Talk:2010 NFL draft

Grammar note

Just a minor thing I've noted on other draft pages: in American English, when you refer to a team by the location, use "its"; when you refer to a team by the team name, use "their." For example, "New England traded its . . .", but "The New England Patriots traded their . . ." Samer (talk) 01:32, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

In a move that raises many questions, the Jets acquired second-year quarterback Kevin O'Connell from the Lions Sunday in exchange for an undisclosed draft pick.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/jets/2009/09/06/2009-09-06_jets_oconnell.html#ixzz0Z3q26BT7

I believe there is an error

This is my understanding:

The Jets, not the Rams, own the pick in the fifth round originally belonging to the Eagles, as part of the deal that also sent Lito Sheppard to the Jets.

The Eagles, as noted, did indeed send a fifth round pick to the Rams as part of the Witherspoon deal, but not the one shown. The Rams now own the pick belonging originally to the Saints (The Eagles are shown as still owning this pick in the article).

The Eagles do not currently own a fifth round selection.

InsultComicDog (talk) 12:29, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

From what was on this page in the "Pre-draft trades" section, I saw that the Saintsgave the Eagles a fifth-rounder, and the Eagles giving the Rams a fifth-rounder. I assumed it to be Philly's original selection but it may be the one they got from New Orleans. As far as the Lito Sheppard trade is concerned, I thought it was Sheppard to the Jets for a fifth rounder last year and a fourth rounder this year to the Eagles. Thats what it had in the pre-draft trade section; I don't follow the Eagles or the Jets too closely so I could be wrong. Also, on the 2010 Philadelphia Eagles season page, the Eagles are listed as having one pick in the fifth round (the one from the Saints), maybe someone working on that page follows the Eagles more closely and could be of better assistance than I am. Frank Anchor^Talk 17:55, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

On draft day last year, the Eagles traded with the Saints. The Saints got a 2009 5th round pick (used on Thomas Morstead, and the Eagles got a 2009 7th round pick (later traded to IND) and a 2010 5th round pick. In the Lito Sheppard trade, the Eagles got a 2009 5th round pick (used on Cornelius Ingram) and a 2010 4th round pick. The Jets got Sheppard. In the Will Witherspoon trade, the Eagles got Witherspoon, and the Rams got Brandon Gibson and the Eagles' 2010 5th round pick, not the Saints'. Basically, Frank is correct. Eagles 24/7 (C) 20:37, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

But in the Lito Sheppard deal, the Eagles also gave back a 2010 5th round pick. I thought that was their own and the 5th traded in the Witherspoon deal was originally from the Saints, but it is possible I have them reversed; either way, the Eagles do not own a 5th round pick: one went to the Rams and the other went to the Jets. InsultComicDog (talk) 08:41, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

See http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/news/2010NFLDraftCentral.asp —Preceding unsigned comment added by InsultComicDog (talk • contribs) 09:41, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

You are correct then. As of yesterday, the wesite had the 5th round pick on there. There must have been a clause in the trade that if the Jets released Sheppard before March 5, the Eagles would owe the Jets that 5th round pick. Eagles 24/7 (C) 19:36, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

Trades section looks screwed up

The Trades section doesn't look to be organized right. It lists rounds 3-7, followed by conditional trades, followed by rounds 1-5. If there is a reason for this it should be explained. 96.238.136.233 (talk) 01:30, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

I'm in the middle of changing the formatting. I will be finished within a few days. Pats1 ^T/C 16:15, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

It seems unnecessary/silly to have pairs of hotlinks linking trades of the same pick. Samer (talk) 04:02, 28 March 2010 (UTC)

What do you mean? Pats1 ^T/C 07:14, 28 March 2010 (UTC)

Here's an example (highlighted in green):

#85: New England → Oakland (PD). New England traded this selection (85th overall, traded to Cleveland) and its fourth-round selection (because New England did not have a fifth-round selection at the time, when they acquired one, this fourth-round selection was traded back to New England) to Oakland for defensive end Derrick Burgess.
#85: Oakland → Cleveland (PD). Oakland traded this selection it acquired from New England to Cleveland for defensive end Kamerion Wimbley.

It doesn't seem useful to have links that cause the page to jump, only to find that it was the previous (or next) paragraph. Samer (talk) 15:50, 28 March 2010 (UTC)

It's for consistency. Other notes that link to different picks have the same format. Pats1 ^T/C 21:18, 28 March 2010 (UTC)

The NFL has released the full draft order including compensatory picks

See http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/16040/download-2010-nfl-draft-order InsultComicDog (talk) 21:35, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

Jets sent 2010 5th to Steelers

[1] Enigma^msg 04:24, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

List comments

I work a lot with lists, and there were a few issues in this list that pop out to me. So, rather than making the changes myself and disrupting the editors that have worked on this list a lot (and will continue to work on it a lot as the draft progresses), I thought I'd make my comments here.

