Talk:Midlands (disambiguation)/Archive 1

Archive 1

Boundaries

I've reverted to the previous wording which I think was reasonably balanced and added a little. Regional identity is not strong in England and TV coverage is an important element. As TV Ark ITV Midlands and the ITV Central Regional Statement (pdf) says, Central News South for the South Midlands covers Oxfordshire, Buckinghamshire, Gloustershire and Herefordshire.

When I lived in Ledbury, I certainly didn't think the South West started a few km down the road at the Gloucestershire border and when I lived in Oxford I was surprised that the BBC local news was for London rather than the Midlands. --Cavrdg 08:12, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

Oxfordshire and Gloucestershire are both considered to be southern counties. I don't even see how this is in discussion - it's fairly clear cut. It's like suggesting that Cheshire - which is universally acknowledged to be in the North is in the Midlands. It just...isn't! :)

I don't think any of these things are as clear-cut as you suggest. I don't know where you're based, but I lived 6 years in Oxford and 5 years in Gloucester, and the regional identity of both was really quite confused. Especially Gloucester, which regarded itself variously as part of the Marches (relating westwards), the West Midlands (relating northwards), the South Midlands (relating eastwards) and the West Country (relating southwards). Regional identity in England just isn't all that strong, and so the boundaries tend to be much more vague than we might like them to be. Vilcxjo 23:56, 10 November 2005 (UTC)

It's for that reason that I toned down the absolutist statements about Cheshire in the article. I don't know what the local perception is, but it's not uncommon to find the Mersey–Humber line being treated as the southern boundary of "Northern England", which would exclude Cheshire. In the circumstances, better to cover the options rather than say "this is right, that's wrong". Vilcxjo 01:59, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

Yep. Quite agree here. Midlands is a very vague term. There's no magical line between Crewe and Stoke, or between Tewkesbury and Evesham. Morwen - Talk 02:12, 26 November 2005 (UTC)

Right. The 1911 edition of encyclopedia britannica refers to Gloucestershire as being a "west midland" county. And Bedfordshire as being a "south midland" county. And Huntingdonshire as being an "east midland" county! It considers Cheshire in the north west. And it refers to Lincolnshire just as being an "eastern county", along with Norfolk/Suffok/Cambridgeshire. Morwen - Talk 02:23, 26 November 2005 (UTC)

this says the Midland counties are Glos, Oxon, Wilts, Berks, Surrey, Middlesex, Bucks, Herts, Beds, Northants, Hunts, Cambs, Rutland, Leics, Notts, Derbyshire, Staffs, Warwickshire, Worcestershire, which is probably the widest definition i've even seen (Wiltshire, really!) And Surrey!!! Morwen - Talk 14:34, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

As someone from Yorkshire, I would add that the position of Cheshire is often overshadowed by groups of left-wing Northerners abusing Cheshire for being wealthy and for its residents' speaking generally much more refined English than most counties in England. I expect that a few of the snobbier people in Cheshire might actually agree with them that it should be in the Midlands! However, Cheshire historically included Birkenhead, Stockport and even the southern part of the city of Manchester, around Wythenshawe. Seeing as the new counties linked bits of Lancashire and Cheshire together, it seems best to keep them together in the North. Epa101 (talk) 13:17, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Although Stoke-on-Trent and the rest of North Staffs is lumped in with the West Midlands for government administrative convenience, the locals don't think of themselves as Midlanders but as Northerners. Visitors often comment that the conurbation 'feels' Northern (I've heard it described derisively as 'Coronation Street land'). I remember massive local annoyance when local TV coverage was switched from Manchester to Birmingham in the late 60s, and people always consider Manchester to be their nearest big city. Most people use Manchester airport rather than Birmingham. There's no sense of community with the Black Country at all. --80.176.142.11 (talk) 13:44, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Regional identity in Banbury is particularly confusing. I grew up there and always thought of it as part of the Midlands, since we got ATV/Central TV, Midland Red buses, Midlands Electricity Board etc., and can buy the Birmingham Post there but not the London Evening Standard. On the other hand it came under Network South East in the days of British Rail, is part of the BBC's South East region, and of course is in Oxfordshire which is usually considered a southern county and is even often described (wrongly) as being part of the Home Counties. MFlet1 (talk) 16:16, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Banbury is clearly in the Midlands, as is (less obviously) Oxford. Bizarrely, BBC regional TV news for Banbury now comes from Southampton about 90 miles away on the South Coast (BBC South Today). It features endless fascinating reports about yacht racing and cruise ships. Banbury is about as far from the sea as it's possible to get in England. --80.176.142.11 (talk) 12:50, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

