Talk:Lacedaemon

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1907?[edit]

[...]which had in 1907 a population of 87,106. Is this a typo, it doesn't make a lot of sense to put this kind of data in the article. 1997? I'll remove the phrase altogether, as it's not really relevant. Also, note that Lacedemonia is a "province", not a "department" (Provinces of Greece).merryXIV 11:22, 18 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

What is origin of word "Lacedaemon"?[edit]

What is the origin/etymology of the word "Lacedaemon"? -- 201.50.254.243 11:28, 7 April 2007 (UTC) It belongs together with Laconia (the name of the landscape), but the origin is unknown. Enkyklios (talk) 15:48, 17 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Merge[edit]

We should definitely merge this with Sparta, because all the information here is probably already there, and even so, there's not much of a point to this page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Elisk (talk • contribs) 02:23, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. Though this article could use some more information, Lacedaemon is a different concept than Sparta. Sparta was the capital city of Lacedaemon, just as Sparti is the capital of modern Laconia. Merging these two articles would be like merging France into Paris. Though they are related concepts, they each deserve their own articles. Lovelac 7 00:17, 12 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with the merge. Both articles would be enriched if merged. Pel thal (talk) 15:41, 14 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Support the merge. "Sparta" is used to describe the city and the state, and the current "Sparta" article treats the whole history of the Spartan state. Clarifications about "Lacedaemon" can and should be included in the "Sparta" article.--Yannismarou (talk) 16:49, 15 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Support per above. Wandalstouring (talk) 16:57, 15 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Support Lycurgus (talk) 14:31, 3 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Doubtful[edit]

"The Spartans used the red Greek capital letter, lambda (Λ) (displayed on their shields) as an identification as the people of Lacedaemon, their home city-state or polis." Could this have been engendered by a recent movie? --Wetman 12:36, 25 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

No. See The Spartans by Peter Cartledge, page 76. He states that after 464 the Periocoi were incorporated into Spartan phalanxes and "presumably wore the letter lambda (an inverted V) emblazoned on their shields in the same manner as they." So, at least during the period between the Persian and Peloponnesian Wars, Spartan hoplites did display the Lambda on their shield. Just because something is depicted in a Hollywood movie, doesn't mean it was fabricated. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.95.123.157 (talk) 05:07, 4 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Anonymous editor is right. This is definetly older than the movie. Wandalstouring (talk) 09:35, 4 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, but the Lacedaemonians also used many other emblems to signify their clan etc. The correct thing to say is that

"The Spartans used, among other emblems, the red Greek capital letter, lambda (Λ) (displayed on their shields) as an identification as the people of Lacedaemon, their home city-state or polis."

I believe that this is better and still gives the appropriate information as to this very famous symbol indeed...

GK1973 (talk) 01:52, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Lacedaemon according to Herodot[edit]

Unfortunately, there is a great misconception as to what Herodot said about the origin of the Dorians and thus that of the Lacedaemonians.

I here present the text in question :

“Although the one nation nowhere yet went out, the Lacedaemonian was very much wandering. For, in the time of King Deucalion, it was settled in the land of Phthia, and in the time of Dorus, the son of Hellen, in the country under Ossa and Olympus, the so-called Histiaean. From the Histiaean, after it had been expelled by the Cadmeians, it was settled in Pindus called Macedonian. Thence again it changed its place to the Dryopian land, and from the Dryopian thus it came to Peloponnesus, and was called Doric.” (Herodot, Book I, 56.3)

I strongly believe that we should mention that according to Herodot, the Lacedaemonians were descendants of the Macedonian Dorians.

GK1973 (talk) 01:47, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]