Talk:Chael Sonnen

NCAA

This article needs to verify his alleged NCAA wrestling championships. In what year and what weight class were these titles won? He does not appear to be on this list http://www.hickoksports.com/history/ncaawrestl.shtml This information should be removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Irv Stantz (talk • contribs) 05:18, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

What do you mean "alleged" NCAA championships?? Your magical little list there is very clearly incomplete to anyone with an IQ over 60.--109.155.231.202 (talk) 13:23, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

2x national champion

I haven't been able to locate any real world references to substantiate the claim that he won two national championships. Absent any evidence to the contrary I will remove it.

I did find a list of previous champions:

http://www.hickoksports.com/history/ncaawrestl.shtml

Lordvolton (talk) 09:22, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

Chael is a 2x university national champion in Greco Roman (1999 and 2000) ... which is a separate event from NCAA wrestling. Lordvolton (talk) 22:00, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

You are not very intelligent are you?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.155.231.202 (talk) 13:25, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

All American

He was an All American finishing 8th in the 190 lbs weight division in 1998. Source: http://www.goducks.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=500&ATCLID=1415059 Lordvolton (talk) 09:43, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

Please change his fight record. He won the fight against Paulo Filho. Look it up. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.131.133.32 (talk) 07:30, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

troll

why does it say troll at the top? is that actually a nickname for him? or just a troll trolling by saying chael is a troll —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.188.203.217 (talk) 19:32, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

Please change his fight record. He won the fight against Paulo Filho. Look it up. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.131.133.32 (talk) 07:29, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

Politician

Line 1 leads a reader to believe that Sonnen holds a political office or has conducted a campaign. He filed paperwork to run for a state assembly position, but did not actually run. The statement at the end of paragraph #1 is fair, but the "politician" label should be removed from sentence #1. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.232.236.69 (talk) 06:26, 3 August 2010 (UTC)

 Done Cinderkun (talk) 08:24, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Fight Record

Please change his fight record. He won the fight against Paulo Filho. Look it up.

His fight with Stann was not billed as a title eliminator. Regards. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.54.141.157 (talk) 04:47, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

Birthplace

There are no hospitals in West Linn, Oregon. Therefore, nobody can be born there. His parents may have been living in West Linn in 1977, but his official birthplace can't be West Linn. Unless his mom delivered him at home, but other than that it should be changed to something else.Seangates (talk) 04:20, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

BYU

Chael attended BYU on a wrestling scholarship directly out of high school in 1995 (see comments about "former BYU wrestler: ). He was expelled shortly thereafter for defacing some art in one of the buildings. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Seangates (talk • contribs) 04:23, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Elevated testosterone

This wiki article states that he tested positive for elevated testosterone but that isnt true. His testosterone levels were in normal range, but his testosterone to epitestosterone ratios were off. Check any reputable article for it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.223.191.142 (talk) 01:22, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

"Hypogonadism"

MMAjunkie.com medical columnist Dr. Johnny Benjamin called the "hypogonadism" explanation into question noting that "testicular atrophy and subsequent low testosterone are common and widely known side effects of anabolic-steroid use." Should this medical opinion on the issue of Sonnen's suspension be included in the article?  Mr JM  20:35, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

I don't think so. He is a columnist. I question his expertise.

So that's one vote questioning the "expertise" of a medical doctor from a guy who doesn't even sign his comments in the talk section...  Mr JM  00:32, 28 December 2010 (UTC)

Haha yeah good job man your a Wikipedia thug —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.132.217.21 (talk) 20:29, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

The word is "you're." It is the contraction of "you" and "are" and it requires the use of an apostrophe.  Mr JM  02:13, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

Haha whatever bro. Now your a grammar nazi? XD your real cool, man —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.132.217.21 (talk) 00:06, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

Once again, the word you are attempting to use is the "you're" contraction. Perhaps you should just stick to spelling-out both words in their entirety.  Mr JM  23:36, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

It should not be included. Dr. Benjamin is not Sonnen's personal physician nor is he in any way involved in the case. He has no detailed information and his opinion, though professionally related, is pure speculation. One might call it talking out of one's ass. I think accepting such a statement as a wiki worthy fact would be akin to it being acceptable for me to accuse a diabetic of being a glutton, since diabetes can be caused by excessive sugar consumption. It can, however, also be present at birth so the factual correctness of the existence of adult onset diabetes aside, I would be wrong. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.57.177.161 (talk) 07:40, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

The information presented is about the condition in general and has nothing to do personally with Sonnen. Stop trying to find ways to cover up his crimes and cheating. It's obvious to anyone that reads it. This is an Encyclopedic website, not a forum for Sonnen "Nuthuggers" to debate things and add positive propaganda. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.160.197.141 (talk) 05:24, 17 October 2011 (UTC)

Biased?

I personally feel like this artical is a little biased. Saying Sonnen's condition is "alleged". In his hearing, his doctor showed records proving he has the condition. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.132.217.21 (talk) 00:07, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

How 'bout I meet you half way and promise not to use the word "alleged" to describe Sonnen's criminal money laundering scheme?  Mr JM  04:01, 4 January 2011 (UTC)

Well I would hope you didn't. That isn't alleged. He plead guilty. The CSAC case was the opposite. He was proven innocent. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.132.217.21 (talk) 23:24, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

Oh, the California State Athletic Commission suspended him for six months because he's innocent. Got it.  Mr JM  02:09, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

They reduced it to 6 months. Originally it was a 1 year suspension for irregular testosterone. Reduced to 6 months for failure to disclose —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.132.217.21 (talk) 00:07, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

