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Talk:Janice Raymond

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by 121.72.27.210 (talk) at 05:56, 13 June 2010 (→‎BLP violations). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Perhaps this article requires a disambiguation page if there are more than one notable Janice Raymonds. Iluvitar 20:51, 31 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

the founding mother of transphobic feminism

The paragraph in which that sentence appears needs to be re-written to remove bias, or else deleted. Skoojal (talk) 00:53, 5 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Funding Sources?

She appears to have been successful in accessing funds from some otherwise conservative US government agencies. Has this been the subject of controversy within US feminist circles? Calibanu (talk) 04:35, 23 June 2008 (UTC)Calibanu[reply]

Misandrist Transphobe

It’s sickening that she gets taxpayer funding. Felicity4711 (talk) 23:28, 16 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed. 65.183.135.231 (talk) 02:17, 25 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Attempted substitution of new article

Another editor attempted to replace the article in full, with another article, which, among other things, deletes any reference to her infamous campaigns against trans womyn, including her outing Sandy Stone, her authorship of The Transsexual Empire in 1979, including the new intro she wrote in 1994, etc. While correction of specific details is appropriate, this whitewash was not. 72.83.168.24 (talk) 22:05, 29 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. This article in the past has gotten perilously close to PR-generated, as much of her body of work is specifically aimed against trans people (specifically women). It's her shtick. 98.225.230.65 (talk) 20:38, 2 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

How can we improve the article?

At first glance, the article has several issues:

  • When was Janice Raymond born? The two versions give two different years. Citations would be very helpful, but, in A Passion for Friends, she discusses joining a convent before Vatican II, and she mentions that most novices joined at between 17 and 25, which seems more consistent with 1943 than 1949.
  • It might help to note that she was a nun - which would be important to several of her works.
  • It might help to include a complete listing of her works.
I am amazed that such a hateful woman ever aspired to become a nun. --98.225.230.65 (talk) 20:31, 2 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]


I think the article still has systemic problems

I suggest restructuring the article in roughly chronological terms, for example 1 putting her life history in the first section, 2 The Transsexual Empire, her involvement in the boycott of Olivia Records, etc. in the second section, 3 her involvement in anti-prostitution/anti-sex-work activism, and the related research in the third, 4 and her development of (cultural) feminist theory in the fourth. Moreover, this emphasizes that her academic career, activism, and publications dealt with many of the same issues. Marja Erwin (talk) 21:42, 23 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think I have the time to pursue this project alone, but I'm glad to try to help other editors, and I can help with research.
I'm not really sure how to go about this. I have read, and available:
  • Raymond, 1994, The Transsexual Empire (2nd Edition)
  • Raymond, 2001, A Passion for Friends (2nd Edition)
Both of those will require caution due to the restrictions on primary source interpretation.
  • Nanda, 1990, Neither Man Nor Woman: The Hijras of India (who favorably cites Raymond on p 151)
  • Namaste, 2000, Invisible Lives
  • Julia Serano, 2007, Whipping Girl
I don't have any sources handy for her support of the criminalization of sex workers. These are strictly concerned with her anti-trans activism. Marja Erwin (talk) 21:03, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

BLP violations

This article seems to becoming the victim of apparently biased editing. I removed several BLP violations and examples of vandalism from this article, but an editor, Marja Erwin, restored them - including an unsourced claim about the sexuality of the subject of this article. Marja Erwin actually accused me of 'whitewashing' this article for removing the BLP violations and vandalism. I have now removed the unsourced claims about Raymond again, and I am prepared to keep doing that if they are restored again. BLP, which I recommend that Marja Erwin read, allows this. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.72.30.64 (talk) 00:09, 4 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

In the past, this article has had problems with people removing any reference to Raymond's transphobic career. I mistook 172's edits for another attempt to remove the references. As far as Raymond's sexuality goes, she discusses it in her books, and other writers do the same. Marja Erwin (talk) 00:22, 4 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
My first reaction was correct. 172 attempted to remove the multiply-sourced statement about Raymond's political attacks on trans womyn from the lead. Marja Erwin (talk) 00:33, 4 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

If you look carefully at the edit where Marja Erwin first reverted me, you'll see that it readded BLP violating material. That included an unsourced claim about Raymond's sexuality - although a source was later. Other unsourced claims were also readded, until I removed them again.

Someone put up a POV Dispute to the notes

I'd like to know what their concerns are and if they have any suggestions for improvement.Marja Erwin (talk) 14:26, 7 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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