User talk:Moroderen

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Morodoren, try your best to be civil. This is not only your culture. Icsunonove (talk) 22:13, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

To be civil[edit]

You are right and I apologize,I lost my temper, but I don't think people should discuss their private matters on my talk page and second I work hard to write articles, while others seem just to roam around to put dots on the i's (thats a German expression). I therefore hope people to be more constructive than distructive. --Moroderen (talk) 22:50, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

Moroderen, Thanks for the reply. Understand first of all that I am also of this "Ladin" culture (from Val di Non where Nones is spoken). Trentino-Alto Adige is my culture as well. I apologize for discussing this matter on your talk page, but this PhJ person was slandering me on your talk page, so my own temper caused me to react as well. Anyway, I would enjoy having constructive discussions with you on this region, and both the provinces of TN and BZ. Note as well that everyone even putting dots on the i's (this is also an English expression) is doing an important job on Wikipedia. It is all good work. Regards to you, Icsunonove (talk) 00:47, 15 November 2008 (UTC
Well, Moroderen, my original topic was vandalism by this IP: Special:Contributions/ Please look at this IP's edits and compare them (topics and edit summaries) to those done by that T./I. guy. And, as I remember, I came to your talk page only by reading that vandal's edits. On 3 July 2008 I wrote on your talk page: "Anyway, you can delete this discussion, because I don't want any trouble ..." And as that discussion was not deleted, it was just a matter of time that guy would come to your page. Yes, I think he is a burden for the wikipedia project, it would be more peaceful without him. And actually I DON'T want any more comment by that guy, this is not his talk page. Just read everything he has written (including the IP's comments) and make up your mind. I have avoided "contact" with him for years, and I don't want to hear (or read) anything from him. But almost every time I write anything - there might have been some six, seven edits in the last two years - in articles on "his" topics (he claims sovereignty over) it seems unavoidable to hear from him. Well, my POV you are asking for is just about him, not about any contents, now you know, and hearby I tell him to leave me in peace and to be quiet at last. Honestly -- PhJ (talk) 21:11, 17 November 2008 (UTC)
PhJ, this is a very over-used term, but for you it fits perfectly: get a life. Icsunonove (talk) 03:48, 24 November 2008 (UTC)


Ok, Moroderen, I read your contribution on the talk page of Ortisei. First of all, I am a bit confused that someone of your age and experience, and I believe advanced education, can discuss things in such an extreme fashion. Please don't rush to be offended by what I say, I'm trying to make a constructive point here. Please note also that my roots are from the same culture as your own. Look, I'm well aware of the politics that is fashionable in Bolzano/Bozen to be anti "Italian" (even though I've never figured out yet who exactly the "Italians" are) or anti "German". I personally very much dislike politics and also the extreme views that come out of it. What I think is unfair, regardless of political viewpoints, is to make accusations of fascism because of a move request on the page of Ortisei. I am a native English speaker, and I know what we use to call this town. Everything is not imperialism and trying to take rights, ok? We also call Milano, Milan in English and this is not French Napoleonic colonialism! :-) Look, I love the Ladin languages and dialects, but by your argument we should also remove all the German names. Why? Because at some point these languages also invaded the area of Trentino-Alto Adige if you want to be perfectly fair, no?  :) Now, please, lets keep a calm discussion, because I do believe it can be productive. my regards, Icsunonove (talk) 02:46, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

Pictures on the page[edit]

Lots of great pictures on the Ortisei page now, but we need to figure out how to format things better. Sound good? Icsunonove (talk) 03:05, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

right, to tell you the truth I was in a hurry. I am sure you have some good suggestion. Ciao --Moroderen (talk) 06:54, 17 November 2008 (UTC)
no worries, I'll work on it. Icsunonove (talk) 00:05, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

Ladin in BZ[edit]

Hi Moroderen, so it appears from your post that Ladin overall is in decline in the province? Do you think most people list Ladin on the BZ language census simply to receive government funding? I do fear the time for "small" localized languages such as Ladin is coming to an end. Just like in Trentino where there is more practical usage of Standard Italian, I can imagine the focus in BZ is towards German and Italian -- so it leaves little room for the native language. This is a shame, because these Ladin languages of our region are indeed special -- or at least to us. One of the biggest tragedies I see is how the Standard languages divide our region. In the end are one people going to be divided by two imported languages? Icsunonove (talk) 00:05, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

