User talk:Old Moonraker

Moonraker

Are you by any chance a fan of James Bond,Roger Moore, or the movie Moon Raker? --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 12:44, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

No, it's this one. Best. --Old Moonraker (talk) 13:26, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Oh I see... --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 16:55, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

WP:3RR

Apparently you are 3RR, too. Mamalujo (talk) 18:05, 29 June 2011 (UTC)

Nope: doesn't apply to reversions dealing with contraventions of the WP:BLP policy. --Old Moonraker (talk) 20:39, 29 June 2011 (UTC)

As far as I can see, the consensus at RSN was that the paper was a reliable source. Mamalujo (talk) 18:50, 6 July 2011 (UTC)

More or less, but not entirely: "this is a Telegraph gloss ... it did have a Catholic bias" says one editor. It was your unjustfied paraphrase others didn't like: "Too far removed from any statement of fact, for sure ... I fear it is speculation upon speculation" comments another. "Choose the direct quote as it is more likely to carry all the nuance", recommends a third. The real problem, however, was the one of recentism and trivia with which I opened the debate, as in: "the whole passage is not really relevant and adds nothing and should be removed per WP:RECENT". This was the reason for the ultimate decision to remove the passage.

Why are you persisting with this?

--Old Moonraker (talk) 20:02, 6 July 2011 (UTC)

Ad:Grizzly_bear

Ad:Grizzly_bear

IUCN info is about Ursus arctos, not about Ursus arctos horribilis Bulwersator (talk) 08:47, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

BTW - thanks, I removed also misleading paragraph Bulwersator (talk) 09:00, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

Did you read the two references you deleted as well? Applies to "Brown Bear, Grizzly Bear, Mexican Grizzly Bear" (emphasis added). One of us is missing something: if it's me, please explain. --Old Moonraker (talk) 09:21, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

"Common Name/s: English – Brown Bear, Grizzly Bear, Mexican Grizzly Bear"? Brown Bear is LC according to IUCN (as specie), Mexican grizzly bear is extinct and there is no info about status of Grizzly Bear Bulwersator (talk) 09:31, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

A pointless response from me would be to insert a further reference assessing the IUCN assessment, such as this one, from CITES: "the IUCN Red List has determined the grizzly bear to be of ‘Least Concern’ ". Pointless, because it's merely repeating what the original source states, which you have rejected as not really being about grizzly bears. Googling, I see that Chris Serveen, the IUCN report's co-author, has come under attack for his findings, in case conservation measures in particular areas are relaxed as a result. --Old Moonraker (talk) 10:14, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

Hm, I found this pdf, but IUCN website is not listing Grizzly bear as assessed. Probably this pdf is result of misunderstanding. So - we have one (probably) reliable source that grizzly is LC and more reliable source that it is not assessed (IUCN website) Bulwersator (talk) 11:09, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

To make this even more confusing: "grizzly bears" are subspecies of "brown bears" and synonym of "brown bears" (brown bears (called grizzly bears in interior North America)). Bulwersator (talk) 11:12, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

In this not reliable source they claim that grizzly is assessed by IUCN, here they are using grizzly as synonym. But so far I failed to find RS that IUCN assessed Grzizzly bear subspecies (and search is not promising as entire red list data is available on http://www.iucnredlist.org/) Bulwersator (talk) 11:25, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

Erin Pizzey

Many thanks for helping with the Pizzey article. Your addition is very useful, but as far as I can tell it doesn't quite state the point explicitly therefore I can see the text getting deleted again. Wouldn't the article be stronger if we used one of the BBC refs also? --Shakehandsman (talk) 06:30, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

Perhaps our reading is wrong: according to Sandra Horley, Pizzey's successor at CWA, Pizzey left before CWA segued into Refuge, taking HorLey with it as director. You will recall, however, that there was a lot of acrimony at the time and it's now tricky to establish events from the players' own recollections; this one comes from Horley herself, recounted in Hard Knocks: Domestic Violence and the Psychology of Storytelling, Haaken, 2010, ISBN 9780415563383.

