Talk:Immigration to Sweden

unnamed

The reference (note 22) to the statement "A government study in 2006 estimated that 39% of the Muslim population harbor strong and consistent antisemitic views" leads to a newspaper article which no makes no claim supporting the aforementioned quote. Either said study should be correctly referenced to, or the statement should be removed (if not corrected within a week, I will make a quick search for the study and if not found remove the statement). Sidospår (talk) 00:14, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

Content Removal

Just taking a quick look at the edits tab, and it shows that data from several sections (such as 'Population of immigrants and their descendants' and 'Country of Origin' have been removed.

Several sections are blank and should be fixed.

Could you consider reverting the edits? I can see one that took away over 4000 characters. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 14.200.10.98 (talk) 12:46, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

POV-section

I have added a POV-tag to the section about the situation in Malmö with regards to antisemitism. This belongs to Antisemitism in Sweden and just copying it from there to any article about the same topic is not right. Summarize the content instead. --IRISZOOM (talk) 10:50, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

Do Swedish Muslims really hate themselves?

The article states: " 39% of adult Muslims "harbour systematic antisemitic views"".

Should that not read something more on the lines of "39% of adult Muslims SUFFER from systematic antisemitism."? Presidentbalut (talk) 03:09, 4 March 2014 (UTC)

Adding Immigration to Scandinavia Page

Hi I am interested in creating a broader summary page about Immigration to Scandinavia and the specific details of the conflicts that rise regarding access to the social services offered within welfare states and issues of recent cultural and racial diversity in nations that have historically been very heterogeneous. I am also considering adding a page on Immigration to Denmark since one has not been created yet.

Have any of you considered creating a broader page about trends in Scandinavian immigration and the similarities and differences in country policies? Do you foresee any issues in creating either of these pages?

Thank you Rloftis5672 (talk) 05:36, 20 September 2014 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to one external link on Immigration to Sweden. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/20110301032254/http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaPz7p-1-bk to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaPz7p-1-bk

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—^{cyberbot II}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 09:52, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Immigration to Sweden. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/20120424203738/http://www.scb.se:80/Statistik/BE/BE0101/2011A01B/be0101_Fodelseland_och_ursprungsland.xls to http://www.scb.se/Statistik/BE/BE0101/2011A01B/be0101_Fodelseland_och_ursprungsland.xls
• Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20100325205944/http://www.jta.org:80/news/article/2010/03/22/1011279/report-anti-semitic-attacks-in-rise-in-scandanavia to http://www.jta.org/news/article/2010/03/22/1011279/report-anti-semitic-attacks-in-rise-in-scandanavia

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{Sourcecheck}}).

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 22:58, 20 July 2016 (UTC)

kurdish

here is wrote, kurdish people more than 83,000. why here is very more lettle ? Ibrahim aziz (talk) 18:57, 20 January 2017 (UTC)

Various statistics that I have found

Here are various statistics that I have found. Do with them as you wish:

Malmo, in Sweden, is the second most unsafe, and crime-infested city in Europe:

https://www.numbeo.com/crime/region_rankings.jsp?title=2017&region=150

It was decided to open Sweden for massive immigration from the 3rd world in 1975:

http://www.riksdagen.se/sv/dokument-lagar/dokument/proposition/regeringens-proposition-om-riktlinjer-for_FY0326

The amount of women in Sweden subjected to sexually related crimes went up with 70% between 2014 to 2015:

https://www.bra.se/bra/nytt-fran-bra/arkiv/press/2016-11-03-utsatthet-for-sexualbrott-har-okat-bland-kvinnor.html

There were over 480000 sexually related crimes against women in Sweden 2015:

http://www.bra.se/download/18.37179ae158196cb1721ac8/1478089201798/2016_Utsatthet_for_brott_2015.pdf

In 1975 only 421 rapes were reported to the police in Sweden:

https://www.bra.se/bra/publikationer/arkiv/publikationer/2008-11-21-brottsutvecklingen-i-sverige-fram-till-ar-2007.html

To compare with 5920 the year 2015:

https://www.bra.se/bra/brott-och-statistik/valdtakt-och-sexualbrott.html

According to the Swedish police department, there are 55 extremely lawless areas in the country, and 186 in sum total. There were only 3 of them in 1990:

https://polisen.se/Global/www%20och%20Intrapolis/Rapporter-utredningar/01%20Polisen%20nationellt/Ovriga%20rapporter-utredningar/Kriminella%20natverk%20med%20stor%20paverkan%20i%20lokalsamhallet%20Sekretesspr%2014.pdf

http://www.dnv.se/nyheter/ny-rapport-utanforskapets-karta-en-uppfoljning-av-folkpartiets-rapportserie/

According to the leader of the ambulance drivers' union, Gordon Grattidge, the police, and other rescue workers, cannot enter such areas without being subjected to severe violent assaults, such as stone-throwing lynch mobs:

http://www.weeklystandard.com/the-truth-about-sweden/article/2007071

http://www.weeklystandard.com/video-head-of-ambulance-union-confirms-no-go-zones-in-sweden/article/2007000