FIL World Luge Championships - 1961 men's doubles[edit]

I saw your edit on the FIL World Luge Championships in the men's doubles for 1961. You were right. They were different. I adjusted the source and the gold and silver medalists for the event along with the men's doubles for the main article, for 1961, and for the champions template if you wish to have a look. Source is now per the FIL's website. Chris (talk) 00:16, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

I can see that there is a lot of misspelling on these people's name. I will fix it the next days since I know them personally. Anyhow Prinoth is the correct spelling --Moroderen (talk) 09:06, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
I#ve got it now precisely: In the double Gold medal was Karl Prinoth, Silver was Giorgio or Georg Moroder (He is not the famous musician) with Arnold Prinoth --Moroderen (talk) 22:28, 6 January 2009 (UTC)


Hi Moroderen, I had often wanted to have a discussion with you about the overall history of Trentino-Alto Adige. Though it isn't quite a calm discussion yet, please do read through our discussion at the Bolzano talk page, I'd like to hear your opinions. My opinion, is simply that the Italian, German, and Ladin "ethnicities" how they are described in the modern context is actually trivializing the truth and real richness of this region. Regards to you, Icsunonove (talk) 01:56, 21 January 2009 (UTC)


Thank you for uploading the Wildt image and helping me out with the newborn article.Ale Mak (talk) 00:28, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

I wish I could do more--Moroderen (talk) 09:45, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

Official Websites[edit]

Hi Moroder! The IP from Brennercom was you, who recently deleted a few external links - right? I think, that official websites of local tourist organisations should be allowed, as they contain a lot more useful informations about an area than simple links for room reservation.--Sajoch (talk) 17:49, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

maybe it was me,but wikipedia does not consider useful links which have only more information on the artiche, while in the meantime their purpose is eminently commercial. Those insisting in adding this type of links to the article do this only in order to appear higher on the ranking lists of search engines and never help to improve the quality of the articles. That's why I find these links despicable and I insist they don't improve the quality of wp.--Moroderen (talk) 20:20, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

More, these links can be easily found googling, so why contaminate WP?--Moroderen (talk) 20:20, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

There's only one official website for each commune/valley, so it would not clutter the article. I'm also in favour of disallowing the numerous commercial sites which sell links to hotels or want to attract traffic for their AdSense-participation. Official websites are explicitly allowed by Wikipedia guidelines. The official sites of tourist destinations also offer a lot more informations we wouldn't find in WP, like actual events, phone numbers for drugstores, doctors, police, mountain guides, ... The primary business of official tourism organisations is not selling links, but promoting the area giving as much up-to-date information as possible. Usually all hotels and accomodations of an area are members of those organisations, so the offering is balanced.
I also consider it a positive side-effect, if official sites rank higher in SE than commercial sites.--Sajoch (talk) 09:32, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
Dear detective Grasshopper, Tourism organisations are commercial agencies and their websites are not "official links" since "The linked content is" not " controlled by the subject (organization or individual person) of the Wikipedia article" see Wikipedia:External links#Official links. Besides that, German Wiki explicitly refuses such links - look here --Moroderen (talk) 11:48, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
Thanks for the title detective :-)
Tourism organisations are not necessarily commercial, and their goal is not to earn money - in fact they don't (see [1]).
But if there is agreement to not accept links to official tourism organisations, we should enforce it also on other destinations - there's a lot of clean-up to be done.--Sajoch (talk) 13:53, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
Maybe we should put a link to the relative page on DMOZ?--Sajoch (talk) 13:56, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
You are right and the organisations get subsidies from the public hand. Still I don't like to see them around on WP :-)). I fully agree with you to make the clean up. What's DMOZ?--Moroderen (talk) 17:17, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
Googling? See Open Directory Project about "Ortisei". E.g. for Cortina on, they linked the DMOZ-page .--Sajoch (talk) 08:55, 11 May 2011 (UTC)
mmmm, I don't think so. I believe WP GL do not like links to lists of websites. Googling?To Google - The act of using the google search engine i.e. look up what a person does or is. Things my daughter tells me about.--Moroderen (talk) 11:57, 11 May 2011 (UTC)
I don't get what your daughter tells you - you may google everything, not just about persons... "Googling" is a correct form of the verb "to google". In german I would have said: "Googeln?" as a short form of "Wie wär's mit ein bisschen Herumgooglen, um zu erörtern was DMOZ ist? das hätte dir diese Frage erspart". I'm astonished to see, you didn't know about DMOZ. :-)

