Talk:OLX
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Note
I am a paid consultant to OLX and have created this draft article for independent review as per WP:COI rules. I am a frequent contributor to Wikipedia and try to abide by the Wikipedia five pillars WP:5p to the best of my ability. Please let me know if I can be of assistance, answer questions or do additional work.BC1278 (talk) 19:26, 8 October 2016 (UTC)BC1278
Reducing promotional tone
A number of very specific suggestions were made by User:DGG to reduce the promotional tone of this article User_talk:BC1278#Promotionalism:
- 1. Try not to write as a string of short one sentence paragraphs. That's how press releases are written. The same goes for many short sections. A list of products or subsidiaries, for example, does not need a separate section heading for each of them.
- 2. Avoid using the name of the company or person more than necessary. Again, that's how press releases are written. The best replacement is usually it, they, he, or she, which is ordinarily clear enough; but the firm or similar expressions (in lower case) are often acceptable for variation. Ocassionally of course with relationships between companies or peopel it is necessary to use the name in a brief form, but normally the name should not appear more than once per section or at most once per paragraph.
- 3. Don't give referneces consisting just of the title and the link; include always the name of the source, so people can tell at a glance if it is a PR or PR-influenced sources, or from the subject's own website. When this information is omitted, it immediately suggests that they probably are. This is a mistake often made by beginners as well as promotional authors, but it always gives a suspicion that the referencing for notability will be a problem. And of course try to use the company website as little as possible, and never include a reference from an obviously straight PR source, or mere mentions. Bad references detract from the good ones.
@DGG: I have created a new OLX draft, as requested, at: User:BC1278/sandbox/OLX-rev.
I originally created sub-sections for some of the major markets because there are many dozens of articles every month specific to the product offering in various countries. e.g. India, Kenya, Philippines, etc. From the press in those countries. I was hoping interested users would develop these sections as they saw fit. This is a platform with 330 million monthly users, after all. But the updating hasn't been even across markets, so I collapsed it all into one section called "Marketplaces", though I kept each country mentioned as its own paragraph. I have a feeling a ton of country specific updates are happening in the local language Wikipedia editions.
I didn't just correct issues from my own edits. For example, someone else added a new sub-section on Tradus.com, which I reduced to a sentence, with new sourcing, and moved to History. Someone added a sentence that suggested OLX closed their site for Kenya, when actually they just closed the office. I fixed that. Someone added in the lead they are the largest in Portugal, without citation. I found no source to support that, so I deleted it. Someone added that platform is the largest in Ukraine and cited only to a dynamic page on Alexa, so I removed that. The years for the rebranding and merger in the Philippines were wrong, so I corrected that. Someone added that the company is headquartered in Amsterdam -- but that is not in the cited source for that sentence and I couldn't find any reliable source that said as much. It is in the footer of the OLX Group website but I removed it anyway because the only citation would be primary.
I also updated monthly users and added the purchase of the largest online car marketplace in South Africa.BC1278 (talk) 00:37, 27 June 2018 (UTC)BC1278
I seem to have been working independently along parallel lines to you. My main remaining concern is the paragraph, present in my version also because I hadn't decided what to do with it, is the paragraph about Oxenford's views on his firm--I do not see the logic of saying that because 3 billion people use the internet, it pays to advertise on television. A good deal of your version is better than mine, and I shall now proceed to merge the two versions. DGG ( talk ) 15:04, 3 July 2018 (UTC)
- @DGG: On my proposed redraft, please note I replaced a handful of website URLs on the mainspace article with the one URL for the OLX Group. The live infobox has a very incomplete list of acquisitions or verticals, and not the main company website. Re: television. Some sources thought it interesting that a large internet business successfully did major marketing on television, which is rare these days. It's a contrary approach to the usual growth strategy of social media and Google. So I thought it was interesting fact to include, but it's hardly essential.BC1278 (talk) 14:57, 9 July 2018 (UTC)BC1278
- @DGG: Hi. Did you finish your edit of this article? If so, could you remove the flag on the article? I believe you said my rewrite was good and you were using some of it, plus your own edits. User:BC1278/sandbox/OLX-rev So I'm assuming the flag isn't needed anymore, if you're finished? Thanks, Ed. BC1278 (talk)BC1278
- @DGG: On my proposed redraft, please note I replaced a handful of website URLs on the mainspace article with the one URL for the OLX Group. The live infobox has a very incomplete list of acquisitions or verticals, and not the main company website. Re: television. Some sources thought it interesting that a large internet business successfully did major marketing on television, which is rare these days. It's a contrary approach to the usual growth strategy of social media and Google. So I thought it was interesting fact to include, but it's hardly essential.BC1278 (talk) 14:57, 9 July 2018 (UTC)BC1278
Request Edit
Hi. I am an experienced Wikipedia editor but have a COI here as a paid consultant to OLX.
