of the people in N.B would know of. Or, I may be just too lazy to read up, so please tell me why. User:Nachomania 21:49, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

If there were tonnes and tonnes of loyal germans after 1776 who moved there, that would be one thing. But I mean, by the late 1700s hadn't the "german" royalty in England been in England since the late 1600s? Isn't that where Brunswick came from? WayeMason 00:45, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

I agree with that removal. The German article translates Nova Scotia to Neuschottland. The languages provided on the page should be strictly the official languages. Andrew⁶⁴⁷ 15:26, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Many Names of Nova Scotia part 2

Last night I was cross checking the mikmaq name for Nova Scotia against the article.http://www.mikmaqonline.org says that Gespogwitg means southern, western Nova Scotia, and that Gespugwitg is the Annapolis Valley. It makes sense that mikmaq political divisions did not match present day provincial boundaries. There are also names for the Canso area and Cape Breton. Technically, Nova Scotia is part of Mi'gma'gi, the name of the Mikmaq nation. But this includes PEI and bits of NB... what to do?WayeMason 11:54, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

I suppose it would be okay to go with Mi'gma'gi, because...well, in most text-books, or at least ones I have read, all provinces/terretories [sic] are mentioned with their BNA names, like how the NWT would be still Rupert's Land, but it would tell about present day....I'm not exactly sure if that helps, but I've tried. User:Nachomania 21:53, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

introduction

To be strictly accurate, "Nova Scotia was one of the founding four provinces to join Confederation with Canada in 1867." should be changed to either "Nova Scotia was one of the original four provinces in Confederation in 1867." or "Nova Scotia was one of the founding three provinces to join Confederation in 1867." Three founding provinces of Canada, New Brunswick and Nova Scotia joined in 1867, forming the four original provinces of Ontario, Quebec, New Brunswick and Nova Scotia. Original sentence suggests five provinces -- "four provinces to join with Canada"!

Were they not Upper and Lower Canada at the time of Confederation? BNA Act 1867 refers to Upper and Lower Canada, and how they will be renamed Quebec and Ontario. People in Nova Scotia certainly knew the difference between "the French" and "Damn Upper Canadians." WayeMason 01:31, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

No, not quite. French colony of Canada became British province of Quebec. With the influx of the Loyalists it was split into Upper Canada and Lower Canada. Because of Lord Durham's report recommending assimilation of the French, Upper and Lower Canada were re-united as the Province of Canada in 1840. That single province had two administrative parts, namely, Canada West and Canada East. With Confederation, Canada was again separated under names Ontario and Quebec. Section 3 of BNA Act refers to three "Provinces of Canada, Nova Scotia, and New Brunswick" forming "One Dominion under the Name Canada". Section 5 divides Canada into "Four Provinces, named Ontario, Quebec, Nova Scotia, and New Brunswick". Section 6 provides that the part of the Province of Canada that formerly constituted the Province of Upper Canada becomes the Province of Ontario and the part that formerly constituted the Province of Lower Canada becomes the Province of Quebec. Section 138 says that the use of Upper Canada instead of Ontario or Lower Canada instead of Quebec does not invalidate deeds, etc. Hebbgd 20:09, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

That is fine by me... it flows well with teh "annexed to Canada" segment! WayeMason 01:22, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Proposal: New Article on Colonial Era

Since Nova Scotia existed as a British colony before it was a Canadian province, I propose creating a new page about the British colony as a seperate entity (perhpas Nova Scotia (colony)). This compares with Ontario and Upper Canada, BC and Colonial BC, or Newfoundland and Labrador and Dominion of Newfoundland. It doesn't mean that this article can't mention the history before 1867, but that the new article could go into much more depth. Kevlar67 19:49, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

I dunno, the history of the province is continuous, going back to 1740s and the establishment of British rule over Acadia. The legislature sat for over 110 years before Canada was created. There is no legal or constitutional break or change in Nova Scotia's law or governance at Confederation, unlike the changes in Upper/Lower Canada to Ontario/Quebec, and Newfoundland having limited self government at Confederation. I don't think this is needed. WayeMason 02:39, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Bibliography

I think that the bibliography has to go. Unless its actually a footnote from the article, I think it needs to be cut down. Its a great list but its not needed and it really bogs the article down. Thoughts? WayeMason 02:58, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Info Box - Dog

The info box does not show the provincal dog but is in the incoding . Can someone with knowledge of the coding fix this --D053 19:03, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism

Can't someone find a way to slap those immature students/governmental employees wrists a little harder than just blocking them for a quite short period after a zillion of warnings? I mean, atta boy for those of you who revert and revert and revert . . . but doesn't it get annoying over time? Thanks anyway for the effort! Lost Boy 05:54, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

I found a way ^^ Andrew⁶⁴⁷ 05:16, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

Satellite Image

Can anyone find a better satellite image? It's hard to work around the clouds I understand, but 1/5 of Cape Breton isn't even shown. (I shouldn't care since I'm a mainlander, but I do ^^). Andrew⁶⁴⁷ 15:29, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Assessment

When was the article last assessed? Has it been upgraded extensively since then? When will we know we have reached a higher standard?

Probably just lots of questions from an intermittent editor, but I feel they should be expressed. Andrew⁶⁴⁷ 15:33, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Capital of Nova Scotia?