Your point about the existing refs is valid: at present we have "Pizzey founded CWA" and "CWA became Refuge", but it may be synthesis to combine the two, which is the situation we seem to have at present. I'm going to have another look Hard Knocks and possibly change the WP article to match, subject to any suggestion you may have. I'm still looking for a definitive and independent source but I remain very reluctant to rely on a piece of casually written local news, penned thirty or so years after the events! --Old Moonraker (talk) 08:19, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

Taken your point to the article talk page. --Old Moonraker (talk) 09:05, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

Roman roads

Have you seen my comments on the talk page? This was heavily edited by Reddi who as you can possibly tell often relies on very old sources. The version immediately before he started editing [1] is probably better. Dougweller (talk) 06:27, 11 July 2011 (UTC)

No, I had missed those, sorry. I've checked now. I can't imagine that the heavy reliance on, for example, Smith (1858) and Smith (1890) hasn't been bettered by more recent research, but it's going to be a very difficult task to unpick the edits now. I haven't the breadth of knowledge to assist: sorry again. --Old Moonraker (talk) 06:47, 11 July 2011 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Old Moonraker. You have new messages at Ww2censor's talk page.
Message added 01:32, 13 July 2011 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

ww2censor (talk) 01:32, 13 July 2011 (UTC)

Userbox

Hi!
Done! (finally!!) It's here if you want to check it over.
Thanks for all your help! Xyl 54 (talk) 14:38, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

Encouragement, rather than help: you were the creator, but thanks for the namecheck at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Wiltshire#New userbox. Let's see what the take-up's going to be—"Young" Moonraker suggests incorporating it into the project "branding", which would be good. --Old Moonraker (talk) 15:53, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

Faustus and Mephisto

Hey,

Just wanted to mention, in light of your recent edit, that generally on the project we use the current common spelling, except in direct quotes of various kinds. For instance, the relevant article is at Mephistopheles. Not a big issue; and not one I care particularly about, so not something I'd bother making an argument for; and I don't particularly think it matters in the current Faustus article (there are both bigger fish to fry and lower-hanging fruit in that article). I just wanted to make a note of it for future reference. Incidentally, I don't think there is any policy governing this, and the closest guideline is WP:COMMONNAME, which deals with article titles rather than prose content; so there is definitely room for reasonable people to disagree on this. Anyways, I just wanted to mention it; please don't feel obliged to do anything whatsoever in response. --Xover (talk) 09:24, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Agree that there are better uses for our time, but where alternatives are possible I feel that it's discourteous to the original contributor to drive-by and change something to a second editor's preferred version, especially where they have made no other offering to the article in question (or, in this case, to any other article here). It's the perceived arrogance and discourtesy, rather than any overriding preference for the traditional spelling, that motivated the edit.--Old Moonraker (talk) 10:19, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Not forgetting the spelling specific to the play, as explained in the WP article: "In the 1616 edition of The Tragical History of Doctor Faustus, Mephostophiles became Mephistophilis". --Old Moonraker (talk) 11:11, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Paleo Indians revert

1. The sources given are good enough, unless Scientific American is not valid as a source.

2. No one is using Wikipedia as a primary source. Linking to another parts of the encyclopedia with inline citations is perfectly acceptable practice.

I would suggest you look for ways to improve upon the edits of others instead of applying deletionist practices. Thanks. Ladril (talk) 17:01, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Unacceptable practice: please read "Do not use articles from Wikipedia ... as sources" at WP:CIRCULAR. --Old Moonraker (talk) 17:08, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not being cited as a source. The reader is referred to a page which contains references. This is helpful for readers who want to learn more about the topic. This is not the sense in which that guideline should be applied. Ladril (talk) 17:14, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Sure: just use the ==See also== section. --Old Moonraker (talk) 17:16, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

That's correct. The 'see also' section is to provide links to articles not already linked that might help readers learn more about the topic. Dougweller (talk) 17:53, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Didn't know it was your personal page. Thanks for letting me know. Enjoy. Ladril (talk) 05:39, 17 July 2011 (UTC)

Doug's insights are always welcome on "my" personal pages! --Old Moonraker (talk) 10:48, 19 July 2011 (UTC)

Practicing

Hi, Old Moonraker. I don't believe we've met before, but I randomly saw your edit here at Stoppard's article, which reverted the spelling of "practicing" back to "practising" on the basis that the former isn't a word. Practicing is indeed a word, it's just saddled with awkward American spelling. I totally agree with your change per WP:ENGVAR (Stoppard is British, so his article should follow English spelling rules), but just thought you'd like to know. ;) María (habla conmigo) 19:05, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