A "news release" flag was added to this article in June 2018. Since then, I did an entirely new draft based on instructions by User:DGG and that editor adopted many of these requests, plus made many others. The article was already judged a "B" class quality article when it went through AfC, and contains extensive background about the subject from a wide range of international sources. This includes analysis, not just reporting of new events. I am, of course, happy to do even more work. But it seems like the "news release" box is no longer justified, in my opinion and I'd request it be removed. BC1278 (talk) 21:01, 25 October 2018 (UTC)BC1278
- I've learned that I'm not all that good at negotiating content, as compared to just going ahead and fixing it I want to really apologize, BC1278, if you were counting on me for more than I performed--it's my fault, not yours'. I have done a little fixing just now, but I consider it still reads promotionally, and I'm not sure anything I could do for a firm like this would really make it otherwise--this is one of the problems in writing about companies. That will be the case whether or not the tag is present. Anyone who wants may remove it. DGG ( talk ) 04:43, 27 October 2018 (UTC)
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1. Remove promotional tag.
Why? This article has undergone extensive revisions based on requests of reviewing editors. I have asked if anything else can be done -- and the editor who made most of these extensive requests, and published many of them, has declined to remove the tag because he says that any Wikipedia article about "a firm like this" is inherently promotional. But he says "Anyone who wants may remove it." At this point the tag is being used as a critique of Wikipedia policies concerning all company articles (and whether they should be on Wikipedia), not to indicate that editors should respond by improving this specific article. There are no further improvements requested by this editor, who spent a great deal of time reviewing this article, including a complete redraft he requested I provide for him. This is a misuse of the tagging system, which is to alert editors to needed improvements, not to express general Wikipedia policy preferences or, to diminish the credibility of the article outside of current Wikipedia policy parameters.BC1278 (talk) 21:01, 6 March 2019 (UTC)BC1278
Reply 6-MAR-2019
Edit request declined
The other reviewing editor said that
"I consider it still reads promotionally"
and I agree. The glowing reviews from Morgan Stanley (which, by the way, arent from Morgan Stanley per se, but are copied practically word for word from another source) is promotional.[a] The detailed descriptions of what the subject's site offers also delve into promotional territory. Text such as "In India, OLX began to aggressively advertise in 2011"
is textbook promotional language, along with "In addition to continuing free listings, the company in 2015 added priority space for premium listings. In 2016, it reported that 72% of all used cars sold in India were from transactions on its site. In 2016 this amounted to 200,000 vehicles with a value of $1 billion were sold monthly on the site compared to 95,000 cars worth $470 million in 2015."
Text like that makes me want to go right out and sell my car in India. As these are all correctable problems, the tag is well placed directing others to correct it. Spintendo 00:11, 7 March 2019 (UTC)
Notes
- ^ This is not the only text in the article which is insufficiently paraphrased from the source material.
Request edit
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Happy to respond with suggested fixes! I had exhausted specific requests from DGG.
