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Reecent contentious edits and vandalism

Storm598 Per Jisho [[1]] the change you made to the definition of ネット右翼 is incorrect. You also introduce multiple unsourced sentences like the claims "Many also exhibit praises of Japan during the historical eras such as the Muromachi and Tokugawa period" and that they show "some anti-American and anti-Western tendencies" among others. Along with the removal of valid See also entries like Gukppong (South Korea), Fenqing (China), and Little Pink (China). XiAdonis (talk) 21:11, 20 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I suggested reliable sources, especially 'book' as the source. These books clearly describe "Netto-uyoku" as the same or similar to "alt-right" in the West. It's you, not me, who does vandalism.--Storm598 (talk) 23:01, 20 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

There is no problem with the sources I have suggested, and it is 'vandalism' that you continue to erase the contents in large quantities. --Storm598 (talk) 23:14, 20 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

What "book" are you referring to? I provided a dictionary definition, here is another, this time from Kotobank [2]. Uyoku simply means right wing, netto comes from net. Unless you clarify what "book" your referring to, and why you think it is more authoritative than a dictionary, your argument doesn't hold much weight. XiAdonis (talk) 03:18, 21 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This is a ridiculous pun. "Uyoku dantai"'s original meaning is "Right-wing group". According to your argument, "Alt-right" is also "Alternative right-wing" simply by interpreting its meaning, so a disgusting far-right nonsense that it is not white nationalism is established. The dictionary has no more authority than a trusted book that can be trusted. "Uyoku" in "Netto-uyoku" means "Right-wing", but that can't be the basis for Netto-uyoku not being a far-right force. (In particular, Japanese politics has a significant nationalism and historical revisionist atmosphere overall, so no matter how much Kotobank runs by the center-left liberal journalist Asahi Shimbun, it cannot be as neutral as external views other than Japanese or Korean.) --Storm598 (talk) 03:47, 21 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I'm having trouble trying to understand what you're saying exactly but what I can see clearly is that you have not clarified what "book" you are referring to. I've provided multiple dictionary definitions both an English one (Jisho) [3] and a Japanese one (Kotobank) [4]

Both are valid and authoritative but it seems you think Kotobank is not neutral? If you scroll down you'll notice Kotobank is an amalgam of dictionaries, many give the official english translation of "right wing" for 右翼 along with the Japanese definition, the rest define the word as right wing without an english translation. You'll have quite the herculean task ahead of you if you're going to try to prove that all 6 of the dictionaries that the entries on Kotobank are pulled from are not neutral.

If I'm understanding your reply correctly it seems to be Original Research. See WP:NOR if your not familiar with this policy. XiAdonis (talk) 04:48, 21 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

No, I just described "Netto-uyoku" as being evaluated as similar to "Alt-right." I gave a clear basis, and this is never an OR. (Rather, it was you who did the OR in this article. [5])--Storm598 (talk) 04:58, 21 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I'll explain it to you in an easy-to-understand way. "alt-right" is a far-right force, and they are just an abbreviation for "alternative right-wing." "Netto-uyoku" is a far-right force, and they are just an abbreviation for "Internet right-wing." Netto-uyuku is an obvious far-right, and this is the view of the mainstream academia. --Storm598 (talk) 05:09, 21 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Netto-uyoku presents a source based on a book called Far Right.^[1]^[2]^[3]^[4] --Storm598 (talk) 05:33, 21 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

And the fact that "Netto-uyoku" is Far-right or Ultranationalist was originally written in the article, and strictly speaking, it was not something I edited and added. You deleted the phrase Far-right or Ultranationalist while doing vandalism, and I just canceled your malicious editing. --Storm598 (talk) 05:47, 21 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

What you are doing is WP:SYNTH and it 100% falls under the purview of WP:NOR. By making this argument you're ignoring the Jisho definition [6] which gives a definiton of the compound word "netto uyoku" and not just the component word "uyoku" as Kotobank does, this makes your WP:SYNTH argument even more uncredible.

Passing mentions made to the definition in books and articles are not as authoritative as dictionaries. I can provide articles as well which define netto uyoku as simply "net right wingers" as done here "The case offers insight into contemporary Japan’s so-called netto-uyo (net right-wingers . . . uyoku) phenomenon" [7] ironically I think this is actually an article you added to the page, here is another one "Japan’s “Internet right-wingers” (netto uyoku or netto hoshu)" [8].