North Midlands

Ello? IP Address 16:59, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

numbered or bulleted list?

please change accordingly per my last edit summary.100110100 07:06, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Notable towns and cities

Wigston has been added. Personnally I wouldn't call it notable, but it is bigger than say Skegness. I think it would be good to add some criteria to this section. Any thoughts? Bevo74 (talk) 06:44, 16 July 2008 (UTC)

Gloucestershire

The map shows that Gloucestershire is not included, as does the list of notable cities. But the article contradicts this by saying that definitions 'generally include gloucestershire...'. I'm going to remove this- after my whole life in Gloucestershire, I have never once heard it referred to as being in the Midlands: It's south west or west country. I'd also take issue with the article talking of people in Banbury has having a northern accent, but I left that. 86.2.38.112 (talk) 14:53, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

We-ell... the county as a whole is (I think) West Country, and I tend to agree that Gloucs shouldn't be classed as Midlands (though I certainly have heard people who live in the county call it that, and I'm surprised you haven't). Mind you, I also think it's pushing it a bit to call somewhere like Tewkesbury "South West". I think you could make a decent case for Tewkesbury being a Midlands town, though, although as with most of these things it's not that clear-cut. Loganberry (Talk) 15:07, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

Article title and purpose

This article seems to hover uncertainly between being a page about the Midlands in England (for which there's another page at English Midlands) or a disambiguation page (for which there's another page at Midlands (disambiguation)). Whichever of these jobs it is supposed to be doing it is doing neither well, and I can't see any reason for all three of these pages to exist - with three pages doing two jobs one of them must be redundant.

In line with WP:DAB there seem to be two possible scenarios, either...

1) The Midlands in England is clearly the primary topic for the name "Midlands" ("much more used than any other topic covered in Wikipedia to which the same word may also refer" and/or "significantly more commonly searched for and read than other meanings"), in which case other uses of the term should feature only in the hatnote and the English Midlands should be merged into it.

or...

2) There is no primary topic for the phrase "Midlands" (no one meaning is significantly more used, read or searched for than any of the others), in which case this page be the disambiguation page, Midlands (disambiguation) should redirect to it, and the content about the Midlands in England should be merged into English Midlands.

The content about the "fictitious state within the jurisdiction of the college mock trial program hosted by the American Mock Trial Association" probably ought to be deleted unless significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject to establish WP:Notability can be found.

For me the phrase "Midlands" on its own always means the area of England, but then it would, because I live there :)

JimmyGuano (talk) 10:17, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Came here to post the same complaint. The claiming of the term Midlands for the UK and relegating all others to Disambiguation is terribly biased. I think it would be best to list all world locations known as "Midlands" here on this main page and make it a disambig, then delete Midlands (disambiguation). I have no opinion on the English Midlands article. MatthewVanitas (talk) 01:03, 12 February 2009 (UTC)

Per WP:DAB, where there is a disambiguation page for the title "X", there should be at least a redirect at "X (disambiguation)". Midlands (disambiguation) has a lot more links than this one, so I think it should go the other way (turning this one into a redirect). I'm going to be bold and do this. Hairy Dude (talk) 16:43, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Note

The history corresponding to this page can be found at Talk:Midlands/Old history. Graham87 08:15, 28 December 2010 (UTC)