Please lets sum up: is a link to a DMOZ-category OK? Tourism-related links should go there, so we can safely delete all such external links from WP. Otherwise it will be an endless fight.--Sajoch (talk) 08:24, 12 May 2011 (UTC)

You are right, but I don't consider this a endless fight, I rather thought it to be a friendly and open discussion.
  • I disagree with the links to DMOZ-categories (see Wikipedia:External links#Links normally to be avoided point 9, 13 and 20 maybe).
  • I still believe tourism links are mostly disgusting and tasteless, maybe I am a snob.
  • Isn't there a possibility to start a discussion out there with a wider audience?--Moroderen (talk) 22:31, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
The fight is not among us - we are simply discussing the issue. The fight is against those web-developers, seo-agencies and tourism-organisations which constantly try to add their portals to Wikipedia. Which discussion page would be the right place to discuss this issue? Possibly on a global level - otherwise we will have different rules for Alta Badia (South Tyrol), Cortina (Belluno) and Sankt Anton (Austria), resulting in unfair competition.--Sajoch (talk) 07:25, 13 May 2011 (UTC)
in de we usually accept DMOZ-links but not the links to Tourism organisations--Martin Se (talk) 17:38, 13 May 2011 (UTC)


Hi, I am interested in languages and I love South Tyrol where I have been many times for vacations. I added a phoneme table to the Ladin language article but I don't speak Ladin and I am not a linguist. I want to ask you about the pronunciation of /h/ in words like puhin, troht, zah, sciah, rehl. Does this sound like in English "have" or like in German "ach" or in Scottish "loch"? This is not clear from the source I consulted [2]. It says there "L grafem h à n valour blot grafematich tles combinazions chi, che, ghi, ghe; al à endere valour fonetich te paroles con na basa germanica olache al vegn pronunzié plu o manco desche l -ch- todesch." What does that mean?  Andreas  (T) 15:36, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

es heist: h hat in den Wörtern germanischen Ursprungs einen phonetischen Wert, also wird es ausgesprochen. Nicht so stark wie ach, würde sagen zwischen ach und have--Moroderen (talk) 21:35, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Ladin /ë/[edit]

As far as I understand, the trema on the <ë> as in vërt is only used in the Gardeina and adjacent valeys but is omitted in standard Ladin. Am I right?  Andreas  (T) 18:02, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

I guess only in Gherdëina and in no other valley. I will check I am not a linguist myself.--Moroderen (talk) 18:41, 16 May 2011 (UTC)
Here the voice of the expert: gherdëina, badiot in Val Badia and fodom have the "ë", as a suprasegmental phonetical element - it means "ë" (spoken) is a phonem and has the graphem ë (written element, but the phonem "ë" is not allways a graphem, the graphem is only - and even here not allways - in tonic position) - changing the significate: ërt - ert. fascian and anpezan have not this graphem element "ë" (the idiom of moena has the "ö", as an own phonem and graphem) standard has not the graphem "ë", this is true (the consequence is - in my opinion - that the ladin language loses an important graphical indication for the right pronunciation) dear regards and ... sorry for my english. Signed david lardschneider --Moroderen (talk) 06:58, 17 May 2011 (UTC)
We see the frequent use of "ë" also in the Badiot dialect, see La Usc di Ladins. As Lardschneider points out, omitting the "ë" would be a great deficit and lead to misreadings - I can't believe they omitted it in Ladin Standard.--Sajoch (talk) 08:13, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Parish Church of Urtijëi[edit]

Parish church Urtijei internal view.jpg
An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status
Your image, File:Parish church Urtijei internal view.jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Julia\talk 16:46, 17 November 2012 (UTC)

POTD notification[edit]

Hi Wolfgang,

Just to let you know that the Featured Picture File:Parish church Urtijei internal view.jpg is due to make an appearance as Picture of the Day on May 9, 2014. If you get a chance, you can check and improve the caption at Template:POTD/2014-05-09. Thank you for all of your contributions! — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:18, 22 April 2014 (UTC)

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