Individual Countries
1. Delete the word "aggressively" in "In India, OLX began to aggressively advertise in 2011."
2. Delete: Morgan Stanley called OLX the "undisputed leader in India" in a 2013 report.[1]
3. Delete: "In addition to continuing free listings, the company in 2015 added priority space for premium listings. In 2016, it reported that 72% of all used cars sold in India were from transactions on its site. In 2016 this amounted to 200,000 vehicles with a value of $1 billion were sold monthly on the site compared to 95,000 cars worth $470 million in 2015."
BC1278 (talk) 20:10, 8 March 2019 (UTC)BC1278
References
- ^ indiainfoline.com. "Naspers-Backed OLX takes No.1 position in emerging markets". Retrieved 2016-09-23.
Reply 8-MAR-2019
- The article's promotional tone has been reduced.
- The maintenance template has been removed.
Regards, Spintendo 21:24, 8 March 2019 (UTC)
COI Requests for OLX Group - May 2021
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I have a COI and am desisting from making changes myself, but had some edit requests I feel would greatly improve layout (and lower down, some accuracy fixes). JeanetteM2 (talk) 18:57, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
Request - OLX brand vs. OLX Group
The page is currently structured for the brand, but includes just as much content for the parent company as the brand itself, also rolling in related brands that are owned by OLX Group but not OLX the subsidiary. Since OLX Group also meets WP:CORPDEPTH, I would say make a new topic for OLX Group, but since the brand content is pretty small and there's so much overlap as is, for now could we instead keep them together? I would request leaving the page name as is, but add a layout similar to this:
{{Infobox company
for OLX Group- Lead focused on OLX Group
==History==
- History of both OLX Group and OLX brand
==Marketplaces==
===OLX brand===
- Details about the platform, maybe tech minutiae not suited for broader "history" section
===Other brands===
- Summarize brands like Avito and Autotrader
If a brand section is added, start with this content?
==Marketplaces==
===OLX brand===
OLX was founded in 2006.<ref>https://www.olxgroup.com/story</ref>
In 2021, the OLX brand was active in Poland, Brazil, India, Indonesia, Portugal, Romania, South Africa, Argentina, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Bulgaria, Colombia, Ecuador, Kazakhstan, Peru, Ukraine, and Uzbekistan.<ref>https://www.olx.com</ref>
===Other brands===
As of 2021, OLX Group operated around 20 brands in around 30 countries. Among them were 321Sprzedane!, [[AutoTrader.co.za|Autotrader]], Autovit.ro, [[Avito]], Domofond.ru, fixly, Imovirtual, letgo, OLX, OLX Autos, OLX Brasil, Otodom, Otomoto, Properati, Property24, Selency, Standvirtual, [[Tradus]], Waah Jobs, and [[We Buy Any Car|webuyanycar.com]].<ref>https://www.olxgroup.com/brands</ref>
Request - Introduction Update
- The introduction doesn't really explain the relationship between OLX Group and its brands. Perhaps add in:
OLX Group was formed in 2016. It operates an international network of trading platforms. Its brands include OLX, [[Avito.ru|Avito]], Otomoto, and [[Media24|Property24]] among others, and it operates trading platforms in around 30 countries.<ref>https://www.olxgroup.com/story</ref>
- Also, possibly change first few sentences (with the
45 countries
removed for being 4 years outdated) from:
'''OnLine eXchange''' also known as '''OLX Group''' is a Dutch-domiciled online marketplace headquartered in [[Amsterdam]], and owned by [[Prosus]], the international assets division of [[Naspers]],<ref name=":0">{{Cite web|url=http://fortune.com/2014/10/29/olx-emerging-markets/|title=Meet OLX, the biggest Web company you’ve never heard of|date=2014-10-29|website=Fortune|access-date=2016-09-23}}</ref> founded in 2006 and operating in 45 countries.<ref>{{Cite news|url=https://www.ft.com/content/687f5a58-5807-11e6-9f70-badea1b336d4|title=Argentina: home to the majority of Latin America’s tech unicorns|last=Mander|first=Benedict|date=2016-09-19|newspaper=Financial Times|issn=0307-1766|access-date=2016-09-27}}</ref>