As we both can provide likely endless sources defining the word with any number of nuances luckily there exists this tool called the dictionary which is supposed to remedy these types of disagreements with an authoritative definition of what the word actually means. XiAdonis (talk) 05:54, 21 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ Shinji Higaki, Yuji Nasu, ed. (2021). Hate Speech in Japan: The Possibility of a Non-Regulatory Approach. Cambridge University Press. p. 403. ISBN 9781108483995. The Internet and Netto-Uyoku Before I published my 2015 book, Daisuke Tsuji, a Japanese sociologist, had investigated the nature of Netto-Uyoku ('Net Far-Right') by administering an online survey among adult Japanese.
^ Cynthia Dion-Schwarz, Nathan Ryan, Julia A. Thompson, Erik Silfversten, Giacomo Persi Paoli, ed. (2018). Olympic-Caliber Cybersecurity: Lessons for Safeguarding the 2020 Games and Other Major Events. Rand Corporation. p. 25. ISBN 9781977401656. .. Japan has seen the rise of an "internet far right" (netto uyoku or netto hoshu), neonationalists who voice anti-Korean views and are harshly critical of China and the mainstream media. ...{{cite book}}: CS1 maint: multiple names: editors list (link)
^ Jason Steinhauer (ed.). History, Disrupted: How Social Media and the World Wide Web Have Changed the Past. Springer Nature. p. 27. ISBN 9783030851170. In Japan, online forums such as 2chan, which launched in 1999,37 have become havens for right-wing and nationalist groups called the "Net Far Right," or the netto uyoku.
^ Lindsay Nelson, ed. (2021). Circulating Fear: Japanese Horror, Fractured Realities, and New Media. Rowman & Littlefield. p. 30. ISBN 9781793613684. Naturally, this means that the site is also full of hateful rhetoric—stories about 2channel tend to focus on the Internet's far right (netto-uyoku), Japanese nationalists who argue, among other things, that Koreans are inferior to ...

[1] Shinji Higaki, Yuji Nasu, ed. (2021). Hate Speech in Japan: The Possibility of a Non-Regulatory Approach. Cambridge University Press. p. 403. ISBN 9781108483995. The Internet and Netto-Uyoku Before I published my 2015 book, Daisuke Tsuji, a Japanese sociologist, had investigated the nature of Netto-Uyoku ('Net Far-Right') by administering an online survey among adult Japanese.

[2] Cynthia Dion-Schwarz, Nathan Ryan, Julia A. Thompson, Erik Silfversten, Giacomo Persi Paoli, ed. (2018). Olympic-Caliber Cybersecurity: Lessons for Safeguarding the 2020 Games and Other Major Events. Rand Corporation. p. 25. ISBN 9781977401656. .. Japan has seen the rise of an "internet far right" (netto uyoku or netto hoshu), neonationalists who voice anti-Korean views and are harshly critical of China and the mainstream media. ...{{cite book}}: CS1 maint: multiple names: editors list (link)

[3] Jason Steinhauer (ed.). History, Disrupted: How Social Media and the World Wide Web Have Changed the Past. Springer Nature. p. 27. ISBN 9783030851170. In Japan, online forums such as 2chan, which launched in 1999,37 have become havens for right-wing and nationalist groups called the "Net Far Right," or the netto uyoku.

[4] Lindsay Nelson, ed. (2021). Circulating Fear: Japanese Horror, Fractured Realities, and New Media. Rowman & Littlefield. p. 30. ISBN 9781793613684. Naturally, this means that the site is also full of hateful rhetoric—stories about 2channel tend to focus on the Internet's far right (netto-uyoku), Japanese nationalists who argue, among other things, that Koreans are inferior to ...