Unsigned is correct. Wikipedia is not the place for your personal feelings. If you feel that strongly you should tell it to a Kleenex box. Propagandizing is not appreciated. If he was proven innocent then there's no reason for the subsequent article change to be accompanied by your tears. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.57.177.161 (talk) 02:19, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Middleweight Championship Bout

Minor edit here; I'm removing a line with inaccurate information. The article currently states "Sonnen largely out-boxed Silva, the widely regarded 'best striker' in MMA." The cited source does not say anything about boxing, or about Silva being the "best striker in MMA." For reference, the source is http://www.compustrike.com/stats.php?news=CompuStrike_Stats:_UFC_117&news_id=151&start=0&category_id=5&parent_id=5&arcyear=Y&arcmonth=M 199.30.197.148 (talk) 15:15, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

I'm removing a line with inaccurate information as well. The article states that "Chael took Anderson down in all 5 rounds", but Chael only landed 3 of his 7 takedown attempts according to fightmetric. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 218.45.99.215 (talk) 16:57, 15 August 2011 (UTC)

"Silva became the third man in the UFC's history to finish a fight in the fifth round and the second via submission." is this really true. only 2 other fighters have ever finished a fight in the fifth round and only one other has done it via submission? no source is cited. 75.119.245.192 (talk) 11:57, 30 October 2011 (UTC)

Retired?

Can someone please tell me where they got that Chael Sonnen is retired. If anything that has to be far from the truth as his reapply date for a licence with the CSAC has been moved up.JM  00:28, 20 May (UTC)

Redundancy

The parts at the top, under his name, that talk about the TRT issue and the mortgage fraud issue should be removed as both have their own sections. The entire article reads like it was written by someone who hates Sonnen (I'm guessing Mr. JM because the discussion section is rife with his blatant bias and hatred) anyway so why pile it on...

Mortgage Fraud

Presently the title of this section is "Mortgage Fraud Controversy". It would be a more meaningful subject header if changed to "Mortgage Fraud Conviction". I think the word 'controversy' connotes 'debate' or 'dispute', suggesting there are two sides to the issue. LSDave (talk) 20:20, 22 November 2011 (UTC)

Chael Defeated Renato 'Babalu' Sobral in 2003

It was in 2003 at the "Hitman Fighting Championship 3" event. He won by decision. So stop deleting it from his record, please. Can we possibly get some editors here without an anti-Chael agenda, that won't bury or outright delete accurate information? This is a Wikipedia page, not an outlet for you to express your frustrations.

It's not in Sherdog. Reference? Materialscientist (talk) 00:26, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

Sherdog isn't the end all be all. The last I recall, Sherdog didn't include one of Royce Gracie's early losses. The one where his corner threw in the towel and it was officially declared a loss. But, for the record, it's listed on Chael's MixedMartialArts.com page.67.191.229.183 (talk) 04:23, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

This is a problem, because Sherdog is a top authority, and your link, while adding the 2003 win against Sobral, gives the total count as 25-11-1 (while it should then be 27-11-1). I would contact Sherdog asking to update their table. Materialscientist (talk) 04:50, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

You need to look at it again. Those two "missing" fights were amateur bouts. MixedMartialArts.com has two separate lists -- professional and amateur -- and being that those two were amateur bouts, they're listed on the amateur list, which is located beneath the professional. You can check it yourself. So, here's another example of Wikipedia editors and Sherdog getting their facts wrong. Also, MixedMartialArts IS a top authority, hence most professional fighters frequent their community forum.67.191.229.183 (talk) 01:37, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

Please bring this issue to WT:MMA. To be consistent, changes will have to affect a wide range of articles (the issue of Sherdog being unreliable and treating bouts differently from MixedMartialArts in terms of professional/amateur). Materialscientist (talk) 01:51, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

I'll do that, but if MixedMartialArts.com isn't a top authority, like you implied, then why is it included as one of Chael's Wikipedia "References"? And take a look at this -- from Full Contact Fighting Federation's official Facebook page: "The "Full Contact Fighting Federation" is the nation's premier amateur, Mixed Martial Arts (MMA) event." - facebook.com/fullcontactfightingfederation. Yes, that says AMATEUR. His match with Greg Curnut was for Full Contact Fighting Federation, which proves it was in fact an amateur bout. Sherdog and you are wrong.67.191.229.183 (talk) 03:26, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

As Materialscientist said, Sherdog is the defacto standard for fight histories as far as the MMA Wikiproject has been concerned; issues with that should be taken up there. As for the 2003 event that had Sonnen facing Sobral I've found a couple mentions of the fight[1][2] and it possibly shows why Sherdog doesn't count the event. The event occurred before MMA was sanctioned in California, therefore the promoters billed the event as a professional wrestling event. So, Sherdog likely doesn't list it as it was not a "MMA fight" at a "MMA event". (The two sites I referenced go into more details about Sonnen being disclosed as the winner of the bout before it occurred and Sobral not being fully informed of the rules for the fight.) --TreyGeek (talk) 04:02, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

1. TreyGeek, you cited a random user's post on Sherdog's forum and a comment on another website as evidence. Those are far from credible sources. 2. I've already established the fact that Sherdog and Wikipedia falsely list amateur fights as professional fights. So Sherdog's failure to record an MMA fight could easily be the result of their own incompetence rather than reason. 3. The name of the organization they fought for was Hitman FIGHTING Championship. An organizations name and what actually took place in the ring (MMA) would obviously trump what the event was supposedly billed as (and your sources are dubious as far as that's concerned.) 67.191.229.183 (talk) 04:43, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

Where are they getting their info from? c.m1994 (talking) 20:48 17 January 2012 (UTC)