Talk:Animal soul

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved to animal soul. Consensus was to move, with a concern about correct capitalization. Better to move and then discuss if the capitalization is an issue rather then leave it at a wrong name. But since Kabbalah is not part of the new name, this may not be an issue. Vegaswikian (talk) 06:43, 15 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Nefesh habehamit → animal soul (Kabbalah) – If Wikipedia really needs an article on the "animal soul" in Kabbalah, then according to Google Books "animal soul" kabbalah no reason why it can't follow WP:article titles and be in English. Also needs linking to soul, etc. In ictu oculi (talk) 16:23, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Again, thanks for linking it to soul.

Please see discussion on Talk:Nefesh ha'elokit#Requested_move.

Also, for future reference, search-engine hits are generally considered unreliable. See WP: Naming conventions (use English)#Divided usage in depth. Especially in the field of Kabbalah, much (or rather, most) information remains in Hebrew and has yet to be translated; it may therefore not appear in English search engines. Respectfully, Musashiaharon (talk) 01:57, 9 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Musashiahron. Thanks for your comments. But in this case 2610 results appear reliable. The pool of reference is standard English language WP:RS on kabbalah, and "animal soul" is not just "commonly used" as WP:UE requires, but much more common, 2,610x vs 1x. Cheers. In ictu oculi (talk) 02:47, 9 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Support. There are only four post-1980 English-language Google Book results for "nefesh habehamit" -- and in each case the translation "animal soul" is provided immediately. This compares to 1,020 for kabbalah "animal soul." Kauffner (talk) 02:57, 9 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Object. See my comments on Talk:Nefesh ha'elokit#Requested_move. Musashiaharon (talk) 07:06, 9 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
REname to Animal soul (which currently redirects here). While this is a Jewish theological concept, there is no reason why it should solely be a Jewish one. This is the English WP, so that article titles should where possible be in English. The Hebrew version can of course continue to exist as a redirect, as is normal after moves. Peterkingiron (talk) 17:56, 9 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose till capitalisation is clarified. (Please take care! There is a difference in titles between "Kabbalah" and "kabbalah".) Noetica^Tea? 02:59, 10 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Noetica, apologies, overcompensating for continual overcapitalisation of Hebrew loanwords in populist sources. Kabbalah is capitalised in WP:RS. Have corrected the proposal above (though expect it will not feed through/update to the actual RM page). In ictu oculi (talk) 03:58, 10 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Rename to Animal soul. No need to have "kabbalah" here. And by the way, it should be "kabbalah" with a lowercase "k". Debresser (talk) 02:27, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Behamit or behemit

Does someone have access to a vowelized text where this expression comes from? The noun is behema, which ordinarily would take the adjectival form behemati, but there's an alternative form in some registers of Hebrew that's behemi. So it should be Nefesh behemit.—Biosketch (talk) 15:38, 15 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I haven't a vowellized text right now, but Chabad.org spells it as "behamit": http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/361896/jewish/The-Benoni.htm Musashiaharon (talk) 00:47, 16 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The Chayenu's vowelization (Tanya for Friday, 4 Teves) spells it נֶפֶשׁ הַבְּהֵמִית‎, nefesh hab'heimit, with a patach-sh'va-tzeirei-chirik. Musashiaharon (talk) 01:01, 16 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hebrew: נֶפֶשׁ הַבְּהֵמִית makes more sense. Also, conceivably the reason why editors were getting so few results with the Hebrew form is because they were confining their searches just to "nefesh habehamit." More books show up at Google Books when in addition to "nefesh habehamit" one also searches for "nefesh habehemit," "nefesh behemit," and "nefesh behamit."

Found another text also in the Chayenu that vowelizes it as נֶפֶשׁ הַבַּהֲמִית‎ nefesh habahamit, patach-patach-chataf patach-chirik (p. 116, Chayenu: Metzora, 5774 March 30-April 5, 2014). Musashiaharon (talk) 03:12, 31 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Yetzer Hara

Article claims Animal soul is synonymous with yetzer hara. Article here claims not: https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/924915/jewish/Evil-Inclination-vs-Animal-Soul.htm | MK17b | (talk) 04:55, 11 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]