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Of the sources currently available concerning Ruffley's near miss, only one is claiming that it's a suicide: The Sun, which is hardly the most reliable source available. Since this is a fairly serious allegation, our BLP policy applies. I have amended the text & resourced accordingly. --Ibn (talk) 14:18, 19 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Presently this is the type of speculative journalism that WP:BLP requires us to keep out of the article, things may change but for the time being it should not be included in the article. Off2riorob (talk) 10:17, 20 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
It could be libelous to say he attempted suicide. The news sources are drawing a conclusion that he "appears" to have committed suicide without stating facts sufficient to draw that conclusion. Making the bald assertion that he attempted suicide or appears to have attempted suicide could leave the project vulnerable to legal action, which is exactly what BLP exists to protect against. -Rrius (talk) 18:27, 20 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Well, the mail actually quotes an eyewitness saying he jumped, so "apparent suicide attempt" seems reasonable. Unless he suddenly decided he and the train could occupy the same space at the same time, we're covered. -Rrius (talk) 18:29, 20 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
@Pigsonthewing: the string "gossip" appears on WP:BLP, as does "harm". Are any of the newspapers making the allegation in a position to state it as a fact? Is the material, to quote the policy, "presented as true". --Ibn08:08, 21 June 2010 (UTC)—Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.47.134.151 (talk) [reply]
The only reference in BLP to gossip says: "Avoid repeating gossip. Ask yourself whether the source is reliable; whether the material is being presented as true; and whether, even if true, it is relevant to a disinterested article about the subject.". The sources given above are reliable; the information presented as true; and the information is relevant to a disinterested article about the subject. The only reference to harm (other then in reference to groups) is "the possibility of harm to living subjects must always be considered when exercising editorial judgement.". Given that the term "suicide attempt" is widely used in the press, no harm can be caused by using it here. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits16:47, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
We are advised to take a conservative approach not a tabloid titillating journalistic sales figures approach. what are the BBC calling it? Do we have a citable comment from the subject that it was a suicide attempt? Are the police treating it as a suicide attempt? Off2riorob (talk) 16:55, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
We do have a direct quote from a witness that he jumped and a report that the police have ruled out an accident. Short of suddenly believing you are Superman and can use super-strength to stop the train, there are not a lot of reasons to jump in front of it. Short of having even the slightest bit of evidence he lost his mind, it does appear he attempted to commit suicide from the evidence in the news sources, so passing on their conclusion that it is an apparent suicide would be within the bounds of BLP, especially if we recite the facts and say "which some new sources have referred to as an apparent suicide attempt". I don't care one way or the other whether it is added to the article, but it would not violate BLP to do so. -Rrius (talk) 18:12, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
It's the difference between someone standing up for their assessment of the situation, and someone who was made up by the news source.
If you're using a Daily Mail quote, then, frankly, it's open to doubt. If you're using the one of the broadsheets, then that's different. (Ibn) 80.47.204.18 (talk) 20:46, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Who here wants to add the disputed content? User Rrius supports adding it and who else? User Rrius you want to add Suicide attempt , would you provide your desired addition and the citations here for discussion ~Off2riorob (talk) 20:36, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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