Talk:Orson Welles

Trivia

• Welles's persona and his problems in the 1950s and '60s are paid (under the alter ego of Leander Starr) an extremely witty and affectionate tribute in the 1962 novel Genius by Patrick Dennis, of Auntie Mame memory.

• During Welles's radio years, he often freelanced and would split his time between the Mercury Theatre, CBS, Mutual and NBC, among others. Due to this, Welles rarely rehearsed, instead reading ahead during other actors' lines, a practice used by some radio stars of the time. Many of his co-stars on The Shadow have remarked about this in various interviews. There are a number of apocryphal stories where Welles was reported to have turned to an actor during the mid-show commercial break and commented that this week's story was fascinating and he couldn't wait to "find out how it all ends." Welles admitted to preferring the cold-reading style in his on-air performances as he described the hectic nature of radio work to Peter Bogdanovich in This Is Orson Welles: "Soon I was doing so many [programs] that I didn't even rehearse. I'd come to a bad end in some tearjerker on the seventh floor of CBS and rush up to the ninth (they'd hold an elevator for me), where, just as the red light was going on, somebody'd hand me a script and whisper, 'Chinese mandarin, seventy-five years old', and off I'd go again... Not rehearsing... made it so much more interesting. When I was thrown down the well or into some fiendish snake pit, I never knew how I'd get out."

• Due to his busy radio schedule, he was hard pressed to find ways to get from job to job in busy New York City traffic. In an interview conducted in his later years, Welles tells how he "discovered that there was no law in New York that you had to be sick to travel in an ambulance." Therefore, he took to hiring ambulances to take him, sirens blazing, through the crowded streets to get to various buildings.

• He dated Billie Holiday around the time he was making Citizen Kane. According to Holiday's autobiography, Lady Sings the Blues, she saw the film nine times before it ever played in a theater.

• Welles voiced a trailer for The Incredible Shrinking Man in 1957.

• It was Welles who suggested to Peter Bogdanovich that he shoot The Last Picture Show in black and white.

• He was considered for the role of Vito Corleone in The Godfather (1972) and by his own account was very disappointed not to have been given it. Some accounts state that he was the first choice of Francis Ford Coppola to play Colonel Kurtz in Apocalypse Now (1979), a film based on the novel Heart of Darkness which Welles was planning to adapt before he wrote Citizen Kane.

• He was originally considered for the part of Darth Vader in Star Wars (1977), but George Lucas thought that Welles's voice would be too recognisable. Welles later lent his voice to the film's trailer.

• Welles narrated Drippy the Runaway Raindrop by Sidney, Mary and Alexandra Sheldon which continues to be a popular English educational series in Japan.

• He performed narration for two songs by the heavy metal band Manowar, a favorite of his niece. The narration of the song "Defender" from Fighting the World, released two years after his death, is among Welles's last performances.

• He died the same day as his Battle of Neretva co-star Yul Brynner.

• Orsonwelles, a genus of linyphiid spiders from the Hawaiian Islands, was named in Welles's honor in 2002. Many species - like Orsonwelles othello, Orsonwelles macbeth, Orsonwelles falstaffius, Orsonwelles ambersonorum- are named after well-known characters played by the late actor.

• Welles's ashes were buried on the property of a long time friend, retired bullfighter Antonio Ordoñez, in Ronda (Málaga), Spain. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.49.145.189 (talk) 18:56, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

• A statue of Welles was recently unveiled in Split, Croatia. It was sculpted by Oja Kodar – Welles’s companion during the final years of his life.

Why don't these warrent? Certainly some should go, i.e. the radio material would serve better being incorporated in the portion of his biography covering that era or the Mercury Theatre on the Air page, but the Spider genus? LamontCranston (talk) 20:36, 26 May 2009 (UTC)

self-contradictory material in article for removal

Section:

In his book, Whatever Happened to Orson Welles?, writer Joseph McBride claims that Welles left America in the 1950s to escape McCarthyism and the blacklist, though Welles himself denied this. According to Welles, he personally asked the House Un-American Activities Committee to allow him to appear and "explain to you why I'm not a communist." They turned him down.

According to McBride, Welles disapproved of many of the excesses of the 1960s, and disliked the counterculture in general. Much of The Other Side of the Wind is taken up with a satirical depiction of countercultural tastes and style. Welles was also extremely puritanical about sex, and told his friend and biographer Peter Bogdanovich that his film The Last Picture Show was "a dirty movie". The only films Welles directed which contain overtly erotic elements are F for Fake and the unfinished Other Side of the Wind, which many attribute to Oja Kodar's influence.