To the reorganized:
'''OLX Group''' is a Dutch-domiciled online marketplace headquartered in [[Amsterdam]].<ref name=":0"/> The OLX consumer brand originated as '''OnLine eXchange''' in 2006.<ref>{{Cite news|url=https://www.ft.com/content/687f5a58-5807-11e6-9f70-badea1b336d4|title=Argentina: home to the majority of Latin America’s tech unicorns|last=Mander|first=Benedict|date=2016-09-19|newspaper=Financial Times|issn=0307-1766|access-date=2016-09-27}}</ref> OLX Group is owned by [[Prosus]], the international assets division of [[Naspers]].<ref name=":0">{{Cite web|url=http://fortune.com/2014/10/29/olx-emerging-markets/|title=Meet OLX, the biggest Web company you’ve never heard of|date=2014-10-29|website=Fortune|access-date=2016-09-23}}</ref>
- OLX brand paragraphs - the intro's last two paragraphs are very outdated, and place too much focus on one brand out of 20, namesake or not. Perhaps move the last two paragraphs to
===OLX brand===
?
Request - New "Locations and Headquarters" Section
There isn't currently a summation of global dispersion on the page (that isn't random), so please add something akin to:
==Locations and headquarters==
OLX Group is headquartered in [[Amsterdam]]. OLX Group has offices in Turkey, South Africa, India, and Indonesia, among others. It has South American offices in Brazil, Peru, Colombia, Argentina, and Ecuador, while European offices are in Portugal, Poland, Germany, Bulgaria, Ukraine, Romania, Russia, Spain, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Kazakhstan, and Uzbekistan.<ref>https://www.olxgroup.com/brands</ref>
Request - Infobox Update
A number of updates are needed in the infobox, in part to change the details from the OLX brand to OLX Group.
- New Logo: Please replace OLX brand logo with one for the parent org.
- Old Logo: Delete, or move
[[File:OLX_New_Logo.png|thumb|150px|OLX brand logo]]
into page as thumbnail?
- Founded: Remove
2006, Argentina
as it's inaccurate and not in page itself, change to 2016
- Industry: Remove
[[Internet forum|forum]]s
, as it's not common descriptor
- Founders: Remove Grinda and Oxenford (more appropriate for infobox on just the OLX brand)
- Key people: Change to
Romain Voog (CEO)
- Number of locations: 30+ countries (2021)
- Number of employees: Change to 10,000+ (2021)
- Parent:
[[Prosus]] ([[Naspers]])
- Revenue:
$1.281 billion (2019)
- Subsidiaries:
[[Avito.ru|Avito]], [[AutoTrader.co.za]], [[letgo]], [[Tradus]], 321Sprzedane!, Autovit.ro, Domofond.ru, Fixly, Imovirtual, OLX, OLX Autos, Otomoto, Otodom, Properati, [[Media24|Property24]], Selency, Standvirtual, Webuyanycar.com
- Please also add location city:
| hq_location_city = [[Amsterdam]]
| hq_location_country = [[The Netherlands]]
Request - "Criticism" Heading and Layout
Since I have a COI, I'm hesitant to ask for the removal of negative information or request significant modification of the "criticism" section. But, there are some layout issues that run afoul of the Manual of Style.
For example, the criticism heading runs afoul of WP:CSECTION. To fix that, either:
- 1) The heading could be removed, with the content condensed into a paragraph focused on the 2018-2020 fraud/racist content developments before placed into the chronology of history (or the OLX brand section).
- 2) Rename the heading. As WP:CSECTION recommends, maybe it could be changed to the less loaded "Fraud policies," maybe "Anti-fraud policies" or "Fraud management"?
