Talk:Mary Shelley

Style

Although it has been mentioned before, I'd like to recall attention to the fact that the language used in this article - though generally erudite and well thought-out - is still unencyclopedic. As a notable example, cf the following quote:

Can one miss the darkling reflection of the Beckford character's "insolent desire" to "penetrate the secrets of heaven" in both "Alastor" (...) and Mary's acclaimed piece (...)?

While quite appropriate in an essay, the use of rhetorical questions seems out of place in an encyclopedia. I would have liked to have taken a stab at editing this (and other similarly unencyclopedic sentences) myself; however, I am experiencing some trouble in the conversion of these "essayist" paragraphs into factual paragraphs, since I have no references to cite and no expert knowledge on the topic.

Can someone with references/expertise take a stab at de-essay-fying the article? Mip | Talk 01:25, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Rewrites

I am in the process of expanding on and improving the article as much as I can, because it was very incomplete and inaccurate before. Once I've done the spadework, I'll run through and put references for the more speculative aspects of it. I just want to get a reasonably "final" version before I work through all my Shelley biographies and cite all the sources, especially as changes beget changes on Wikipedia. I'd appreciate any comments or corrections that people might wish to make.

I finally signed up for an account too. For some reason, my university wouldn't let me do so before.

Stillusio 07:57, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

This is much appreciated. It will need extensive footnotes even for the unspeculative parts if it is to be a feature article.--Grahamec 09:27, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Yes. I'm going to sit down and footnote it all eventually. :) Stillusio 18:19, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Lauritsen

You might want to check out John Lauritsen's soon to be published "The Man Who Wrote Frankenstein" in which Lauritsen argues fairly convincingly that Shelley, not his wife, was the author of that work. It's listed at Amazon. -- "4 tildes is not my name" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.234.32.85 (talk • contribs) 00:25, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

I will certainly pick up the book, because Frankenstein is part of my research interests. That argument is one that crops up sporadically in the field of Romanticism, however, and I've never been particularly convinced by it. Frankenstein seems to depend too much on Mary Shelley's own life experience for its content and its themes for it to be her husband's work. The detailed scientific knowledge and the parallels with Percy's work can be explained by his editing. Stillusio 18:19, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

It should be noted that John Lauritsen is considered an "independent scholar" and spent much of his career claiming that the HIV virus is not the cause of AIDS (which goes against scientific fact). His main thesis is that Mary Shelley couldn't have written Frankenstein because she was not educated enough, which is entirely incorrect. She had no formal education, but with an intellectual father and mother, the assertion that she was too dim-witted to have written is absurd, since we have writings from her when she was eleven. The hypothesis that Mary Shelley did not write Frankenstein is not at all new. When Frankenstein was first published anonymously with a preface written by Percy, it was thought that Percy was the author. However, most scholars say that Frankenstein is very different in tone and style from Percy's earlier works, and that it would be much more convincing to say that Mary Shelley had a hand in Percy's later works, as we know that Percy died before much of his work was published and that Mary did indeed heavily edited this work. Moreover, we have manuscripts in Mary's handwriting with editorial notes in the margin in Percy's handwriting, which make clear that he is not the author. Lulurascal 19:48, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

Needs more sources

This article is dreadfully lacking in references. Where did all of the biography come from?
Seraphim Whipp 13:26, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Recent Controversy

I read a newspaper article recently about a theory that PB Shelley wrote Frankenstein. I wante to know if anyone else heard this ro read of it, and should the controversy be included? Thanks. Odin 10:55, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

I don't think it should. The book has yet to be published. But the author, Lauritsen, is most famous for trying to claim that the retrovirus HIV is not the cause of AIDS, going against scientific fact. He is a gay rights "activist," and wants to make Frankenstein an example of male love. This book would not have gotten so much attention if it hadn't been for Paglia's praise in Salon. We should be wary of this guy, and his claims. He's not so believed when science can prove him wrong, but now we are discussing something that is a little harder to prove false the negative. Let's let the book come out and see how the Shelley experts handle this. Lulurascal 20:02, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

I am on a listserv of Romantic scholars - the people who participate on that listserv tend not to respond positively to the "Percy wrote Frankenstein" argument. It has very little evidence to go on. One of the important things to keep in mind when writing about a book like Frankenstein is that wikipedia articles are supposed to represent what the majority of critics agree upon. I can tell you right now that the majority of critics agree that Mary Shelley is the primary author. Percy edited a bit, but the arcane disputes over which words don't belong here, in my opinion. Awadewit | talk 12:34, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

Orgy?

When she wrote Frankenstien, didnt they have all have sex with each other?? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.38.227.76 (talk • contribs) 13:06, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Place of death

From "Authors & Artists for Young Adults Volume 20" (Editor Thomas McMahon, Patricia Campbell, et al.) p. 193, it states Mary died in Bournemouth, England. I have made the change accordingly.

— Enigma55 ^{(talk • email) 02:25, 27 November 2006 (UTC)}

The Oxford Dictionary of National Biography states that Mary died at home, 24 Chester Square, London on February 1, 1851 and was buried in St Peter's Church, Bournemouth on February 8, 1851. -Steve Cottrell 08:56, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Mount Chamonix ?

At the time the sentence "Je vous n'entends pas" probably meant ("I don't understand you") rather than ("I don't hear you") moerover I have not read Frankenstein, but the sentence "a very famous scene in Frankenstein set on Mount Chamonix" seems dubious, Chamonix is a town on the slopes of the Mont Blanc. Chris CII 15:24, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

moved from top by Jclerman 04:38, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Check on these other un-wikipedic mounts [1] Jclerman 04:45, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

And the neuro-ophtalmologists saw the place: "The next day, there were excursions to the famous Château de Chillon (where Byron was inspired to write his famous poem “The Prisoner of Chillon”), to Mount Chamonix, to the vieille ville of Geneva, or to the recently opened Patek-Philippe museum, which features more than 2,000 treasures of Geneva’s renowned watchmakers, known as 'la Fabrique.'” [2]Jclerman 04:51, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Ok, it looks like there are a 54 references to a "Mount Chamonix", of which some 17 point to the death of an american climber (Richards). The scarcity just tells that they are mistakes, compare to the 6.6 million references to Chamonix of which the first is [3] and look up also Chamonix Chris CII 22:33, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Internal Inconsistencies

In the penultimate paragraph of the section titled “Shelley” it states that the first-born child of Mr. and Mrs. Percy Shelly, Clara, died in March of the year 1815. However, in the penultimate paragraph in the section titled “Return to England,” it states that an infant named Clara died outside of Venice, inferably sometime between March, 1815 and the summer of 1822. Unless the Shelleys named two of their children Clara, this is a glaring internal inconsistency that casts doubt on the factual accuracy of the article. Indeed, it is claimed in at least one other internet source that Shelley bore four children, not three as implied in the article.

Odietamo 07:21, 6 October 2007 (UTC)