The above material is garbage. The first paragraph is self-contradictory in that it wishes to claim that something is true and at the same time say that it is not true. If the person in question denied what is claimed, its difficult to understand what the point of this is. The second problem is that McBride offers no particular evidence that HUAC turned Welles down or that this offer was in fact ever made.

The second paragraph is even worse. It makes no sense. Welles is presented as a anti-counterculture sex prude even though two contemporary works of his contain erotic elements. Worse yet, we get conspiratorial garbage to the effect that Welles work doesn't reflect Welles but rather "influence" of Oja Kodar.

If anyone wants this material in the article, at a minimum it has to be presented in a coherent manner. The article cannot make claims that it then immendiatly contradicts. The article cannot offer theories about the influence of Oja Kodar. I dont see removing this material as controversial or even worth much discussion. Is anyone out there going to defend it? 70.234.224.231 (talk) 04:46, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

I've re-edited the section to keep the text but remove the contradictions in the text. 70.234.224.231 (talk) 05:06, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

I would say it represented a clear distinction between the statements of a biographer and his subject. Rich Farmbrough, 11:11, 2 February 2010 (UTC).

Refs

Rich Farmbrough, 11:17, 2 February 2010 (UTC).

Hilarious if true

In 1937, he rehearsed Marc Blitzstein's pro-union "labour opera" The Cradle Will Rock.

Since the unions forbade the actors and musicians performing from the stage, The Cradle Will Rock began with Blitzstein introducing the show and playing the piano accompaniment on stage, with the cast performing their parts from the audience.

208.127.59.28 (talk) 00:00, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

No it was the WPA-FTP, and the whole affair is actually blown out of proportion - it was really just some political technicalities and they asked it be delayed a day or two. You dont see the same level of attention being lavished on Living Newspaper which was subject to censorship and condemnation on a number of occasions due to depictions of Italies invasion of Ethiopia and domestic labor strife. LamontCranston (talk) 20:29, 26 May 2009 (UTC)

Ancestry accuracy

Surely his father was not "Richard Head Welles" -- that must be mischief. —Preceding unsigned comment added by You, Me and Everyone Else (talk • contribs) 13:24, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

It should be double-checked, but Head is a surname still around in England. Actor/Singer Murray Head (Judas in the original 1968 album "Jesus Christ Superstar") and his brother Anthony Head (Giles in Buffy the Vampire Slayer) are an example.--WickerGuy (talk) 13:29, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

Yessir. Richard Head Welles. See Orson Welles, a biography by Barbara Leaming--WickerGuy (talk) 13:32, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

Regarding the reference to Gideon Welles, "Perhaps the genesis of the myth dates to a 1970 interview on The Dick Cavett Show during which Welles remarks about his venerable great-grandfather Gideon Welles." In a radio broadcast in 1944 he referred to Gideon as has "great-grand-uncle" which predates this by 26 years, and gives the relationship as being different, and not contradicted by the evidence mentioned in the article. This occurs about 3 minutes into the show, downloadable at http://www.archive.org/download/1944OrsonWellesRadioAlmanacpart1/440503_Lucille_Ball_AFRS_64kb.mp3

96.251.199.205 (talk) 02:34, 21 September 2010 (UTC)billybob —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.251.199.205 (talk) 02:30, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Treasure Island

I say keep the image - I don't see how it fits speedy deletion criteria. --Scott Free (talk) 14:56, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Unreferenced "dispute" about The Third Man

Some user accounts are persisting with a claim that there is some "dispute" or vague rumor which states that Welles, rather than Reed, directed The Third Man. This is clearly unsupported -- there is no reliable source for this claim and none has been offered. (One brief speculation by a fringe viewpoint like Dan Schneider does not qualify as a scholarly source nor does it pass Wikipedia criteria forWP:UNDUE). All books and documentaries only mention Reed. More importantly, in his 1969 interview with Peter Bogdanovich (This is Orson Welles, page 220), Welles specifically said he made only minor contributions to the film -- and stated the film was all Greene, Reed and Korda. Without any reliable citations or references, this "dispute" remains a fanciful rumor, violates WP policy on WP:OR and WP:BOP and should be removed. — CactusWriter | ^needles 16:50, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

Apparent contradiction - Citizen Kane

"...making back its budget and marketing, but RKO lost any chance of a major profit. .... Its frequent revivals on television, home video, and DVD have enhanced its "classic" status, and it ultimately recouped its costs."

So did it break even at the time or only after 30 or 40 years? Rich Farmbrough, 11:16, 2 February 2010 (UTC).