Either way, the criticism is all focused on the OLX brand, not the OLX Group parent company, so possible to have the layout reflect that? If the heading is kept, maybe a layout like this:
==Marketplaces==
===OLX brand===
- (content)
====Fraud management====
- (content)
====Auctions of racist items====
- (content)
===Other brands===
- (content)
Request - Merging "Individual Countries" and "History"
OLX having a separate "history" and "individual countries" section seems odd and redundant, since both are so international. Possible to merge them together in a chronology? To save time, feel free to use version I crafted a version below (I didn't modify any meanings or add/remove facts, just rearranged for readability.)
Extended content
|
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HistoryOLX brand and Naspers (2006-15)Fabrice Grinda and Alec Oxenford launched the OLX brand in 2006 as a Craigslist alternative for the world outside of the United States.[1] OLX is the leading classifieds website for users in UAE (under the name of dubizzle.com), Egypt, Bahrain, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Kuwait, Oman and Qatar. Since its launch in 2005 by J.C. Butler and Sim Whatley, dubizzle.com has become the number one platform for users to buy, sell, or find anything in their community. dubizzle is an OLX company.[2] In 2006, it acquired Mundoanuncio.com, a classifieds site targeting the Hispanic market and in 2007, it made an investment in Chinese classifieds site Edeng.cn.[3] In 2009, the company partnered with social network Hi5.[4] Naspers acquired a majority ownership in OLX in 2010, as part of its classifieds division.[5] Naspers increased its ownership share of OLX to 95% of the company in 2014.[6] OLX launched in Nigeria in 2012.[7] The company purchased its Nigerian competitor, TradeStable.[when?][8][9] However, in February 2018 OLX announced the shut down of its Nigerian office and a complete pullout from Nigeria.[10] Philippines classified ads site Sulit rebranded as OLX in 2014.[11] The merger in the Philippines between OLX and Ayos Dito redirected Ayos Dito users to OLX as of 2015.[12] In April 2019, Carousell acquired OLX Philippines after receiving an investment from Naspers.[13] The deal also gave OLX 10% stake in Carousell.[14] In Indonesia, in March 2014, OLX took ownership of Tokobagus.com, and rebranded to OLX.co.id.[15] In July 2020, BeliMobilGue rebranded itself as OLX Autos in Indonesia [16] OLX Cashmycar, a joint venture between Frontier Cars Group (FCG) and OLX in India was announced in November 2018. [17][18] This was offline expansion of OLX online platform. [19] OLX Cashmycar launched its 50th store in February 2019.[20] In December 2020, OLX Group launched OLX Autos in India.[21] CEO of OLX Autos in India is Amit Kumar.[22] In April 2014, Naspers' Middle European classifieds site in Romania, Bulgaria, Kazakhstan, Belarus, Hungary and Poland rebranded as OLX.[23] In September 2014, the Ukrainian classified Slando.ua rebranded as part of OLX Group.[24] In November 2014, Naspers formed a joint-venture with Schibsted to co-own OLX Brazil.[25][26] Formation of OLX Group to present (2016-21)In Kenya in 2016, farmers reportedly used OLX to sell their produce and livestock, especially chicken and cattle.[27][28] In late 2016 it launched Tradus as a heavy machinery classifieds site.[29] OLX Group ceased its operations in Venezuela on September 11, 2018, due to complex political issues and lack of free dealing.[30][31][32] In 2019, Avito was the second biggest classifieds site in the world after Craigslist.[33] In April 2019, online classifieds marketplace Jiji.ng acquired OLX Group businesses in Kenya, Ghana, Uganda, Tanzania and Nigeria.[34] In Pakistan, OLX receives nearly 30 million views per month. In India, about 99% of OLX's listings come from used mobile and electronics, used home and household goods, and used cars and bikes.[35] OLX's operations in India, like other online retailers, has attracted fraudsters and faced problems with people selling stolen vehicles. In combatting fraud nearly 25% of the car listings get rejected by its systems to protect users from fraud.[36][37] In December 2020, OLX Group launched OLX Autos in India.[38]
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