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/773310/Swedish-medics-military-equipment-enter-no-go-zones-Ambulance-Drivers-Union

660000 immigrants are expected to apply for asylum to Sweden 2016-2020 in sum total:

https://www.migrationsverket.se/download/18.2d998ffc151ac38715917594/1485556216677/Migrationsverkets+prognos+oktober+2016.pdf

11% of youths (non-Muslims were included in the survey) in the suburbs of Gothenburg admit to supporting Jihadism:

http://www.gp.se/nyheter/g%C3%B6teborg/studie-var-tionde-elev-st%C3%B6ttar-religi%C3%B6sa-extremister-1.3908356

80% of Muslim women in Gothenburg admit to live under the threat of honour culture:

http://www.gp.se/nyheter/göteborg/utbrett-hedersförtryck-mot-flickor-i-göteborg-1.3908432

A comparative study of criminal tendencies between people born in Sweden and abroad from 2005:

https://www.bra.se/bra/publikationer/arkiv/publikationer/2005-12-14-brottslighet-bland-personer-fodda-i-sverige-och-i-utlandet.html

Further information about the vastly increased violent criminal activity in society since 1975:

https://www.morpheusblogg.se/2015/11/12/kriminaliteten-okar-visst/

According to the Swedish police department, the use of hand-grenades in Sweden among criminals is the highest in the world for countries not currently at war:

https://www.svd.se/svenska-attacker-med-granater-sticker-ut-i-varlden

A study about the extremely increasing antisemitism in Sweden:

http://kantorcenter.tau.ac.il/sites/default/files/PP%203%20Antisemitisms%20160608.pdf

David A (talk) 12:23, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

All right, so you are a extreme-right troll, who is able to collate links. So what? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.233.194.217 (talk) 17:07, 14 April 2017 (UTC)

I am neither extreme right, nor a troll. I am a centrist who has read up on an awful lot of reliable facts and statistics, and has turned extremely concerned about Islamism, and the proven practical consequences of open borders. Also, Ad hominem personal attacks do not change the facts of reality. David A (talk) 18:27, 14 April 2017 (UTC)

Self published source?

This seems like a self-published source. Secondly, it doesn't really talk about immigration to Sweden. Swedish Muslims aren't necessarily foreigners, some were born in the country (including converts).VR _talk 00:05, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

Fredrik Sieradzki

Who exactly is Fredrik Sieradzki? This article just presents the opinion of one person. It's not a study or the opinion of a scholar.VR _talk 00:16, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

@Vice regent: Yeah, I removed that whole section. Not only is it WP:UNDUE, it's complete WP:OR seeing as nowhere in the linked articles does it state that immigration has led to an increase in antisemitism. Only that some people harbor antisemitic views. We don't know if they are immigrants or not and to assume that they are simply based on ethnicity or religion is original research and POV-pushing. It belongs in Antisemitism in Europe, and it was just copy+pasted from there in the first place. Kamalthebest (talk) 02:47, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

Also I just noticed if you look higher up the talk page, multiple other people have made the same claim. Kamalthebest (talk) 02:53, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

It is not "Original Research" and "POV-pushing". As can be clearly seen in the articles I linked to earlier, all Muslims in Sweden came here from 1975 and onwards. Attempting to censor valid statistics based on flimsy claims, and personal preferences, is completely unacceptable. David A (talk) 04:04, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

In any case, there are currently recurrent reports in the news of Jews being threatened, feeling extremely unsafe, emigrating, not being able to show signs of being Jewish in public without being assaulted in the immigration-heavy suburbs, etcetera, so it is certainly an extremely relevant issue, that has turned considerably worse since the time of these statistics, and should not be systematically swept under the carpet. David A (talk) 04:10, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

David A, you're right that threats against Jews are serious, relevant and must be covered. It is very unfortunate that is happening. So I think some of the material could belong at Antisemitism in Sweden.VR _talk 04:15, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

@David A, Vice regent: Yes, and it's not being "swept under the rug." Literally everything in that section on this page is on the Antisemitism in Sweden page. Kamalthebest (talk) 04:22, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

I think that it is being censored and swept under the carpet. Again, I have provided proof that virtually all Muslims in Sweden came here after the 1975 immigration reform. The people who exhibit these sentiments are either 1st, 2nd, or 3rd generation Muslim immigrants. It is a direct consequence of that Sweden has had open borders for a very long time, and should be publicly displayed for easy overview. David A (talk) 04:42, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

@Jason from nyc and Factchecker atyourservice: David A (talk) 04:47, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

Regardless that you dislike the organisation itself, you can also check out the various links to valid reports and news articles linked to in this Gatestone article. David A (talk) 04:57, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

This academic report may be of particular interest. David A (talk) 04:59, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

The ping to Jason and Factchecker is blatant canvassing (Wikipedia:Canvassing).VR _talk 05:00, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