• Per WP:REPEATLINK, all items in the table should be wikilinked, even repeated ones. The reason for this is because once your sort a table, the item you have linked may no longer be the first instance of it in that list.
• While I don't believe it violates any specific MoS requirement, I wonder why this list is split into multiple tables per round. Why can't this list be combined into one list with Round # being merely another column in the table? That way, a viewer can sort by, let's say, College, and see all players from that college that were drafted. That is impossible with the current layout. Or, if a viewer wanted to see all Quarterbacks taken or all the players taken by the Lions.
• Why is the table set to 100% width instead of letting the columns autosize themselves based on the content? My PC is 1920x1080 and these higher resolution monitors are only getting more popular. The table looks ridiculously stretched out on my PC.
• A minor complaint, the color for "Pro Bowler" seems a bit too extreme while the colors for "compensatory selection" and "supplemental compensatory selection" are almost too similar. Can a more subtle color be used for Pro Bowler like Template:Bkg and maybe a different color used for one of the compensatory selections like Template:Bkg?

Looking back at previous NFL Draft lists, it seems this list is fashioned like those. But just because that is the way it was done in the past doesn't make it right. Just some suggestions. Hopefully someone takes them into consideration.—NMajdan•talk 14:03, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

User:Stismail would be the one to talk to about those. He has done a lot of work on these articles over the past few years. Pats1 ^T/C 16:09, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

I left a note on his talk page pointing him here, although he doesn't appear to be particularly active anymore (around 50 edits this year). So, I would again ask those of you that are actively editing this list for your opinions. My aim here is to make this list better and I think my suggestions would help with that. Is there any hope of nominating this for FL in the future? Because, if so, I would expect these same points to be made (by me if no one else).—NMajdan•talk 20:50, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

Not completely inactive, just very busy. :) :(

In any case, a lot of the things you suggest are ones that predate any work I've done on the NFL Draft pages (e.g., the colors for Pro Bowlers, etc.). Links: I don't have any preference. Widths: I don't know how much of a difference it might end up making (thanks to the issue of picks being traded multiple times). Compensatory picks: I like the idea that the colors are relatively similar; in fact, I'd have no problem with making them the same color (and just using different symbols to indicate supplemental picks).

One big table: The pro: as you said, it makes it much more sortable (e.g., by position and school). The con: you lose the ability to easily jump down to the round that most interests you. That said, on the whole, I think the former outweighs the latter. Samer (talk) 22:07, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

Good point on the page navigation limitation of making it a single table. I wonder if we can come up with some workaround for that functionality? I agree with you that it's a relatively minor concern, though. — DeeJayK (talk) 22:13, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

These are all great suggestions — especially the one concerning a single table for the entire draft. That would really make the sorting functionality much more powerful and useful. Obviously this article is going to go through quite a few edits over the next few days, so right now is probably not the ideal to implement these changes. I'll take a swing at implementing them in the next couple of week unless someone expresses a powerful argument against the suggestions in this space. — DeeJayK (talk) 22:10, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

Agree, I'd hold off on any major changes until after the draft. It would be preferable if I get as few edit conflicts as possible during the next few days. Pats1 ^T/C 22:11, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for all the responses. Let me respond to some of the comments. Links: Well, this one is a MoS guideline, so it needs to be fixed on these lists. Width: Granted, the NFL Team column would indeed be large, but the other columns would be smaller. Again, this is based on what I'm seeing on my high resolution monitor. Compensatory picks: I'll leave the overall classification to you guys to decide, but I think as long as you do have separate categories, the colors need to be a bit more distinguishable. One big table: Some of you voiced concerns about losing the ability to jump to certain rounds. Well, take a look at what I did with one of the Featured Lists I created, List of Oklahoma Sooners in the NFL Draft. I used {{CompactTOC8}} along with {{anchor}} to create jump points. This list is longer than any of the NFL Draft lists so jumping to parts of the list was important to me as well. This allowed me to create links to the beginning of each decade. Timing of change: I agree, you should wait until the end of the draft before making any large scale changes, however, I don't think you need to wait to begin making the wikilink and color changes. I'm glad to see the responses! I really hope to see this list at WP:FLC soon.—NMajdan•talk 02:00, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

Actually, the MoS says that articles should adhere to it, (paraphrasing here) unless there is some compelling reason not to. I'm not saying there's anything compelling here, merely that there could be. Samer (talk) 02:10, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

I put last year's draft in my userspace and made the most of the suggested changes to the table. See how you like it. I know actually seeing how something looks is a lot different than simply discussing it User:Frank Anchor/2009 NFL Draft. Frank Anchor^Talk 02:57, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

That looks great! I removed the width settings to it auto sizes. You'll also need to use {{sortname}} so the name column sorts by the players' last name.—NMajdan•talk 03:25, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

4th round error(s)

Looks like you missed at least one team trade in the middle of editing, Pick #104 got traded to the Titans for example. 70.112.126.227 (talk) 15:25, 24 April 2010 (UTC)