Talk:Barry Manilow

personal life

This could use a short blurb about his personal life. has he been married? has he had kids?

Married once, no kids

He was never married, surely? He's not into that.

Manilow is believed to be gay.

His initial claim to fame was playing the piano for Bette Midler (a gay icon) at the Continental Baths (a gay sex club). In 1998, he organized a benefit for the Gay Men's Health Center in New York.

As with many celebs, Manilow fears that outing himself would detract from his fan base, mainly middle-aged or older women.

Here's a photo of Barry with a "close friend" in Greenwich Village:

http://socialitelife.com/images/barrymanilow02.jpg

Any attempt at entering anything about Manilow's personal life (i.e. alluding to his sexuality) in Wikipedia is undone by his fans, such as Michael Zimmer (Mtz206).

Why's the photograph somehow relevant? A dude walking in the street with another dude - that makes them homosexual? As for "Manilow fears that outing himself would detract from his fan base", please present verifiable sources.

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7/4/06 This removal stuff is getting ridiculous and it smacks of censorship! Other celebrities have Wikipedia entries about somewhat sensitive things about their personal life, what makes Barry Manilow so sacrosanct that no one can talk about stuff that is mentioned right here on the discussion page? I was attempting to address the issue raised earlier on this page re: no information personal life. I put in a perfectly FAIR paragraph about the biographies and his personal life, everything I put in there was VERIFIABLE with legitimate sources...and it was removed by Wakeenah in its entirety! I would say that if enough people are discussing it here at this talk page AND throughout cyberspace...it is VERY relevant! I say that my paragraph should be re-instated (at least the part about the marriages) and this page then be put on a protected basis.Ladycascadia 22:15, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

• You are trying to push your own personal agenda of "outing" someone who has not stated publicly what his orientation is. I don't care if you have TEN books that say he's gay. Until HE HIMSELF says so, or until someone has published a verifiable photo of him making out with another man, it is irrelevant. Wahkeenah 23:45, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Wakheena, you do not not know me, so I feel it is out of line to accuse me of having any sort of "agenda" personal or otherwise. I really don't care one way or another. Despite what you might think, I have no "agenda" nor am I "outing" or "closeting" anyone here! I merely attempted to address the first issue addressed here at the talk page re: the lack of information on Mr. Manilow's personal life. Based on other Wikipedia pages about other celebrities and their relationships or lack thereof, I do not feel it is wrong to have that paragraph. The marriage and the cohabitational relationships are definitely verifiable. Manilow himself even wrote two songs about the relationships he was involved in. One was called Some Good Things Never Last which is available on the Barry Manilow album from 1989. The other is called A Linda Song which is on the Even Now album from 1977. That fact can be backed up by his OFFICIAL website, Barrynet. So perhaps you can tell us editors here how best to write about this topic without rejecting it out of hand or making any unfounded accusations. I happen to be a Manilow fan, and I do not mean any harm to him or his career. As for the stuff about Manilow's alleged orientation... like it or not, the speculation is there, and has been there for a long time. I didn't invent it. I also noticed that any references to his early career playing piano for Bette Midler at the Continental Baths has been excised from the page as well. Now this is a well known fact that any true Manilow fan knows, and has been for more than 30 years. So why can't that be discussed or placed on the page? Ladycascadia 02:24, 5 July 2006 (UTC) 02:21, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

• Your actions contradict your words. Wahkeenah 05:16, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

• Wahkeenah, you and others here seem to need the proverbial brick to fall on your head. Of course we cannot 'prove' whether Manilow is gay or not, just as you cannot 'prove' that he is not. What difference does it make if we have a photograph of it or not? Did we have any of Rock Hudson? No, but that didn't change the fact that he was gay. Manilow would have been crazy to make a public statement of his sexuality, as it would have severely hurt his record sales, and he is in business, after all. If Manilow doesn't want to talk about his private life, there is a good enough reason for it, and it's his decision, but the writing is clearly on the wall. Whoever removed the info regarding Barry's origins at the Continental is the one who has the "agenda", as stated elsewhere on this page. References to Manilow's sexuality do not belong on the main page, but the information about his professional origins does. Get over it! VertigoXpress 15:18, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

There is a very serious difference between something being obvious and something being a fact; given proper evidence, all facts are obvious, but not all obvious things necessarily turn out to be facts, and one should be very, very careful when stating something obvious as a fact.