The article says, "The official capital of Nova Scotia is the Halifax Regional Municipality community of Halifax." I cannot find any evidence of any Statute on record at gov.ns.ca which indicates that there is any "official" capital. May we have a citation for this interpretation of fact? (Goosnarrggh 16:39, 21 August 2007 (UTC))

I mean, if the geographic region comprising the former City of Halifax no longer has legal standing as a political unit, then how can it be considered as the "official" capital of anything? (Goosnarrggh 19:32, 4 September 2007 (UTC))

Official Language

May be not too intelligent a question, but ist not French an official language in all of Canada?Lost Boy 04:44, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

English and French are both official languages at the federal level. Only one province (Nouveau-Brunswick) has legislation currently in force establishing official bilingualism at the level of provincial jurisdiction. That is to say, all courts and official agencies of the provincial government in New Brunswick offer a guarantee of service in either English of French. No other province in Canada has legislation currently in force offering such a guarantee. (For example, official agencies of the provincial government in Quebec are not strictly required to provide service in English.) However, federal courts and offices representing federal agencies must provide equivalent service in both French and English, no matter which province the office is located in. As a courtesy, some provinces do provide services in the minority official language in certain areas as population warrants.

A separate clause of the Charter of Rights guarantees that first-language speakers of a minority official language have the right to public education for their children in that minority official language, no matter what province they reside in, as long as the numbers make it practical. Of course, that law applies in Nova Scotia. (Goosnarrggh 18:01, 4 September 2007 (UTC))

ok, thx! Lost Boy 04:31, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

On that note, what is the status of Gaelic in Nova Scotia? I understand that the government has enacted policies lately with the intent of encouraging people to learn and use the language, but is that sufficient to justify its being listed as an official language alongside English, and to the exclusion of other more frequently encountered languages such as French (or the Mi'kmaq language)? Goosnarrggh 11:19, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

I too was somewhat surprised to see Gaelic listed as an official language. As you say the authorities have become quite supportive of the language but i havent seen anything that would justify it being described as an official language. Can we get some references for it? 132.185.144.120 13:45, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

I see that Canadian Gaelic was added to the article as an official language by user Tom Jefford on August 31. I suppose if we want to obtain a reference, he's the best person to talk to about supplying it. Is there an accepted way of approaching users directly to provide citations for their edits on Wikipedia?

On a similar note, is there a possibility of reaching a compromise position by revising the article to give fair treatment to a sample of the "important" non-official languages spoken in Nova Scotia? I'm thinking perhaps a paragraph mentioning it in the Culture & Demographics section, or maybe even a link to a separate article. Goosnarrggh 17:18, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Christmas trees

I have been working on a series of articles in my user space about Christmas tree farming and have read that as far back as the 1930s some of the finest Christmas trees in the world come from Nova Scotia. I will post anything I compile here, in the meantime if anyone knows any good links to government statistics on Christmas tree farming in Nova Scotia, and for that matter, all of Canada, please do post them. Thanks. IvoShandor 09:57, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

I don't know of any internet sources, but I have a book for this one: after the Halifax explosion in 1917, the city of Boston provided relief for the devastated Halifax. In gratitude, every year a large tree is donated to Boston from NS for use in the city festivities. Andrew⁶⁴⁷ 11:28, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

I have just been reading up on this, and included a short bit about it in the article Christmas tree production in Canada (still a work in progress and in user space). There is an interesting aside to that from 2005. I will let you make your own judgments on that. Pity about the Halifax Explosion I had only heard of this in passing until I started researching Christmas trees. Low and behold, our article isn't half bad. : 0 IvoShandor 12:51, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

That article looks good to me, if you want to reference it. I remember that story back when it came out, as one of my college courses was having a debate about religious holidays. At the bottom of the CBC article there is a link to the NS Department that handles Christmas tree selection, perhaps that would be of some use? Andrew⁶⁴⁷ 13:16, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Nice, didn't even see that, not sure if I have used that one or not, but I will look around on it. Check out User:IvoShandor/Christmas tree farms work page to see how far along I am on this project, the Canada article isn't in main space yet but you can see which ones are at Template:Christmas trees, note I didn't do the main article Christmas tree, it needs some work. As a note about that article I linked, it's amazing how big of a change one word can be. IvoShandor 19:52, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Glad to be of service! Andrew⁶⁴⁷ 19:54, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Popular culture references

A couple anonymous editors have added information from a TV show that references Nova Scotia. I remember there was a section on the main page (I think it was just called "Trivia", but I would have to check the edit history) that contained similar information. Consensus to bring a "Nova Scotia in Popular Culture" section? Andrew⁶⁴⁷ 19:48, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I never received a response for this endeavour, so I went ahead with it. Andrew⁶⁴⁷ 15:16, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

Spelling Errors

Because editing of this page is locked, there are a few spelling errors I'm unable to correct myself.
    (kilometers to kilometres), (settelment to settlement),
and in an effort to maintain TRUE Canadian English spelling...
    (recognize to recognise) - (See "Wikipedia:Manual of Style (spelling)").
Perhaps the official editor could be so kind to take care of this for me. ~ 142.68.45.33 04:02, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

Canada's most southern province

The Geography section in part reads:

Nova Scotia is also Canada's most southern province even though it does not have the most southern location in Canada. That is held by Ontario. Northern Ontario keeps the central region of Ontario further north than Nova Scotia.

These sentences seem almost incomprehensible to me. I'm not sure if I caught its meaning correctly, but if I did, then I'd propose this as a new formulation:

Nova Scotia's mean (or median?) latitude is further south than any other province in Canada. However, it does not contain the southernmost location in Canada. That distinction is held by Ontario, but northern Ontario's landmass offsets southern Ontario and keeps its mean (median?) latitude further north than Nova Scotia.

Now that I've written it down, I'm not sure my wording is any better. Thoughts? Goosnarrggh 19:23, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

Comment moved from article

I wish somone would put somthing on this site about the induseries in Nova Scotia —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.82.184.63 (talk • contribs)

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