Talk:William Lane Craig

Bibliography

Is this listing in a particular order? is it worth ordering it chronologically? SolarBreeze (talk) 11:26, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Is he born again?

On his personal website here: [1] he says that when he as "sixteen as a junior in high school, he first heard the message of the Christian gospel and yielded his life to Christ." That sounds like it means he was born again. Am I missing something here? JoshuaZ 20:23, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi, sorry if I overreacted a bit to your edit. "Evangelical" seems more appropriate in describing Craig for two reasons.

1. Craig has opted to describe himself as evangelical and conservative but I've never heard him describe himself as "born again" so why would we put words in his mouth? To call Craig a "born again Christian" seems like either a guess or name-calling--neither of which are appropriate for wiki. (Well, unless you can cite Craig self-identifying as "born again", and maybe he does somewhere, but I haven't read it.)?

2. A slew of orthodox Christians down through the centuries have also "yielded their lives to Christ" and had a conversion experience, but no one describes them as "born again Christians," at least not in the contemporary understanding of that label, which, like "pentecostal," has evolved to mean something very specific, and which has a particular stigma that may or may not accurately represent Craig's brand of conservative, evangelical theology. Gilbertggoose 22:45, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

Hmm ok, so would the statement "he became an evangelical Christian at age 16" seem like a reasonable description? JoshuaZ 23:47, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, something along those lines sounds fine to me. That would definitely work. Thanks. Gilbertggoose 04:36, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

Discovery Institute

Is Craig a fellow of the Discovery Institute? If so, could anyone please supply the relevant evidence? There's a brief entry on him at the DI website, but no official connection between him and the institute is stated.[2] There's no mention of the DI on Craig's CV either.[3] Sir Paul 11:17, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

http://www.discovery.org/scripts/viewDB/index.php?command=view&id=85&isFellow=true

Xerxesthepersian (talk) 04:14, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

WikiProject class rating

This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 04:36, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

Criticism section

I am removing the newly added Criticism section shown below--added by "Jason1901"--for the following violations of wikipedia policy:

1. 1. The section is filled with Wikipedia:weasel_words in violation of policy: i.e. "There have been suggestions that Craig..." THERE HAVE? WOW! That is not particularly helpful for an encyclopedia entry.
   2. The section is not written from a Neutral point of view as required by Wikipedia policy. It is clear that the editor has an axe to grind with Craig, rather than simply reporting the facts of his bio. This teeters on vandalism and doesn't cut it for wikipedia standards.
   3. Specific statements are not verifiable: who is criticizing Craig for his "style and approach" in public debates. Who are these "commentators" (only one is cited, and he doesn't have his own wikipedia page--and he is just a layman with a computer and personal website. What books or academic articles has he published in which he criticizes Craig???The links/citations provided need to point to a notable, relevant, and credible critic--not just Joe Nobody's personal webpage. Every public figure has a thousand individual joe-blow critics. So what? My neighbor doesn't like Obama--can I cite him on a wiki? Wikipedia articles require NOTABILITY of all information, including notable criticisms (must rise to the level of being appropriate for an encyclopedia article), before they can be included.
   4. These edits are controversial. You must first attempt to resolve it in the talk pages, do not continue to place your disputed information in. Please look into this: Wikipedia:Edit_war

I am neutral and have no axe to grind on there being a criticism section, but it has to be done right. I thought about rewording it to make it work with policy, but it is just terrible. I would welcome discussing how to do one right, and I wouldn't get in the way of a criticism section that meets wiki policy. Adlucem2 (talk) 09:32, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

==Criticism==

Craig has been criticized for the style and approach he uses in his public debates. There have been suggestions that Craig uses these forums as an opportunity to preach and evangelize. In addition, many have observed that Craig's arguments which he presents in his public debates are over simplified. Commentators have also noted that while Craig encourages rational debate, Craig himsef admits that even if the evidence went against him, he would still believe in the truth of Christianity[4].

This whole criticism section appears to be based on and is cited to what looks like some guy's blog. Its hostname, JCnot4me, doesn't sound very professional! Just who is this "Mark Smith" guy who says he is author of this "Contra Craig" site? I don't think every academic out there needs a "criticism" section that lists the allegations made by some guy who has set up a "Contra" website. Each criticism should be separately sourced, even it means citing the same website again, since each requires support. The criticisms should be sourced to newspapers, magazines, or even better yet academic journals, etc. I consider myself an inclusionist but I think this whole section has to go as it currently stands on the grounds it has too many problems satisfying WP:RS.Bdell555 (talk) 01:35, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Creationist?

I am removing the catagories and mention of Craig as a creationist and I am disputing the characterization of Craig as such but am willing to discuss the matter and see if someone knows (with citation) something that I don't. I am aware of Craig's recent posts on his website, but I do not believe that he, at any time, identifies himself as a creationist, or a "progressive creationist." He does voice skepticism of macroevolution--but he has always maintained that macroevolution is compatible with Christianity--he says that his skepticism is not required by his theological commitments. I don't think it is fair to characterize him as a creationist if he himself does not embrace that label. Is David Berlinski, for example, also a "creationist" as he voices similar skepticism (without belief in a god)? Is Francis Collins a "creationist" because he believes, as Craig does, that the big bang carries theological implications? It isn't fair, or objective by wiki standards, to slap a label on someone when that person does not embrace the label (unless Craig has and I am just unaware of it--in which case I will yield upon seeing a citation). Adlucem2 (talk) 22:16, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

WLC is NOT a "Young-Earth Creationist". He is a "creationist" (note the use of the lower-case "c") more along the lines of Francis Collins and he (WLC) DOES agree with modern cosmology. I heard him something to that effect (I don't remember the exact words) in a debate I found on YouTube - "Willaim Lane Craig vs Lewis Wolpert"

Part 11 of 12 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ejresKtSBg

Part 12 of 12 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUsMHSeWvaA

The relevent part starts around 8:35 in part 11 and continues into part 12.

Bill the Cat 7 (talk) 08:30, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Collins isn't a creationist fitting the definition of creationism. BBiiis08 (talk) 17:55, 23 May 2009 (UTC)