You are right: the distinction only applies to "British and Australian English"; it is not widely followed in the US. Citing The Cambridge Guide to English Usage, which I should have checked before editing, instead of relying on my increasingly patchy memory. --Old Moonraker (talk) 20:43, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Color

Hi Old Moonraker: Saw your deletion of my added link on color. I had no intent to violate the guidelines for links (and don't think I did). I was going to ask you which guideline you thought I violated, since you didn't include it in the message, but then I saw it on the edit of the page itself. You indicated "personal page", which that page is not. It is an externally reviewed (and funded) educational publication (in print, PDF, and the website), by an authority. It provides details, links, and other references, that the current article lacks. I thought it better to add a link than start trying to edit the whole article (perhaps I'll correct parts later). Anyway, I won't put the link back, but I would ask you to reconsider your deletion of it. Thanks. --Mdfpph (talk) 14:26, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

The edit summary was: "See WP:ELNO #4; 11". This includes: "recognized authorities is meant to be very limited". I could be wrong, so request a second opinion at WP:ELN. I've used UofR websites as reliable sources in the past, but the standard for attaching an external link isn't the same. Footnote 4 (at the time of posting) here should illustrate. --Old Moonraker (talk) 14:41, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

OK, BTW:It's not a UofR site (It's RIT, which is far better known for Color Science!). I think the site easily meets the requirements for "very limited" on "recognized authorities" and the site is a completely free educational resource, so the link was in no way "promotional". The external links on the steam engine page are promotional links rather than educational links, so your argument, and your editing, make no sense to me. I'd prefer that you simply undo your edit, rather than starting a battle of second opinions. It's not worth my effort. Thanks for explaining though. --Mdfpph (talk) 19:01, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

I seem not to have made my point clearly. Footnote [4] on Steam Engine takes a reference from University of Rochester history of steam propulsion; this isn't the same as linking to the University of Rochester history of steam propulsion. Any other promotional links you have turned up aren't relevant to the argument: the Wikipedia version of "two wrongs don't make a right" is here.

Apologies for confusing Mark's alma mater with his current employ: I thought one was part of the other. --Old Moonraker (talk) 21:19, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

You made your point clearly. I get the difference between references and external links. What I don't get is your random editing. Have you checked the other external links on the Color page? Some are dead and some look quite promotional. You seem to have targeted my link and deleted it in far less time than you could have evaluated the website contents. Why don't you do that with the other "wrongs" that you are now aware of? That's what makes no sense to me. Regardless, when I have some more time, I will do some editing of the content on the page (there are gross errors) and adding the appropriate references. I actually created my wikipedia account to do just that. I hope you will see that as more helpful than a link to an educational site with correct information. Take care. --Mdfpph (talk) 14:23, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

I think I probably will, but please look out for the homophones. --Old Moonraker (talk) 16:38, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

Cute ... I fixed my error. Perhaps you could fix yours now! (the errors on the color page are far more than typos) --Mdfpph (talk) 19:06, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

Ottoman Empire section of WW1 article

Hi, the Sinai and Palestine Campaign article is being improved and I wonder if you would have any objections to the section covering it, which is quite small, being expanded to include some more detail?--Rskp (talk) 00:32, 22 August 2011 (UTC)

Absolutely none. My last edit was an {{Esp}} request to fix a typo, found by User:Wogon; this was nothing of consequence. Thanks for asking, though. --Old Moonraker (talk) 12:31, 22 August 2011 (UTC)

George Bernard Shaw article

Hi! I did read the page, and I have posted in the Talk section. People come to articles for many different reasons, so the article should reflect that and the opening should reflect sections of the article. I gave the article on Alexis Carrel as an example. Ironically the talk there was the opposite of Shaw--people argued to remove "eugenicist" from Carrel while people argue to insert it for Shaw.

Please consider that my attempt is not to slur but to promote a better understanding of the world eugenics movement at the start of the 20th century. I explain all this in the Talk section. Kris (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 14:59, 3 October 2011 (UTC).