It might be argued that it is YOU who has the "agenda" by completely removing the ENTIRE paragraph then making an attack such as you did in the history section accusing people of slander. This is NOT my intent. Fine, you win. I'm not going to participate in this section anymore. It's not worth all this aggravation. May I suggest, however, that you take a look at the wikipedia profile for say Jim Morrison of the Doors? There is a large section dealing with Morrison's personal life, some of which is unsubstantiated, but no one sees fit to go in there and expurge entire sections and then accuse others of having "bad" intentions. So what if Manilow is or is not gay? Does it make him a lesser musician? absolutely not! Johnny Mathis is gay and it hasn't hurt his fan base, nor has it hurt the fan bases of Elton John or Ellen Degeneres. Other stars are straight and it doesn't change a thing, either. I think that an emotionally mature fan or person is not afraid to discuss ALL aspects of a celebrity's life, but you needn't worry...I will not be coming back here since in your zeal to 'overprotect' you see fit to make unwarranted attacks on the characters of other Wikipedians as you did on Arniep and myself...and in doing, so you are indulging in a bit of a hypocrisy, don't you think? Enjoy your little "victory" against people's First Amendment freedoms Ladycascadia 20:29, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

• Slander is not covered under the First Amendment. Morrison is dead. Elton and Ellen have gone public. I don't know about Mathis. Unless someone either says they are, or someone produces a photo of them making out with a same-sex partner, or if it is proven some way (and not just somebody's opinion, in a book or whatever), then it is nothing more than gossip and has no place here. Wahkeenah 04:43, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

4/19/2006 That pic of Barry Manilow is NOT real it's FAKE. Barry is NOT gay!! And he said over and over that he's married to his music:)Well then I guess that explains his relationship with a WOMAN he's been living with(Linda Allen)

• Nope, he's not gay. Not that there's anything wrong with that. :) Wahkeenah 02:49, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Just so you all know....

Barry Manilow's NOT gay! He's been living with his lady friend Linda Allen. I don't know for sure if they are still together I heard rumours that in 2000 they broke up:( But now I heard that he's with some new chick named Keely(Watson?). Jeez it just goes to show you he's got a big heart and accepts people of all kinds and that does NOT make him gay in any way. Don't get me wrong I've got nothing against gay people but I know Barry's NOT one of them!

From a loving female fanilow

Comment: It is so amusing when one sees these clueless "fans," who worship a performer, and not his work. The key word is "worship," not "appreciate," or "understand." Mention that a peformer, composer, playwright, etc. might be gay, and these "fans" become apopleptic. That Mr. Manilow is gay is such common knowledge among urbanites and others in the music industry, that no one even raises an eyebrow. These "fans," wherever they live, with their heads (or whatever) in the sand, inhabit a time-warp all their own, oblivious even to their "idol." Ditto for his middle-aged hard-up female "admirers," for Liberace. Those women of a certain age, who repeatedly denied any hint of a suggestion of an innuendo that he might somewhow be *gasp* homosexual. Wake up; Manilow is gay. You can be a fan in spite of his serious moral failing, or whatever your sense of values decrees it to be. We can list these groups indefinitely: Elton John, Liberace, George Michael, Stephen Sondheim, etc. etc. Enjoy the music, and don't be overly concerned about what he does in his bedroom, or with whom. 66.108.4.183 13:58, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

• "Common knowledge" is otherwise known as "gossip" or "hearsay" or "original research", and thus is ineligible for entry in this website. More to the point, unless you've either heard Manilow say that he's gay, or have seen him making out with a man, you have no basis for this assertion. Wahkeenah 14:27, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

1. "Common knowledge" can mean gossip, hearsay, or rumor, as you say. But it can also refer to facts such as the discovery of America in 1492. 2. Even if I had first-hand knowledge of the kind you describe, it would be ineligible (and properly so) for inclusion in Wikipedia because of the prohibition on (a) no original research (b) no facts that are not publicly verifiable. Consequently: 3. I did not place my statements in the body of the article. 4. Nevertheless, I merely intended to point to one of a group of facts which, while not universally known, are indeed known to many people. All I was doing was responding, in the same informal vein as the previous writer, to the issue under discussion. My comments were not intended to convince anyone who does not want to be convinced. 66.108.4.183 05:54, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Your posting of this non-information on the talk page helps further the rumors despite the lack of any evidence. Wahkeenah 11:03, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

well, i work in the music biz and not everyone in it "knows" he is gay as is claimed here. First of all his private life is his private life and working in this business will not change what we know and don't know. The comparison with Liberace is not needed. First of all the public are a lot more understanding today and most people guessed liberace was a poofter before he died. Not so in Barry's case. He has not done anything to raise suspicions beyond mere gossip. 74.65.39.59 14:08, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

