Talk:Beer

• /Tags: FA & GA type tags.
• /Archive1: up to end of Dec 2005.

Varieties of beer

I think this section can safely be removed entirely, since it appears to be equivalent with its master article, Beer style. Does anyone oppose the removal of this section, leaving a BRIEF description and a link to Beer style?Shaggorama 11:08, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

Fat

What about the consumption of beer making one obese? Is this true, or a fairy tale? Maybe someone should write a small paragraph about it. --Michiel Sikma 23:49, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

See the article on beer belly, though it appears to be disputed. I agree that more should be written on this important topic. Nikola 07:21, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

How to taste beer

Where is the taste? I am surprised to note that in the whole beer project there isn't a single mention of the art of beer tasting, or any guide on how to taste beer, leave alone how to organise a beer tasting. I am not refering to an experts guide but information that anyone can use.

I feel that information on how to taste beer is worth its very own wiki document. I am passionate about this topic as I am associated with a site that focuses on it, namely http://www.tastebeer.com.au. Example articles: How to taste beer and Discover the truth about beer taste.

I am not asking to use tastebeer.com.au as a reference but I feel that a beer tasting document (or at least a section) should exist that provides visitors with information about beer tasting. I am looking for your input - I've never started a wiki document myself but if there're no takers on this subject I'll shall give it a try myself. Wyxel 07:13, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

Wyxel, the best way to go about getting other people interested is to start working on the article yourself. It may seem like it's not the "ideal" route, but that generally is the most likely way of getting your desired article moving or attracting other contributors to it. As they say around here, Be bold. BTW, it's an interesting idea, and I'd be interested in seeing where you head with such an article. --Daniel11 07:49, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

I agree with Daniel that a page on beer tasting would be interesting. It would link with Rating beer and with the BJCP. SilkTork 23:19, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

Beer around the world

This list is serves little purpose - the top link Beer and nationality goes to a similar list. If people wanted to gain specific details on beer within a country they could follow that link. And at least 12 of the countries listed are blind links. I suggest this section is cut. SilkTork 23:30, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

History

The article is getting much too long and there are way too many sections. I have moved the history section to a separate article. A short text should be entered here (under History) and 2 pictures have been removed that could be put back. Piet 15:37, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

Rate beer - too many sections

I've moved Rating Beer to this page. There are still too many sections. Piet 15:56, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

Sectioning

Made a section "Beer culture". I hope I did't break too much while restructuring. I will stop for now. There are still too many sections. Can "Etymology" and "Mythology" go to History of beer? "Ingredients" belong under "Brewing". Does History of beer need to be renamed? I think Beer brewing could be a separate article, so that section could be cleaned up. Then this article could have a clean structure, with a main article for each of these sections:

1. History
2. Brewing
3. Serving
4. Varieties
5. Beer culture

Hmm, "Related beverages" can go to "Varieties" I think. "Health effects" does not really fit under "Beer culture". Please give some feedback as I have been a bit bold. Piet 16:10, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

I'm following some of your suggestions to see how it looks. There is still some work needed, but certainly putting Ingredients in with Brewing makes sense. But that section now needs trimming as there is a fuller brewing article. I agree that Mythology and Etymology looked and felt inappropriate and are better served in the history section. SilkTork

Peer review

I have requested a peer review - see top. Piet 13:20, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

Alcohol content

Forgive me if I missed it, but does this article discuss alcohol content anywhere. I've heard that 18% is the highest that can be achieved without distillation. Any thoughts?--Hraefen 05:48, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

What would it take for the World to run out of beer?

As well as any alcoholic drink for that matter?

(--snip diatribe about family breakups, drunk driving accidents, et al.--)

Besides, when more and more better things to do get invented (i.e. Holodecks and especially Syntheholic beverages), why should we still need actual beer and beveragic alcohol? --Shultz III 02:48, 4 March 2006 (UTC)

Pouring a beer

Is this section needed? SamSmithBeer

Intro/FA cleanup

Could we shorten the intro and move some of the information provided there into the rest of the article so that beer better conforms to FA status? Leppy 17:52, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

I was just thinking the exact same thing. --Daniel11 18:27, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

some traditional midlands ales

banks's highgate ale abbots ale

Beer is evil.

What kind of rational thinking person would allow themselves by drinking this slop? Beer kills brain cells, damages the liver, and causes addiction almost instantly. People who drink make me sick.

And people who assume that a Wikipedia talk page is a personal soapbox without signing their comments make me sick. --Kiand 20:57, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

I would agreed that booze is disgusting, morally bankrupt, mentally and physically damaging and a massive waste to the individual and society. Regardless, Wiki is not a soapbox. Perhaps you can contribute to the teetotalism article.