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@@ Line 17: / Line 17: @@
 ::::: Netto-uyoku presents a source based on a book called Far Right.<ref>{{cite book|editor=Shinji Higaki, Yuji Nasu |title=Hate Speech in Japan: The Possibility of a Non-Regulatory Approach |url=https://books.google.co.kr/books?id=MjQTEAAAQBAJ&pg=PA403&dq=Netto-uyoku&hl=ko&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjujPjZkPT0AhW2yIsBHZOnC28Q6AF6BAgEEAI |quote= The Internet and Netto-Uyoku Before I published my 2015 book, Daisuke Tsuji, a Japanese sociologist, had investigated the nature of Netto-Uyoku ('Net Far-Right') by administering an online survey among adult Japanese. |date=2021 |page=403 |publisher=[[Cambridge University Press]]|isbn=9781108483995 }}</ref><ref>{{cite book|editor=Cynthia Dion-Schwarz, Nathan Ryan, Julia A. Thompson, Erik Silfversten, Giacomo Persi Paoli |title=Olympic-Caliber Cybersecurity: Lessons for Safeguarding the 2020 Games and Other Major Events |url=https://books.google.co.kr/books?id=gu1zDwAAQBAJ&pg=PA25&dq=far-right+Netto-uyoku&hl=ko&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiDjt-Tk_T0AhUICqYKHeNnCUIQ6AF6BAgDEAI |quote= .. Japan has seen the rise of an “internet far right” (netto uyoku or netto hoshu), neonationalists who voice anti-Korean views and are harshly critical of China and the mainstream media. ... |date=2018 |page=25 |publisher=[[Rand Corporation]]|isbn=9781977401656 }}</ref><ref>{{cite book|editor=Jason Steinhauer |title=History, Disrupted: How Social Media and the World Wide Web Have Changed the Past |url=https://books.google.co.kr/books?id=gaxTEAAAQBAJ&pg=PA27&dq=far-right+Netto-uyoku&hl=ko&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiDjt-Tk_T0AhUICqYKHeNnCUIQ6AF6BAgCEAI |quote= In Japan, online forums such as 2chan, which launched in 1999,37 have become havens for right-wing and nationalist groups called the “Net Far Right,” or the netto uyoku. |page=27 |publisher=Springer Nature |isbn=9783030851170 }}</ref><ref>{{cite book|editor=Lindsay Nelson |title=Circulating Fear: Japanese Horror, Fractured Realities, and New Media |url=https://books.google.co.kr/books?id=QupDEAAAQBAJ&pg=PA30&dq=far-right+Netto-uyoku&hl=ko&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiDmM-BlPT0AhU2yosBHWxlCws4ChDoAXoECAgQAg#v=onepage&q=far-right%20Netto-uyoku&f=false |quote= Naturally, this means that the site is also full of hateful rhetoric—stories about 2channel tend to focus on the Internet's far right (netto-uyoku), Japanese nationalists who argue, among other things, that Koreans are inferior to ... |date=2021 |page=30 |publisher=[[Rowman & Littlefield]]|isbn=9781793613684 }}</ref> --[[User:Storm598|Storm598]] ([[User talk:Storm598|talk]]) 05:33, 21 December 2021 (UTC)
 ::::: And the fact that "Netto-uyoku" is Far-right or Ultranationalist was originally written in the article, and strictly speaking, it was not something I edited and added. You deleted the phrase Far-right or Ultranationalist while doing vandalism, and I just canceled your malicious editing. --[[User:Storm598|Storm598]] ([[User talk:Storm598|talk]]) 05:47, 21 December 2021 (UTC)
+::::::: What you are doing is [[WP:SYNTH]] and it 100% falls under the purview of [[WP:NOR]]. By making this argument you're ignoring the Jisho definition [https://jisho.org/search/%E3%83%8D%E3%83%83%E3%83%88%E5%8F%B3%E7%BF%BC] which gives a definiton of the compound word "netto uyoku" and not just the component word "uyoku" as Kotobank does, this makes your [[WP:SYNTH]] argument even more uncredible.
+::::::: Passing mentions made to the definition in books and articles are not as authoritative as dictionaries. I can provide articles as well which define netto uyoku as simply "net right wingers" as done here "The case offers insight into contemporary Japan’s so-called netto-uyo (net right-wingers . . . uyoku) phenomenon" [https://apjjf.org/2011/9/10/Rumi-SAKAMOTO/3497/article.html#:~:text=The%20case%20offers%20insight%20into%20contemporary%20Japan%E2%80%99s%20so%2Dcalled%20netto%2Duyo%20(net%20right%2Dwingers%20.%20.%20.%20uyoku)%20phenomenon] ironically I think this is actually an article you added to the page, here is another one "Japan’s “Internet right-wingers” (netto uyoku or netto hoshu)" [https://www.nippon.com/en/currents/d00208/#:~:text=Japan%E2%80%99s%20%E2%80%9CInternet%20right%2Dwingers%E2%80%9D%20(netto%20uyoku%20or%20netto%20hoshu)].
+::::::: As we both can provide likely endless sources defining the word with any number of nuances luckily there exists this tool called the dictionary which is supposed to remedy these types of disagreements with an authoritative definition of what the word actually means. [[User:XiAdonis|XiAdonis]] ([[User talk:XiAdonis|talk]]) 05:54, 21 December 2021 (UTC)
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