Talk:David Ferrie

David William Ferrie was an unusual person, probably misunderstood by many people. I was always interested in history and US presidents, and this took me into an interest in JFK and his assassination. I gravitated to an interest in the New Orleans aspects and this led to David Ferrie. I tried to chronologize the printed info about him, but a lot of this was unreliable. With the intent of "getting the goods" on him, I started collecting all available documents about him, and contacting people who knew him. I am about halfway through a book on Ferrie and am also working on a film about him.

There are two ways to look at him. In the traditional view, he was a villain, a man with CIA and organized crime connections who manipulated Lee Harvey Oswald in some way, resulting in JFK's death. But from those who knew him (and from documents), a counter-history emerges, of a much more complex man who felt that a chance crossing of paths with Oswald in 1955 led to false stories about him. In my study, I consider evidence relating to both views.

What do you think about David Ferrie? I would love to hear from any who knew him. — 64.12.116.5 11:24, 7 July 2005 (UTC)

No citation regarding JFK issues

How did all this information get posted regarding Ferrie's possible involvement in the so-called conspiracy against JFK? This is ridiculous. There is no citation given. All info related to JFK should be removed until citation is given. Garrison was someone that can not be taken seriously since he has been discredited. Oliver Stone makes movies and admitst that this film was not a documentary and he played fast and loose with the facts. I request removal of this nonsense. Jtpaladin 16:59, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

All of the information in the article related to allegations against Ferrie is accurately stated:. for the most part, "Jack Martin alleged that..."

To a certian degree I agree with the fact there is no citation, however most of the citations can be handled by reading "On the Trail of the Assassins" by Jisim Garrison, which by the way neither the book nor he has been discredited (it is difficult for a discredited person to be elected appealb s court judge ionn new orleans until the day he dies). Let justice be done though the heavens fall 22:01, 13 March 2007 (UTC) ……dorothy kilgallen learned of a meeting at Jack Ruby's club two weeks before the assassination, at which were present J.D. Tippett, the man who placed the JFK Wanted For Treason in the newspaper, a businessman and a fourth man whom she called the ferry man. Surely that proves beyond a shadow of doubt that there was, to put it mildly, something behind the curtains

Investigations

I have removed the anonymously added text, "Subsequent investigations have failed to link Ferrie to any direct involvement in the assassination or to an association with Oswald during his time in New Orleans" and added documentation of the investigative record of the Ferrie-Oswald connection. Joegoodfriend 20:41, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

William Gaudet

"In 1978, William Gaudet, a twenty-year CIA veteran…"

Perhaps it should be mentioned that the House Select Committee on Assassinations reviewed Gaudet's CIA file, but found no record reflecting any contact between him and the CIA after 1961. A CIA memorandum from 1976 said that,

The Domestic Collections Division (DCD) has an inactive file on William George Gaudet, former editor and publisher of the Latin American Report. The file shows that Gaudet was a source of the New Orleans DCD (Domestic Contacts Division) Resident Office from 1948 to 1955 during which period he provided foreign intelligence information on Latin American political and economic conditions resulting from his extensive travel in South and Central America in pursuit of journalistic interests. The file further indicates that Gaudet was a casual contact of the New Orleans Office between 1955 and 1961, when, at various times, he furnished fragmentary intelligence.

The implication of "twenty-year CIA veteran" overstates Gaudet's relationship. I recommend, "an informant to the CIA between 1948 and 1961" or "a CIA domestic contact between 1948 and 1961."