Introduction

What's up with the introduction? It seems all wrong to me... 65.101.172.161 22:01, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Seems to have been vandalised; I've restored it again to an older copy. dewet|✉ 22:20, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Hogarth's Beer Lane

Might I suggest that Hogarth's eigtheenth-century engraving Beer Lane [1] should be included in the article if someone can show that it fits the copyright requirements etc. I think it is a very iconic image and one which immediately came to mind. Furthermore there is the precedent of the article on Gin which makes use of Hogarth's Gin Alley. SCRA5071 12:53, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

I think you mean Beer Street. We've already got the image, so go ahead and include it. --FOo 20:28, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

gluten free beer

someone has seen themselves important enough to remove this section. presumably they do not have a disease that one in a hundred of us have which means we cannot drink beer that is not gluten free. Thanks for that. How socially isolating do you think it is to be unable to eat out, unable to go on holiday, unable to go for a beer. Shall we just crawl into a hole and die? Or would you like to replace an important part of the article you have removed?

The above comment was left by User:Wikwobble. The removed section is a copy of a slightly earlier version of this article: Gluten free beer. In addition to that section I also removed links to Wikwobble's website - a link to which can be found on the Gluten free beer article. The Gluten free beer article is an assett to the site and people with an interest in the subject are requested to assist in its development. SilkTork 18:12, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

I DO NOT KNOW HOW MANY TIMES I HAVE TO TELL THIS GUY ! NOT MY WEBSITE ! Has it registered yet ? IT IS NOT MY WEBSITE. Please stop making that claim  ! User:wikwobble

I replaced the item, being very important to some of us, and it has since been edited. Whilst I may agree or disagree with the choice of editing, that's tough luck for me. What I appreciate is not having valid content wiped off, but being worked upon and (hopefully) improved. And it is not for me to say whether it is or is not better. I think it is important to note the difference between editing, and narrow-minded casting aside of an important subject which is pertinent to to the main section on beer (then linked to another section, in the same way as lager is). I also indicate to anyone reading, what is endanger of becoming a petty squabble, that there are a number of external sources listed, none of which I removed, and a link to an external non-commercial resource is very different to the existing link to Boddingtons, specifically, whether or not I would personally like to drink a pint of it. Unfortunatly, for many millions of us, that is not an option. Yet note, that link remains undeleted by myself.

SilkTork has not replied to any of my recent comments but has since replaced the section on gf beer with a blatant mistruth (that the gluten intolerent "can't drink beer"). Can I request that those who rework this section remain positive? Even if not positive, honest? User:wikwobble by the way, I have corrected the eror.

I have changed the page such that there is mention of gluten free beer as a type of beer. Which it is. I have added to SEE ALSO gluten free beer which makes sense on a page about beer. And under external links I have put glutenfreebeerfestival as a site which reviews beers - which it does. Please note that This is not my site, no matter what another user keeps ranting. If anyone (specifically those who seem to think they own this page) wants to change these modest edits, perhaps they can explain why any of these three items are not appropriate? It is a type of beer, it is a relevant "see also", it is a site that reviews beers. Deletion without comment would be very rude, wouldn't it ? That's why I have not done it ! User:wikwobble

Reorganising

Dear all, I have today done a little bit of reorganising. I just felt that the article, while full of good information, was a bit of a hotch-potch. Looking at my edits, I'm still not happy but not sure where to go. Can other wikipedians help with the Styles of Beer section, and also with how to further tidy up the rest of the article. Cheers Duncshine 16:25, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

The reorganisation was very good. A certain shape has now appeared, and the article is taking form. There's still plenty of work to be done, but at least at this point it's becoming clear what sections we need in the article, and what material needs to be included, and which belongs elsewhere. We may even be ready to create a To Do list! SilkTork 19:36, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

Beer Belly

This page said that beer bellies are considered to be due to over eating rather than the consumption of beer. It was my understanding that most scientists beleive Beer Bellies are due to alcohol's action in cellular metabolism. I understood that it inhibited the immediate use of fats in metabolism, and caused them to be stored instead. I also understood that heavy drinking of any alcoholic beverage on a regular basis could cause a beer belly. Please correct me if i am wrong.

AFAIK, you're not wrong. Beer is straight sugar and carbs. Do the math. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.236.216.252 (talk • contribs)

Perhaps you should check your sources, ingredients before brewing are primarily sugar - which is converted into alcohol and CO2. I don't know the nutritional ramifications of this, but your comment is unjustified. Sugar is a carbohydrate by nature so saying that beer is "straight sugar and carbs" is redundant. Just my 2cents. Celardore 21:18, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Most beer is about 200KCal per pint. So if you consume more KCal than you use you will gain weight. Simple maths and biology; if you put more in a tank than you take it it fills up. However, it is generallly thought that excess food consumption is likely to be the primary cause of a pot belly than having a few pints the occational night - and perhaps most importantly the 1000KCal kabab or pizza you have on your way home from the pub. 199.4.27.1 12:24, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

recent edits

There is a section on gluten free beer, above. Perhaps the last editor did not read it? Please do so now. If you cannot rationalise the edits (ie, answer the three points above), why should I not reverse them? Before I do, you now have the opportunity to deal with the issues. Why for example, would you want one beer review site but not another? What makes one valid and one invalid? Are you connected in any way with one of them? Do you lack perspective? You will note that my above comments accompanied my additions to the page. It seems only polite to include comments here when you brush them aside. Or is that only me? User:wikwobble