Begatting of the President

Who wrote it if not Orson Welles? I am not questioning whether the statement that he was not the writer is true, but rather requesting a citation and a point of information as to the actual author. 69.253.96.227 (talk) 06:38, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

List of awards and nominations received by Orson Welles

This new article has the details of all awards and nominations received by Orson Welles. I think a different article is not necessary and should be merged into Orson Welles.--Nilotpal42 (talk) 19:37, 27 March 2010 (UTC)

Consistent possessive needed

Both "Welles's" and "Welles'" are used within the article. According to the Manual of Style either is legitimate but we should agree on which one to use to make the article consistent. Does anybody have any strong (and useful) opinions?

For my part as the name is mono-syllabic I think that we should settle on "Welles's" as that probably reflects most people in the English speaking world's verbal pronunciation. Blakkandekka (talk) 10:02, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

• I concur. But then I was brought up on Strunk & White which prescribes "Welles's". Herostratus (talk) 18:09, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

I changed all possessives to "Welles's" which seems to be the most standard one. Thanks for bringing this up. Grunge6910 (talk) 14:07, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Great, thank you. Herostratus (talk) 15:39, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Unfinished projects tidy-up

A long while ago I started the 'Unfinished Projects' section. Since then it's grown more than a little unwieldy and has been sitting under a refimprove tag for more than a year. I've therefore tidied it up, categorised it and removed the biggest sections of uncited material. The offcuts I've been left with are below. Can references and space for them in other sections (Final Years, perhaps) be found?

Director and friend Henry Jaglom said of this period: "These same stars and whiz kid directors wouldn't help him get one of his movies made. Any one of these people could have made Orson's life so much happier these past 10 years just by nodding their heads."^{[citation needed]} The same theme was repeated by another Welles friend, singer Eartha Kitt after Welles's death: "The way Hollywood treated him was a form of envy, jealousy. He died a frustrated man. In the eyes of Hollywood he never achieved Citizen Kane again, but ironically Hollywood wouldn't let him achieve another great success like Kane."

In his later years Welles became a regular fixture at the Hollywood restaurant "Ma Maison" (part owned by chef Wolfgang Puck) where he would try to enlist the aid of financiers, producers and directors to back his various film projects. Although he was unable to obtain any funding, Welles came close with two of them: The Big Brass Ring and The Cradle Will Rock. Producer Arnon Milchan agreed to produce The Big Brass Ring if any one of six actors—Warren Beatty, Clint Eastwood, Paul Newman, Jack Nicholson, Robert Redford, or Burt Reynolds—would sign on to star. All six declined for various reasons.

Independent funding for The Cradle Will Rock had been obtained and actors had signed on, including Rupert Everett to play the young Orson Welles. Location filming was to be done in New York City with studio work in Italy. While pre-production went smoothly, three weeks before filming was to begin the money fell through. Allegedly, Welles approached Steven Spielberg to ask for assistance in rescuing the film, but Spielberg declined. The scripts to both films were published posthumously. After a studio auction, he complained that Spielberg spent $50,000 for the Rosebud sled used in Citizen Kane, but would not give him a dime to make a picture. Welles retaliated by publicly announcing the sled to be a fake, the original having been burned in the film.

The 1995 documentary Orson Welles: One-Man Band, included on the Criterion Collection DVD release of F for Fake, features scenes from several of these unfinished projects, as well as footage of Welles reading chapters from Moby-Dick; and a comedy skit taking place in a tailor shop and co-starring Charles Gray. One short, also included in the documentary, is a comedy routine in which Welles (filmed in the 1970s) plays a reporter interviewing a king, also played by Welles, but in footage shot in the 1960s. Welles finished the skit and edited it together years later. The documentary also includes two completed and edited sequences from the unreleased The Other Side of the Wind, and footage from an unbroadcast television pilot for a talk show (he is shown interviewing The Muppets and discussing his rationale for doing the talk show, which was produced in the round). The documentary is built around a college lecture given by Welles not long before his death, in which he displays frustration at being unable to complete so many projects and having spent so much of his career raising money for films rather than doing creative work.

Blakk and ekka 14:27, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Orson Welles height in feet/inches/centimeters

If first it says that he was "6 feet (180 cm)" tall, how come that further below in the same paragraph it says that other sources claim that he was "6 feet 4 inches (193 cm)", and "6 feet 1 inch (185 cm)" if 1 inch = 2.5 cm?

I mean 6 feet 4 inches should be approx. 190 cm (not 193 cm), and 6 feet 1 inch should be approx. 182,5 cm (and not 185 cm).

No, it's actually the first figure that's incorrect: 6 feet is approx. 182.88 cm (see here: Feet Inches to Centimeters Conversion Calculator and Table)

--Wayfarer (talk) 01:02, 29 April 2011 (UTC)