Talk:Ladrón Íñiguez

On his marriage to Elvira de Monzón

There is no record that Elvira married Ladrón. She married count Rodrigo Gómez (Salvadorez) and appears with him in Oña in 1142 and he died in 1160. In 1161 she appears in Oña confirming the donations made by her late husband. She is said to have died in Jerusalem and her body brought back to Oña for burial. So it seems unlikely that she married Ladron who appears in two charters in 1149 making a donation with his wife Teresa (Historia del condado de Oñate y señorío de los Guevara (...) by María Roasa Ayerbe Iríbar - 1985, pag. 12). The term princeps or similar in early navarrese charters appears often but does not refer to a "prince" per se, but rather to a "principal" character, a sennior. --Maragm (talk) 22:31, 8 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Our article on Rodrigo Gómez says as much, so I've hidden the section for now. The term "prince" is, I think, a pretty standard translation of medieval princeps. I don't think readers will have a problem with, e.g., "princes of the Empire" for the dukes of medieval Germany. Srnec (talk) 00:10, 10 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

This is actually a confused rendering of a relationship found in a 14th century genealogy, which reports that Ladron Iniguez married Elvira, the illegitimate daughter of King Garcia Ramirez. This is almost certainly the origin of 'Elvira de Monzon' as Ladron's wife, as formerly given here (but displaced back a generation to be Garcia's sister). That said, the material has been hidden for a decade and nobody seemed to mind, so I went ahead and just deleted it. Agricolae (talk) 23:25, 28 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]