Talk:Rig (sailing)

I hope you love me

I created graphics from scratch for most of the standard plans in Inkscape. I created them from descriptions and photographs. I did a lot of what amounted to design work, too. ⇝Casito⇝Talk 03:38, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

looks great Enjoyhats 05:36, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

They're awesome. I would like to suggest, though that we move 'catboat' and 'gunter' up before sloop, so that they essentially progress from fewest sails to most sails. Coldnorth (talk) 19:58, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Wonderful images! Bravo! One possible error - It looks like the Bragantine image is actually a Hermaphrodite Brig. A Brigantine should have a couple square-rigged sails over the fore-and-aft mainsail. It would be nice to add one for a Yawl too (A 2-masted, fore-and-aft-rigged sailing vessel similar to the ketch but having a smaller mizzenmast (or jigger) stepped abaft the rudderpost. Also called a "dandy".) mbjenkins (talk) 10:07, 20 June 2011 (EST)

You have no idea how valuable this is to those of us who do image cataloging/labelling.

		The Graphic Designer's Barnstar
		Thanks!. Scwalsh (talk) 16:08, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

Needed: sail plan image to replace Image:Tackling.png

Image:Tackling.png is beautiful, but it describes the tackling, that is, the lines used to hold and manipulate the sails rather than the sails themselves. If anybody has a numbered image with a legend for courses, topgallants etc., please put it up. Gaal 09:14, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

Sailing re-organization effort

Take a minute to read the comments at Talk:Sailing#Re-write effort -- non how-to et seq. Some of us are working on re-organizing the sailing-related articles. See if you agree with our approach and give us some help. Mrees1997 19:35, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Sail Plan diagram

I need a diagram of a Junk Sail that labels al the diferent parts.

-Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.136.214.34 (talk) 13:41, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Remove information from Junk

There is some information in the Junk description that seems to be extraneous to the article subject (Sail-Plan). Namely, that some of the largest sailing ships constructed were Junks, the business about the water-tight holds and . It's been there since a very early revision [[1]] before a separate Junk article seems to have been created, so I see the reason the information was originally presented in this article. But now I think it's time for it to go.

Since it's been present in the article for so long, I wanted to ask before deleting it. Paul Moir (talk) 15:31, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Xebec v. Polacre

I'm not qualified to correct it, but the definition given of a xebec seems to be that of a polacre, and disagrees with the WP page xebec, which speaks largely of polacre-xebecs and suggests that the significance lies in the hull, not the sail plan. Anyone?Czrisher (talk) 16:06, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

Also, it would appear from the caption that a xebec and a felucca are the same thing (if the polacre, described as square at the fore and lanteen at main and mizzen, exchanges her square mast for another lanteen as suggested, she would have three lanteens like the felucca), whereas from what I recall of the life of Thomas Cochrane the xebec that he famously captured (El Gamo) was square on the fore and main and lanteen at the mizzen (like the second picture for a ship rig) - anyone clear this up? 62.196.17.197 (talk) 17:10, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Hermaphrodite Brig

It would be nice to have an illustration of a hermaphrodite brig. Thanks, Casito, for all your previous work! Taquito1 (talk) 04:31, 23 October 2009 (UTC)

The image of the Brigantine is actually a Hermaphrodite Brig (aka Brig-Schooner) A brigantine has two square topsails (main topsail and topgallant) over the fore and aft rigged mainsail on the [aft] mainmast. A Hermaphrodite Brig is square-rigged on the foremast combined with a schooner rig on the mainmast. mbjenkins (talk) 10:02, 20 June 2011 (EST)

Many-masted barques

I am about to remove the statement, "Some barks (see below) have had as many as twelve masts." To the best of my knowledge, no bark has ever had as many as six masts. I am open to being educated, but I insist on verifiability. J S Ayer (talk) 00:59, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Other rigs

If we are going for thoroughness, we could use descriptions and drawings of a staysail schooner, a three-masted jackass-barque, and a four-masted jackass-barque. J S Ayer (talk) 02:31, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

Feluccas

A felucca is defined in the article as having three lateen-rigged masts, but I would suggest that single- and two-masted lateen-rigged coasting vessels in the Med in the 18th and early 19th century were also called feluccas. --Michael K. Smith (talk) 00:15, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

Proas and crab claw sails

The Melanesian, Micronesian and Polynesian proas and other vessels with their highly efficient two sparred crab claw sail (as distinct from the less efficient Lateens) are a significant omission here so far, considering the navigational and nautical prowess of these peoples predating any similar European efforts. See "We, the Navigators: The Ancient Art of Landfinding in the Pacific" by David Lewis and "Sail Performance: Techniques to Maximise Sail Power" by CA Marchaj for references. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bcebul (talk • contribs) 04:07, 12 June 2011 (UTC)