Right, lets take this one step at a time. Please respond to this attempt to communicate. I shall insert the link to glutenfreebeerfestival.com as a special interest site. It keeps getting deleted. It IS a special interest for beer, is it not? If not, it does review beers, so it can go in "beer review sites", can't it? Before you delete it, please consider which place it should go - one or the other, eh? Or give me some rationale for leaving the other links in? User:wikwobble

The current beer review sites listed are large, well established sites which have a wide variety of beers, including gluten free beers. They are notable sites, that is they are referenced by the world's media. They have significant web traffic as detailed by Alexa.com. There are many, many other beer review sites which we do not include as Wiki is not a web directory. There is a link to the special interest glutenfreebeerfestival.com website on the gluten free beer article. That is the appropriate place for it. Someone reading the general beer article would be looking for general beer links. Someone reading the gluten free beer article would be looking for a gluten free beer link. Gluten free beer is an important subject, and the article is developing very well. But it is not enough a part of the general beer scene to have a link on this page. We have to have limits as to what links are allowed on this page otherwise we would be overrun. The most appropriate place for the weblink is on the gluten free beer article - and a link is already there. SilkTork 13:25, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

garbled sentence

Can someone who knows what this is trying to say please clear it up?

As almost any substance containing carbohydrates, namely sugar or starch, it can naturally undergo fermentation, it is likely that beer-like beverages were independently invented among various cultures throughout the world.

Kisch 02:14, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

Someone added an "it" which threw the sentence. I've removed it. SilkTork 13:02, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

Ah yes, should have seen that. It just read very oddly. Thanks. Kisch 01:50, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Charlie Marx

The Clany Brothers did a song called Beer, Beer, Beer and it claims that a guy named Charlie Marx invented beer. Of course, this is not true but I want to know more about this Charlie Marx guy.

Beer Bread?

Please see Beer bread. This article is currently in need of more internal links. What are your thoughts for adding this into the main entry in an appropriate section?--Saintlink 23:29, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

• It's a bread recipe. I have added it to the breads cat. SilkTork 13:59, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Notability criteria discusion document

A discussion document has been opened up. Wikipedia:WikiProject Beer/Notability Criteria. Please put in your views either on the main page or on the attached talk page. If we want to list every brewery on the planet then I feel we should get some valid criteria behind us. SilkTork 16:43, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Skunked Beer

Shouldn't "skunked" beer be in the article? Here's a good reference: "Chemists Determine Cause of "Skunky" Beer," Scientific American, 22 October 2001:

These days, beer is the beverage of choice at chemist Malcolm Forbes’s laboratory meetings at the University of North Carolina. That’s because their latest project aims to determine why beer exposed to light tastes bad. The results of their research, an explanation for this so-called light-struck flavor, will appear in the November 5th issue of Chemistry—A European Journal.

The phenomenon of beer turning skunky after exposure to light has been reported in the literature for more than 100 years, Forbes notes, but only now have scientists pinpointed the underlying mechanism. Using a type of spectroscopy that exploits electron spin, the researchers compiled a computer simulation of the reaction by which light-sensitive molecules in hops degrade into unpleasant-smelling products. The mechanism is intriguing, Forbes says, because one part of the molecule absorbs light energy that then migrates through the molecule and causes a free radical to form at a different location. "The final product of the reaction turns out to be what we call 'skunky thiol,' an analogue of a compound found in skunk glands that produces a very bad taste and smell," Forbes says. The flavor threshold of the thiol is so low, the authors write, that concentrations of a few parts-per-trillion can make beer unpalatable.

Breweries typically avoid the degradation of their product by packaging it in brown or green bottles to protect it from light. "Understanding mechanisms behind changes in beer tastes is important because the world beer industry is hoping to save money by storing, shipping and selling beer in less-expensive clear glass," Forbes explains. Currently beer manufacturers that package their product in clear bottles can use modified hops that produce different free radicals and result in less of the foul chemicals. But one company minimizes the impact of the skunky thiols through more ingenious means. "Corona is marketed extremely cleverly," Forbes says of that beer, which uses regular hops but has been sold in clear bottles all along. The company suggests that drinkers add a slice of lime to enhance the taste of the beer, not to mention its odor.

So maybe someone should add this. --SafeLibraries 02:34, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Tags

I've put the GA & FA type tags into a folder reached at the top of the talk page. However, I'm not sure if this is correct procedure. Some of the links didn't work, so I had to manually insert the old content. I'm wondering if I've done the right thing. SilkTork 18:50, 16 July 2006 (UTC)