Thanks for the reply. Continuing on the article talk page. --Old Moonraker (talk) 15:04, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

Thank you for the reference to the three revert rule (you guessed I am somewhat new to Wikipedia editing.) I guess I have to go out and find other people to make the changes for me like those who wish to keep this information out of the introductory paragraph. I think I made a clear argument that this is following the guidelines of what needs to go in the opening--controversial information needs to be included, it is a major heading in the article, it is a reason that draws people to the article (whether you like those people or not) and that contemporary sources associate him with it. I think it is important we understand what Shaw and others like Carrel were thinking, for they were not evil people and did not have the intentions that the Nazis distorted eugenics into. --Kris (talk) 15:24, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

I don't think that rounding up support to get around the three revert rule is a good idea: more at WP:CANVAS and WP:MEAT. I suggest instead that you look at WP:UNDUE and WP:RSUW, which explain the project's policy on undue weight. --Old Moonraker (talk) 15:57, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

I don't appreciate what is turning into a litany of accusations against me. I can no longer ever edit the article, now that people have 3 times undone my work. I find that frustrating and I see nothing else I can do except ask someone else to look at it. This is not about finding some dupe to make edits but about others knowledgeable in the subject expressing their opinion, especially when discussing something as subjective as "undue weight." I thought you took the high road by allowing the edit in a better form, to be broader rather than restrictive in knowledge even though you didn't agree with it. I have made the a clear and strong, resourced case as to why this is not undue weight. I cannot help if others with weak arguments and different motives have hacked their way through this topic before. --Kris (talk) 16:39, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

I was happy to hold back my reservations and let your amended edit stand, while asking for others' views. They were against it. Your second point is very apposite: this particular section has been severely "hacked about" in the past, mostly by those seeking to attack socialism in general by linking Shaw to the nazis. It has been a struggle to keep the article balanced and neutral while the mass audience of Glenn Beck is trying to do the opposite. --Old Moonraker (talk) 17:10, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

May I apologize--I thought I could never edit the article again, missing the 24 hour business, so I now I understand what you thought I was up to by recruiting editors. I appreciate what has been your kind guidance regarding the ins and outs of Wikipedia editing. Don't get me wrong, eugenics is evil, as is slavery, but it appears that the fans of Glenn Beck have prevented us from learning the history as some hide while others exaggerate people's involvement in the movement instead of understanding it in context.--Kris (talk) 17:42, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

Ephesus

Hi Old Moonraker, thanks for your message. Although Historvius allows user contributions, it is a professionally edited site with content that is continually checked for accuracy. Therefore I believe it does provide a relevant source of information that can be useful to people looking to find out the more practical side of Ephesus. However, although I feel this is relevant, I will leave the final judgement to you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.222.20.61 (talk) 11:30, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for replying here but no, please don't do that! A wider view, from contributors who specialize in this topic, is available here; try them for the definitive answer. --Old Moonraker (talk) 11:37, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

Ok, great, I will discuss further on that forum! Thanks! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.222.20.61 (talk) 11:40, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

Request to Delete a Wikipage

You requested to delete the Bioscrypt Inc. wikipage stating promotional reasons. What part of the article do you feel is promotional? The article is written while including facts, good or bad. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Abhinavcambridge (talk • contribs) 16:11, 17 October 2011 (UTC)

suggested addition to Earl of Oxford page submitted but queried.. it is not an alteration but an addition to the foreign travel section...

According to Edward Webbe's Rare and Wonderfull Things, published in 1590, Oxford travelled further afield than generally thought. 'One thing', he writes, 'did greatly comfort me which I saw long since in Sicilia, in the cite of Palermo, a thing worthie of memorie, where the right honourable the Earle of Oxenford a famous man fo Chivalrie, at what time he travailed into forraine countries, being then personally present, made there a challenge against al maner of persons whatsoever, & at all manner of weapons, as Turniments, Barriors with Horse and armour, to fight and combat with any whatsoever, in the defence of his Prince and countrey...so that al Italy over, he is acknowledged ever since for the same, the onely Chivallier and Noble man of England...'. If Oxford indeed travelled to Sicily and this was known among the literati,together with knowledge of his suspicions about his daughter's paternity, this may have been in Robert Greene's mind when he published Pandosto in 1588. Greene's popular novella concerning a falsely accused queen obliged to abandon her daughter, who is then brought up by shepherds in Sicily, in turn inspired his younger collaborator and rival, that 'upstart crow' William Shakespeare, to write the Winter's Tale, which is also partly set in Sicily.<ref> Edward Chaney, The Evolution of the Grand Tour: Anglo-Italian Cultural Relations since the Renaissance, 2nd ed. (Routledge, 2000) pp. 10-12.