Gaudet testified in a deposition for the HSCA in 1978 that he had never met Oswald, although he had known of him prior to the assassination because Oswald had distributed literature near his office. Gaudet also stated that on one occasion he saw Oswald speaking to Guy Banister on a street corner. As to what he told author Anthony Summers in 1977, here is what Summers wrote,

For a man who declared himself plagued by mere coincidence, William Gaudet was strangely knowledgeable. While denying any involvement in the Oswald visit to Mexico, he made one remarkable admission. He said he had "known" Oswald in New Orleans. This once said, Gaudet quickly adjusted his statement, insisting now that he had merely observed Oswald handing out leaflets in the street, on several occasions, but always fleetingly. (Not in Your Lifetime, p. 266)

In his 1978 interview with Summers, Gaudet repeats what he told the HSCA, that he once saw Oswald talking with Banister. He also says, without further explanation, "I suppose you are looking to Ferrie. He was with Oswald … " (ibid.) Whether that ellipsis mark means that Gaudet had more to say that wasn't included, or that Gaudet just trailed off and left the sentence uncompleted, is not explained. With Oswald in 1963, or when? Gaudet may have been referring to Ferrie's and Oswald's participation in the local Civil Air Patrol in the 1950s. In any case, nowhere does Summers quote or paraphrase Gaudet as saying that he knew David Ferrie, or that Ferrie, Oswald and Banister had a working relationship. — Walloon 05:02, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, sorry I haven't looked at this page in a long time or I would have gotten back to you. Suffice to say the points you make are valid, alter the text or delete the whole thing if you want to, experience has shown that you always use fine judgement. Joegoodfriend 18:51, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

NPOV dispute

This section is not neutral unless it discusses Martin's history of mental illness and his retraction of his claims. Gamaliel (talk) 00:29, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

I don't get it. What "retraction of his claims" are you referring to? Joegoodfriend (talk) 01:57, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

I'm looking for a reference to it. Even if my memory is faulty on that point, the article should discuss Martin's long history of mental illness, alcoholism (Garrison initially called him "an undependable drunk" before embracing his account), and unreliability. Gamaliel (talk) 17:39, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Martin never retracted his statements, but the history of mental illness, and alcoholism should be placed in this article in a sentence or two-- for balance. Ramsquire ^{(throw me a line)} 19:29, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I agree with the editors. I'll take a stab at this and get back to you. Joegoodfriend (talk) 20:26, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Hey, the tag disappeared. Care to put it back?Joegoodfriend (talk) 04:46, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Ciravolo.jpg

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BetacommandBot (talk) 13:21, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale provided for Image:Ciravolo.jpg

See: image description page

Mtracy9 (talk) 20:48, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Consolidate Info

As Ferrie has no notability outside his involvement in the Shaw trial. I suggest creating a new article called "Persons related to the Shaw trial" or something to that effect, and merging this article into it along with the ones on Russo, Bannister, Martin, etc. Any opposition? Ramsquire ^{(throw me a line)} 23:04, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

There is already a Trial of Clay Shaw article. I think most of the figures you mention can be covered there. This article is better separate I think. Ferrie does have some notability just for his Marcello ties. Joegoodfriend (talk) 00:11, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

Very well then, I'll leave this one alone. But for size issues I will be taking out the Key Witnesses and Person section from the Trial article and creating an entirely separate article if I don't hear opposition in the next couple of days. Ramsquire ^{(throw me a line)} 23:12, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

On second thought, I think this is a good idea after all. I've been wanting to work Dean Andrews into an article for some time, but couldn't think of a good way to do it. Joegoodfriend (talk) 00:32, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Jim Garrison?

I contest that the words written or spoken by Jim Garrison are not an acceptable source given the lies contained in On the Trail of the Assassins (See http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/jimlie.htm) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 158.234.250.71 (talk) 17:57, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Only twice in this article is anything referenced specifically to Garrison. The first is his alleged conversation with Senator Long. I don't recall Long ever denying the conversation. The second is about Banister's activities. Since no one doubts that Guy Banister was assisting anti-Castro Cubans in running guns to Cuba, what's your point? And by the way, why do you refuse to sign your posts? Joegoodfriend (talk) 19:23, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Not only that, but without Jim Garrison, no one would have ever heard of David Ferrie (along with many others) and his connection to Oswald. So Garrison IS a prime source. He lost the Shaw trial but we all know he was onto something. He probably already found it and pieced it together until some broke part of the puzzle.