Is that not allowed? I have seen others ping each other as well, and thought that I should try it.David A (talk) 05:13, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

"either 1st, 2nd, or 3rd generation Muslim immigrants." Well everyone is an nth generation immigrant. Even the ancestors of the native Swedes migrated at some point. Most of the stats, at least on crime, only distinguish between those born in Sweden and those not. So the 2nd and 3rd generation would be regarded as Swedish born. A source here suggests that as many as a third of Swedish Muslims were already second generation in the year 2000 (I haven't yet verified that source myself). Further, there seems to be at least some converts to Islam in Sweden (Islam_in_Sweden#Conversion). So it does seem like original research to say Muslims = Immigrants.VR _talk 05:19, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

The point is that this is a direct consequence of Sweden's immigration policies since 1975, and would not have happened without it, and as such should be referenced within the page. Sweden's Jews live in constant fear. This is certainly relevant. David A (talk) 05:29, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

• Are all foreign born people necessarily immigrants? Often a country's citizens have kids while abroad. For example, in the US, Ted Cruz tried to run for US president, even though he was born abroad. Additionally, many foreigners must enter Sweden as tourists or on business. I'm not sure if they count as immigrants either.VR _talk 04:30, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

This seems like pointless hair-splitting. David A (talk) 04:44, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

Regardless, I saw that you censored out the statistics of the 2005 study from the Swedish Crime Prevention Bureau as well: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Immigration_to_Sweden&type=revision&diff=775639168&oldid=775638399 The problem here is that replacing them with references to slanted opinions, with an interest of hiding the truth, and blaming everything on socioeconomic factors, despite the extremely generous Swedish welfare policies for everybody in the country, rather than presenting the data as is, leaves Wikipedia open for simply advancing the bias of sources, which counts as POV-pushing. David A (talk) 05:13, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

I didn't censor the stats. I quoted them from the website of the Government of Sweden. That's a reliable secondary source. I also framed them in the context of socio-economic factors, which is also discussed by academics.VR _talk 05:22, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

Socio-economic factors may play in more heavily in countries that do not generously provide everything for immigrants for free, education, welfare, housing, etcetera, but it seems like a convenient go-to excuse in Sweden's case. Regardless, you did remove several valid statistics from the study, so I reinserted them, while keeping your new sources. David A (talk) 05:29, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

The study you cite is from 2005. While it does have its place in the article, it is WP:UNDUE to give this study grossly more space than other studies. Doing that essentially pushes a POV. Also, greater precedence should be given to newer studies and sources. Further, opinion from academics and the Swedish govt, that summarizes the situation, should be at the top of the section. We can't start off the section with raw data. Secondly, I found a source, the government of Sweden that discussed the 2005 study in a neutral manner. So we should use that instead. I'm going to go back to my version and insert some new stuff.VR _talk 05:55, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

@David A: The claim that a rise in antisemitism is "a direct consequence of Sweden's immigration policies since 1975" is WP:OR. Not every Muslim in Sweden is an immigrant as stated before and you'd need a reputable source to say that it was indeed immigration that caused a rise in antisemitism. I agree with Vice regent on the second point that you should use a source that takes outside factors into account on immigration and crime. Kamalthebest (talk) 07:33, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

I have cited a research report above that states that the rise in antisemitism is due to the constantly increasing conservative Muslim community within the country. And the 2005 crime study is the only available statistics source for the difference between immigrant and Swedish crime statistics, since the political parties have systematically voted down all suggestions for new studies, as they might benefit the Sweden Democrats. Personally, I am far more concerned with that the truth of reality is accurately reported, rather than swept under the carpet for political reasons, here or elsewhere. David A (talk) 10:36, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

@David A: Can you relink that specific source? I'd like to see it and, nonetheless, "rise in antisemitism is due to the constantly increasing conservative Muslim community" does not equal "rise in antisemitism is specifically due to immigration." For one thing, not all Muslims are immigrants. For another, not all immigrants are Muslim. Also, stop saying that this is being "swept under the rug" when all this information is already on the Antisemitism in Sweden page where it rightly belongs. For the second point, the 2005 study did not adjust for things like income, unemployment, discrimination, etc. which is why the newer statements by the Swedish government and elsewhere that do adjust for these outside factors is more reliable. Regardless, the 2005 study is already in the article so what more do you want? Kamalthebest (talk) 21:40, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

Here.

Regardless, again, in Sweden the government provides free welfare, health care, education, and housing for the immigrants. It is patent nonsense to claim that the number of highly criminal areas in the country have grown from 3 to at least 186, in 27 years, due to poverty, rather than clashes in culture, as a pretext to censor politically inconvenient valid information. Also, the government's chief advisor, and the main quoted individual for your claims, Jerzy Sarnecki, has stated himself in interviews that he is dyslexic, and incapable of reading statistics reports, which explains a lot. David A (talk) 02:54, 17 April 2017 (UTC)