Talk:Boasso Global

COI Editing

This article continues to have problems with a Conflict of Interest editor attempting to white wash it with company marketing information. Since previous warnings on the user talk page about Conflict of Interest have been ignored I'm escalating the warning to this talk page which has greater public visibility including on Google Searches. If it continues then the next step will be posting a notice on the COI Noticeboard which will bring further attention to this problem. -- GreenC 14:20, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

I need to understand what would be acceptable as an update as the information listed is not accurate and stale -- information is listed form 2013 and it is two years later in which the company has changed, etc.

Let's come to an agreement of a description that would be acceptable to you. Let's work together instead of just going back and forth.

QDIIR — Preceding unsigned comment added by 4.71.9.166 (talk) 14:27, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

First thing is stop deleting sourced content and replacing it with unsourced content. The rule of WIkipedia is that anything that is unsourced can be deleted at any time. Everything on Wikipedia needs to be sourced. Please read our rules and regulations. Start with WP:V. So everything you wrote is unsourced and needs to be deleted. Furthermore the sources need to be secondary ie. not connected to the company - not company sources rather things like newspapers and magazines by journalists with no connection to the company. There are some exceptions for basic factual information (ticket symbol, company president name etc), but in the main the majority of sources should be secondary. There may not be many sources available for the things you want to say. -- GreenC 14:37, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

The current information about Quality Distribution is stale and inaccurate - it is listing information from 2012, we are in 2015. If there are COI issues in the script (largest, etc.), then we can adjust the language, but the information regarding June 30, 2014 is more accurate than information listed from 2012. If there is information that you feel is COI, let's come to a conclusion on a re-write instead of going back and forth. would the following be acceptable -- this would be information found an encyclopedia:

Quality Distribution, Inc. (“Quality”)' (Nasdaq: QLTY ) operates the a chemical bulk tank truck network in North America through its wholly owned subsidiary, Quality Carriers, Inc. (“QCI”), and a provider of intermodal International Organization for Standardization (“ISO”) tank container and depot services in North America through its wholly owned subsidiary, Boasso America Corporation (“Boasso”). In 2011, Quality began providing logistics and transportation services, including the transportation of crude oil, fresh water and production fluids, to the unconventional oil and gas (“UCO&G”) market through its wholly owned subsidiaries, QC Energy Resources, Inc. and QC Environmental Services, Inc. (collectively “QCER”). Quality operates an asset-light business model and services customers across North America. As of June 30, 2014, Quality operated through a network of 94 terminals servicing the chemical and other bulk liquid markets, 9 ISO tank depot services terminals (intermodal) also servicing the chemical and other bulk liquid markets and 16 terminals servicing the energy market. Quality utilized approximately 3,600 drivers and managed a fleet of approximately 3,200 tractors, 5,500 trailers and 1,200 pieces of other energy logistics equipment. Quality’s asset-light business model operates via business networks.

--Thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by QDIIR (talk • contribs)

The problem, as noted above, is the lack of sourcing. The article needs to follow WP:V ie. information that we (I, others) can independently verify. Everything written above is unsourced and we have no way to verify its accuracy other than "trust me". -- GreenC 14:48, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Ok - The information can be verified via the 10-K filed with the Securities Exchange Commission that is audited by a third party (PricewaterhouseCoopers)- the below information regarding 12/31/2014 can be found on page 3 under the Business Overview of Quality and on page 33 regarding the tractors, trailers, etc. The new description would be the following:

Quality Distribution, Inc. (“Quality”)' (NASDAQ: QLTY ) operates the a chemical bulk tank truck network in North America through its wholly owned subsidiary, Quality Carriers, Inc. (“QCI”), and a provider of intermodal International Organization for Standardization (“ISO”) tank container and depot services in North America through its wholly owned subsidiary, Boasso America Corporation (“Boasso”). In 2011, Quality began providing logistics and transportation services, including the transportation of crude oil, fresh water and production fluids, to the unconventional oil and gas (“UCO&G”) market through its wholly owned subsidiaries, QC Energy Resources, Inc. and QC Environmental Services, Inc. (collectively “QCER”). Quality operates an asset-light business model and services customers across North America. As of December 31, 2014, Quality operated through a network of 95 terminals servicing the chemical and other bulk liquid markets, 9 ISO tank depot services terminals (intermodal) also servicing the chemical and other bulk liquid markets and 19 terminals servicing the energy market. Quality utilized approximately 3,500 drivers and managed a fleet of approximately 3,200 tractors, 5,700 trailers and 1,200 pieces of other energy logistics equipment. Quality’s asset-light business model operates via business networks.

Would you agree to this update? — Preceding unsigned comment added by QDIIR (talk • contribs) 15:01, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

From my talkpage

From my talkpage (in italics):

Joseph2302

The current information about Quality Distribution is stale and inaccruate - it is listing information from 2012, we are in 2015. If there are COI issues in the script (largest, etc.), then we can adjust the language, but the information regarding June 30, 2014 is more accurate than information listed from 2012. If there is information that you feel is COI, let's come to a conclusion on a re-write instead of going back and forth.

Thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by QDIIR (talk • contribs) 14:37, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

I agree that the current information is probably outdated, as it's 2012 information. However, the text you wrote had no [{WP:RS|reliable sources]]- without reliable sources, it counts as original research. The text you added also read as promotional and not neutral point of view, making unsourced claims of excellence such as " operates the largest chemical bulk tank truck network in North America through its wholly owned subsidiary, Quality Carriers, Inc. (“QCI”), and is also the largest provider of intermodal International Organization for Standardization (“ISO”) tank container and depot services in North America".

I added back the infobox, since that seems good. Joseph2302 (talk) 14:46, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

I agree, the lack of sourcing is the issue, especially to claims about being the best/biggest. Joseph2302 (talk) 14:50, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Ok - The information can be verified via the 10-K filed with the Securities Exchange Commission that is audited by a third party (PricewaterhouseCoopers)- the below information regarding 12/31/2014 can be found on page 3 under the Business Overview of Quality and on page 33 regarding the tractors, trailers, etc. The new description would be the following:

Quality Distribution, Inc. (“Quality”)' (NASDAQ: QLTY ) operates the a chemical bulk tank truck network in North America through its wholly owned subsidiary, Quality Carriers, Inc. (“QCI”), and a provider of intermodal International Organization for Standardization (“ISO”) tank container and depot services in North America through its wholly owned subsidiary, Boasso America Corporation (“Boasso”). In 2011, Quality began providing logistics and transportation services, including the transportation of crude oil, fresh water and production fluids, to the unconventional oil and gas (“UCO&G”) market through its wholly owned subsidiaries, QC Energy Resources, Inc. and QC Environmental Services, Inc. (collectively “QCER”). Quality operates an asset-light business model and services customers across North America. As of December 31, 2014, Quality operated through a network of 95 terminals servicing the chemical and other bulk liquid markets, 9 ISO tank depot services terminals (intermodal) also servicing the chemical and other bulk liquid markets and 19 terminals servicing the energy market. Quality utilized approximately 3,500 drivers and managed a fleet of approximately 3,200 tractors, 5,700 trailers and 1,200 pieces of other energy logistics equipment. Quality’s asset-light business model operates via business networks.

Would you agree to this update?

Would this be acceptable as the source is a public document that filed with the Securities Exchange Commission and audited by a third party (PriceWaterhouseCoopers) -- are you in agreement? — Preceding unsigned comment added by QDIIR (talk • contribs) 15:15, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

I'm trying to find the December 2014 10-K and having trouble. I found the 2013 copy. Do you have a link to the 2014? -- GreenC 15:23, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

I updated the description of Quality and linked it to the 2014 10-K -- here is the link just in case: http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/922863/000119312515090590/d828579d10k.htm

Also, for the reference of #2 - I would like to say - "Quality Distribution Inc. Form 10-K - December 31, 2014" -- how do I do that? Thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by QDIIR (talk • contribs) 15:30, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for the 2014 10-k link. I think the problem then is that a 10K is considered a primary source (see WP:PRIMARY). It is audited but is written by the company itself. It's not a source independent of the company. Nevertheless we can use information from it, but per PRIMARY it can't be the majority of the sources. So lets keep the other sources as part of the ongoing history of the company. -- GreenC 15:41, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Sounds good -- I'm fine with how it was broken out, etc. Why did Hroodlf revert it to the old version? — Preceding unsigned comment added by QDIIR (talk • contribs) 15:44, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

I reverted it because (1) per earlier notices, you are strongly discouraged from editing the article except in a few clearly defined circumstances and (2) you can't use a close paraphrase of the 10-K filing : that is the copyright of its author. --Hroðulf (or Hrothulf) (Talk) 15:52, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Green Cardamom - would you revert it back and have this been the information utilized? — Preceding unsigned comment added by QDIIR (talk • contribs) 15:48, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

The problem was copyright violation the text from the 10K was verbatim. I've rewritten it. -- GreenC 15:51, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Green Cardamom - Thank you very much for the assistance today to get the information updated, etc. Once last minor item -- there is a double "a" when describing QCI -- would you revise or should I? Thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by QDIIR (talk • contribs) 16:06, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Sure no problem. You seem to be working in good faith to improve the article. Wikipedia has a lot of arcane requirements to prevent abuse. Feel free to propose edits by editing the article directly, anyway I have no problem with that. If it's a major change it would be best to propose here on the talk page first. -- GreenC 16:22, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

1. Copyright is certainly arcane, but it is the law, and Wikipedia editors often enforce it.
2. As for the COI guideline, it is perhaps arcane, but guidelines are taken very seriously, and they grew from bitter experience. COI editing requires much more than good faith; it also requires the almost superhuman ability to write for the enemy. I strongly discourage you (CDIIR) from directly editing the article except in the specific circumstances described in the guideline.
3. Of course you can delete the double 'a' yourself.

--Hroðulf (or Hrothulf) (Talk) 13:36, 7 May 2015 (UTC)