Talk:Stoning of the Devil

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October 2012

This article is a misnomer. "Stoning the Devil" is not the name of this ritual in Arabic and is an incorrect and misleading translation. The stoning is of the places that Muslims believe the devil appeared and not the stoning of the devil. "Oftentimes" as in once that I've ever heard of... should this be clarified? No.

Maybe you haven't heard enough?

At least 3 times in recent history during this specific part of the celebration. 2004 - 251 dead during this ritual, 2001 - 35 dead, 1994 - 270 dead.

Deaths have been reported at other places during other related gatherings. 1998 - 180 trampled to death, 1990 - 1,426 trampled to death, 1987 - 402 trampled to death.

January 2006

Shouldn't a new article be created for the stampede deaths of 2006? How does one start a news article? 24.63.125.78 16:56, 12 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

New article at: 2006 Hajj stampede 24.63.125.78 17:51, 12 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I would like to know a little something about this "two-level flyover-style" bridge, why people go there, and why they get trampled when they are there. Is there no other access point to the towers? Why are there hundreds of bulls walking around there? Why do hundreds of people still go there when people die nearly every year? Is there religious significance to this bridge? What is a "two-level flyover-style" bridge, anyway? If someone knowledgable could update the page with this information, I think it would be a great addition. Rob 17:13, 13 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Although your comment is old and the article appears to have been edited to remove the word, I will answer one of your questions anyway. In the UK a highway bridge that is called a "flyover" is the same sort of structure that would likely be called an "overpass" in the US. At least, that is one of the meanings. The only time I have heard the word used, my wife and I (from the US) were driving in the UK trying to find a rental car return near an airport. We stopped for directions and were told to "go under the flyover" about a mile down the road and make a turn. Because we were near an airport, the term was very confusing to us, but finally we got to our destination and learned a new British word in the bargain. RoseHawk (talk) 15:24, 24 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks to Mpatel for the wall information. :-) --Cam 16:23, 15 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Since this ritual has been happening for hundreds of years, it would be interesting to know some of the older history of the site. --Nick 09:54, 18 August 2006 (UTC) your mum —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.208.91.250 (talk) 19:21, 10 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

How old were the former pillars?

From an outsider's point of view, it seems a bit surprising that the pillars can just be taken down and replaced by walls. How long were the pillars there before? Do they have archaeological value? Where did they move them to? Do some people still want to throw stones at the original pillars wherever they went? Is the spot where the pillars and walls were stoned considered to be the actual location of the defile at al-Aqaba? Do people have to stone those particular walls or could they toss rocks at any stone wall in Mecca? Sorry if these questions are ignorant... it's just, I am ignorant, and so are most of the other people reading this article. Wnt (talk) 19:54, 24 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know an answer, but would like to "me-too" the questions asked here. -- 77.7.156.54 (talk) 12:19, 15 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

49 pebbles needed?

The article says that at least 49 pebbles are needed. However, I believe this should be 42 based upon the information given in the surrounding areas. 2 (days) x 3 (walls) x 7 (pebbles) = 42. However, I am may be missing something, so I figured I'd leave a message here rather than change it. AddWittyNameHere (talk) 08:39, 13 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

There are three days involved, or four if one stays an additional day. On the first day, one throws 7 pebbles at just 1 of the 3 jamarāt. Then the following two days are as you enumerate: 7 pebbles thrown at each of the 3 jamarāt on both days. Thus the three-day total is 49. If the pilgrim stays at Mina an extra day, again 7 pebbles are thrown at each jamrah so an additional 21 pebbles are used and the four-day total is 70. If a thrown pebble does not hit a jamrah one must throw again, so more pebbles may be needed. -- Cam (talk) 15:57, 13 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Alright. It was the first part that I had missed, leading to my confusion. Thanks for clearing it up for me. AddWittyNameHere (talk) 17:19, 13 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Meaning of Jamaraat (pl) and of Jamrah (sg) and Aqaba

In the article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamaraat_Bridge ist stated: "It literally means a small piece of stone or a pebble." If you translate Jamrah الجمرة with "Goolge-translator" you get "Anthrax, Ash and cinder". Anthrax is a dangereous disease with leads to black skin. Anthrax is greek and means "coal". So Jamrah does not seem to mean only pebble. Also if you compare the turkish word for Jamrah: "cemre" - you find in a good dictionary (Steuerwald turkish- german) "hot ash". also the word Akaba (aqaba) is translated with "obstacle". "جمرة العقبة jamrah al-ʿaqaba" seems to mean an obstacle of glowing coals. To understand what the aim of Jamaraat was read here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoning_of_the_Devil#Historical_and_spiritual_significance Jamaraat heap was an obstacle with Satan used to stop Abraham passing through the defile. So a heap of glowing coals or glowing cinder is a more logical obstacle than a heap of stones. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.172.148.117 (talk) 15:26, 25 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

This is not a CORRECT photo

One truly needs to google the word and see the old photos (before 2004) in which there existed an obelisk. An obelisk is the true representative of Satan not a wall (which is of questionable Saudi Arabian rational background). This is misleading to people with sane/religious mind.

If you see an obelisk elsewhere, then you should know somebody has been practicing Satanism! — Preceding unsigned comment added by X stunner (talk • contribs) 19:52, 21 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Wise people don't stone the Devil

Wise people don't do acts of violence to the worst of the society or of the metaphysical world. We shouln't tolerate violence and crime, but not via violence and crime. Violence and crime doesn't make you good neither the world a safer place. We should restrict the Devil, try to explain what he did. If we fail it's our mistake, because we should take responsibility of the evil in the world and not throw it to the Devil without sufficient data, simply because of a tradition. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:587:410F:DB00:2458:D307:B988:A014 (talk) 15:18, 12 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

the everyday Devil isn't an enemy soldier or a rapist. The everyday Devil is the one having a fundamentally different metaphysical opinion than you (not a different opinion about food). In order society becomes functional you have to respect the Devils who respect you, and restrict non violently afar from you the Devils that don't respect you. Some times you have to fight and kill, but only as a last option. People who cannot distinguish the various levels of devilry, simply have small brains. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:587:410F:DB00:2458:D307:B988:A014 (talk) 15:30, 12 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The wise religion doesn't allow an official devil stoning. It is true that in real life we might have to stone the Devil in order we survive. It is nothing to be celebrated. We do not hate someone de facto, neither hate is a wise official religious tradition. Wise people at rare occasions might even kill the avatars of the Devil in order they protect their family, but they don't celebrate it. A wise man loves and tries to help the Devil, and if he fails the wise man might kill the Devil's instrument, not because of hate, but simply if it's the last option to stop the Devil from raping and killing. The wise man never hates. Even if the wise man kills a beast, he doesn't hate the beast, and he cries because he wasn't strong enough to explain to the beast that being humane is wiser. Of course when you are attacked you can kill to survive. This has nothing to do with hate neither with official traditions of hate! Loving the Devil doesn't make you evil or a loser, but humane. The Devil is our silly brother we must love, we try 1. to explain if we fail we 2. put him in jail if he kills and rapes and 3. if everything failed and he invades our country then we kill the Devil, not because of hate, but because we have the right to live. If we kill the Devil we cry, because our love failed that time...