Bobstay and Martingales

In the article, the definitions of bobstay and martingale have been confused. The bobstay is the stay beneath the bowsprit which counteracts the pull of the headstays and prevents the bowsprit from lifting. On some vessels twin bobstays were used, angled apart. The martingales (more commonly known on modern yachts as "whisker stays" or whiskers) are the stays at the side of the bowsprit that prevent side-to-side movement. On some vessels the angle of the bobstay is widened by running it under a vertical or near-vertical spar beneath the bowsprit known as the "dolphin striker", which performs the same function for the bowsprit that a "spreader" performs on a mast, and on some vessels "martingale booms" perform a similar function for the martingales. Actually, details of these components of the rig do not really belong in an article on the sail plan. They should be in a separate article on rigging. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.67.206.107 (talk) 13:51, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

My research suggests differently, and it appears that a martingale and a dolphin striker are, in fact, the different terms for the same thing, i.e., the vertical spar that holds the lines that counteract the tension created by the jibs. If you look at the article on dolphin striker you will see what I mean. Can you provide some citations that support your argument? I would be glad to see them and see how they compare with those used in the dolphin striker article. Thanks! KDS4444^Talk 13:26, 29 March 2013 (UTC)

Speed limit of Brig is 11knots?

Brig: two masts, both square-rigged with a spanker on the mainmast. They are considered very fast and maneuverable, and can reach speeds of up to 11 knots.

The above statement is entirely inaccurate. A brig of 60 ft (unusually small for this sailplan) at the water line might only get 11knots, a brige of 120 Lwl would get something more like 15 or 16 knots.

Speed has less to do with sailplan as it has to do with hull length...Some hulls that are heavy or very heavy displacement need more sail to push them, but the speed limit so to speak is limited by the hull. You can load more sail on just about any kind of sail plan except catboats and sloops...cutters can load more sail on, but adding more staysails and properly designed for the rig between the jib and the main mast.

Lets remove the reference to absolute speeds. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.155.124.81 (talk) 15:29, 21 August 2014 (UTC)

can we have a sail-plan gallery?

something like this ...

Sail-plans

• 
  Proa: single mast with crab claw sail.
• 
  Gunter: single fore-and-aft rigged mast in two pieces.
• 
  Catboat: single fore-and-aft rigged sail.
• 
  Sloop: single fore-and-aft rigged mast and a jib.
• 
  Cutter: single fore-and-aft rigged mast with two or more headsails.
• 
  Yawl: fore-and-aft rigged mainmast and mizzen mast aft of the tiller.
• 
  Ketch: 2 fore-and-aft rigged masts, mizzen mast before the tiller.
• 
  Schooner: 2 or more fore-and-aft rigged masts, first mast no taller than the second.
• 
  Schooner Brig: 1 square-rigged foremast and 1 fore-and-aft rigged main mast.
• 
  Brigantine: 1 square-rigged foremast and hybrid rigged main mast.
• 
  Brig: 2 square-rigged masts and headsails.
• 
  Snow: 2 square-rigged masts, headsails and a trysail on the so-called snow-mast.
• 
  Barquentine: 1 square-rigged mast (fore) and 2 fore-and-aft rigged (main and mizzen) masts.
• 
  Barque: 2 or more square-rigged masts and headsails with fore-and-aft rigged aftmost mast.
• 
  Fully rigged ship: 3 or more (all) square-rigged masts and headsails.
• 
  Polacre: 1 square-rigged main with headsails and 2 lateen rigged aft masts.
• 
  Felucca: 1 to 3 lateen rigged masts.
• 
  Junk: 1 or more junk-rigged masts.

Siznax (talk) 03:25, 11 October 2011 (UTC)

I like it... KDS444 (talk) 06:16, 3 March 2013 (UTC)

Square rigged into wind

It says shipped rig were popular "because of high performance on all points of wind". My understanding, and obvious from observation, is that square rigs were lousy at sailing into wind. I've never understood why they were ever used at all, especially in unknown waters. Cannot tack, easy to get blown into rocks and reefs. And a small boat sailer spends most of their time tacking into wind, as the down wind runs are quick and easy. Some clarification somewhere would be good. I have marked it dubious. Tuntable (talk) 08:09, 30 June 2012 (UTC)

My understanding, gained largely from the Hornblower novels, is that big square-riggers are faster running before the wind. They can tack, though it takes a big crew. The existing statement should probably be improved. J S Ayer (talk) 19:11, 12 July 2012 (UTC)

"Types of Ships" layout cleanup?

The diagrams in the 'Types of Ships' section are awkwardly placed. They're not actually contained inside their respective list entries, so depending on the type of reader/browser you use it's not immediately obvious if each diagram belongs to the paragraph above it or the one below. I feel like these diagrams should be embedded/floated within their respective paragraphs as part of each list entry, rather than between them. Is there an existing rule in a style guide that governs how images should be placed in this sort of list? 96.237.174.181 (talk) 14:20, 14 April 2015 (UTC)