• Working in a gay bathhouse playing piano for Bette Midler doesn't raise suspicions about being gay? I mean, granted it doesn't mean he IS, but if this doesn't raise a few questions, please tell me what would? VertigoXpress 16:23, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

If you want to explore such speculation, find an online discussion forum. This is an encyclopedia. --MichaelZimmer (talk) 16:32, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Perhaps you are working on a stronger argument, since you deleted your original reply [1], but according to your logic, if BM played in a church, then he must be a priest, and if he played in a football stadium, then he must be a sports fan (or at least "raise a few questions"). Again, idle speculation has no place in an encyclopedia. --MichaelZimmer (talk) 18:40, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

I deleted my response because it seems as if the info about the Continental Baths has been restored to the article. I was under the impression fans were deleting it, out of fear it might confirm somebody's suspicion that Manilow might be gay. The inclusion of facts is the only thing that attracted me to this discussion in the first place, I never attempted to place any discussion about Manilow's sexuality in the main article, which this is not. Additionally, the whole discussion is absolutely ridiculous and a waste of time, as trying to explain the obvious always is. VertigoXpress 07:30, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

The Damned Crotch Pic

Ok. Given the category of entertainment Manilow is known for (ie: he's not Michael Jackson), the picture can be considered derogatory (and likely actionable) if we leave it up there either incorrectly characterised, or without proper primary source documentation that it was *actually* Manilow.

Since none of us (I'm assuming) wish to get Wikipedia *sued*, I'm sure we can all leave the picture *off* the page until such time as someone can provide the appropriate primary documentation as to whom the picture is actually of... right? You're on notice, people. Quit playing; we have a Sandbox for that. Baylink 19:49, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Re: that damned crotch pic

Here's proof it's really Barry Manilow: http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/manohmanilow

not my club but I heard he grabbed it recently in chicago. So there you go.

Re: that damned crotch pic

Here's more proof it's really Barry.

Chicago Daily Herald - Barry's show lacking in Barry

http://www.dailyherald.com/lake/main_story.asp?intID=3828384

Chicago Daily Herald - October 23, 2004

Barry's show lacking in Barry By Jamie Sotonoff Daily Herald Staff Writer

As he said hello to fans at the Allstate Arena Thursday night, Barry Manilow referred to himself as "your old friend Barry."

But our old friend Barry has developed some new interests (and a new blond hair color) since his popularity peaked in the 1970s. Perhaps a better name for him these days is Broadway Barry.

[ ... ]

Adding to the show's Vegas-y feel was Manilow's audience interaction and his crotch-grabbing dance move during "Copacabana."

I attended Barry's Vegas Show "Music and Passion" July 5th 2006, and I can verifiy that I did see him grab his crotch during the lyrics "show em what you got" (or something to that effect) on the Copa Cabana finale up on a raised platform. My take was that it was a bit toung in cheek, but I was surprised by it. (Birdsanctuary)

[ ... ]

Yeah; *that's* what I would construe as a primary source. Thanks to the anonymous poster (I've trimmed the quote down to avoid copyvio), and my apologies to those I was arguing with. Baylink 18:07, 8 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Image again

The next problem with that image is "what's the copyright status?". I've had an email (on the foundation mail) stating that the writer is the copyright holder and did not give permission for its use. As we have no source information and an active complaint, I have deleted it. If the source can be verified and shown to be suitably licensed, then we can replace it. Anyone got any relevant information? -- sannse (talk) 11:29, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Um, "screw it"?  :-) I'm certainly not going to fight for it.
--Baylink 22:50, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

penthouse 8 years?

Just wondering where'd they get 8 years from? I checked and can't find no mention of it in that article. nevermind found it and just fixed it. a fan

ALBUMS

I have been making articles for each album...they all look pretty much the same; picture, track listing, summary, and side info box. If you have any suggestions as to something else I should add, let me know. Weatherman90 15:31, 19 February 2006 (UTC)