Talk:Oscar De La Hoya

I find the description of the fight vs. Mayweather quite far from reality. Please listen to the post fight comments by HBO's Max Kellerman, whom I find to be the most intelligent and objective boxing analyst. He's absolutely right on. The fight was only close and the decision controversial in the eyes of casual observers who don't know much about boxing. I really like Oscar, but the only thing that shocked me about the decision was that it was split. For the life of me I can't understand how a professional boxing judge could give a fight to Oscar. This is exactly what Kellerman said. If you have any doubts please have a look at the punch stats. While it looked like the fight was close because of Oscar's more aggressive style Mayweather dominated the punch stats. To say that 2 of the judges were impressed by some random shots that he got in is absolutely ridiculous and nonobjective. Watch the fight again if you have to. But this time try to actually pay attention to the effectiveness of the punches, not just to who charges forward.

Pernell Whitaker (W 12)|(A fight which many onlookers thought he had lost)

What kind of comment is this? Why don't you just say that it was a controversial decision. Not that it was... most observers were comfortable with that decision, even if Whitaker complained about it.

Why not make a similar comment about the Ike Quartey fight, which was also very close, with several knockdowns by each fighter, and the outcome not decided until the 12th round.

Your comments about the "controversial majority-decision loss to Félix Trinidad" was much more reasonable, but your comments on the "two decision losses to Shane Mosley" lacked the same punch, since these were controversial as well.

I'm not sure how you consider Bernard Hopkins to be "more technical." Many people think Oscar was winning the fight until he took a rib-breaking shot to the body. Simply listing this as a "KO" makes it sound like he was knocked into unconsciousness, when he was not.

Mayweather WON Get Over IT I'm not sure how you conclude that Vargas was Oscar's "nemesis." The same was said for Genaro Hernandez, who's career also went nowhere after he lost.

It might be interesting to mention that when Oscar fought Felix Sturm, he won virtually every round, which shows just how great a boxer Oscar really is.

Also, rather than saying that Oscar fought "much better than expected" against Ricardo Mayorga, why not just say that he dominated this champion and destroyed him in 6. The expectation that Oscar might not have been as good as before is an opinion... perhaps your opinion, and not something that should appear on Wikipedia.

Also, how is offering a fighter $250,000 to sign a contract a "controversy?"

Spelling of surname?

What is the correct spelling of his surname? Is it De La Hoya, De la Hoya or de la Hoya? -- Hey Teacher 15:16, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

de la Hoya. Spanish names don't capitalize "de", "del", "de la". --Vizcarra 00:01, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

Thank you (sorry for the late reply). Should the article be changed then? He is referred to as "De La Hoya" almost all the time (except for the name of the article). -- Hey Teacher 08:59, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

At start of sentence

_ _ I've restored the caps wherever the surname begins a sentence. That's what's done in English (and probably every alphabetic language that uses upper and lower cases), with the arguable exception of trademarks like iPod, which have the second letter upper case. Lower case was invented to permit certain things to stand out:

1. SHOUTING,
2. important words in titles of works,
3. first word of sentence (to aid perception of the sentence as a visual unit, which helps the unconscious task of grasping, sentence by sentence, the meaning of what's read; that's also what the period or full stop and other end of sentence punctuation are for), and
4. proper names (quickly alerting readers that writers mentioning Frank don't necessarily have a position on his frankness and those mentioning Charity don't necessarily see her as the embodiment of either loving kindness or demeaning favors).

Different languages do have their own rules about small words that are part of a name (sometimes flexible or complicated rules; English says "John of Gaunt" while its adaptation of Irish Gaelic names goes "O'Shaughnessy", but there's no logic to keeping the lower case at the start of the sentence: can you doubt that the Spanish translation of the sentence

Of mice and men, much can be said.

begins "De" rather than "de"?
View it this way: upper casing that normally appears in a given name is unconditional; lower casing that normally appears is simply an exception to unconditional upper casing, but is not unconditional lower casing. The marquis screams

DE LA HOYA FIGHTS TONITE!

not

dE lA HOYA FIGHTS TONITE!

nor even

de la HOYA FIGHTS TONITE!

and the D goes upper case at the start of a sentence or title of a work.
_ _ If you really can't stand to see the capital at the start of his surname, i suggest (beyond getting yourself some therapy), you can (once recasting the sentence with "He" more often gets excessive) move "de la Hoya" later in the sentence. Think about it: if you were told (a rule that some insist on) that you can't start sentences with digits, would you start them instead with, on one hand,

Two hundred fifty thousand troops arrived ...

and

Nineteen ninety-four's elections brought ...

or, on the other hand, with

The arrival of 250,000 troops ...

and

The 1994 elections brought ...

--Jerzy•t 17:05, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Championship Boxes

Anychance someone with a higher level of skill then me could edit this article so those championship boxes dont fill up so much space? If you look at other boxers like Lennox Lewis, they have pages where the championship's section is very sleek and tightly fit together, Can someone do that here? it would really clean up the page I think. Midusunknown 05:57, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks Rrp1972, looks much better! Midusunknown 08:57, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

not a problem! Rrp1972 16:13, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

Number of Knockouts

After the Mayorga fight, he has 30 knockouts. While the second Chavez fight was indeed a case off Chavez quitting on the stool, that is still considered a technical knockout and so is reflected as such in de la Hoya's record. MKil 13:05, 11 May 2006 (UTC)MKil

I tend to agree with MKil, but boxingrec.com/HBO/and others have Chavez listed as RTD, i am sure that means retired not retarded, although HBO lists his total KOs at 30 because of this. So we can compromise and leave the stats at W RTD 8 like everyone else and the KOs at 30--Richard Pérez 19:38, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

RTD is used in Europe more than in America, and since Boxrec.com is run by a Brit, it is starting to use RTDs for when a fighter retires on his stool between rounds. As an editor there, I'm not thrilled by that, but it's not my site and I don't set the rules. In the U.S. when a fighter retires between rounds it is almost always counted as a TKO. Ring magazine, for instance, lists it as such. In the interests of averting an edit war, I think it's a wise compromise to leave the Chavez TKO as an RTD but to count it towards de la Hoya's total knockouts. MKil 21:06, 16 May 2006 (UTC)MKil

This is a very boring article about de la Hoya. The author should add more details in his childhood.

Oscar is NOT the only six division champion in boxing history. Tommy Hearns also held world titles at six different weights, from welter up to cruiser.

If your opponent quits its a TKO. Roberto Duran vs. Ray Leonard, Sonny Liston vs. Cassius Clay/Ali for example.-Jan/31/07

de la Hoya vs. De La Hoya

Shouldn't it be De La Hoya, with capital letters? Every website, every fight that I've ever seen that has his name has it with capital letters.-1/11/07 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.247.5.216 (talk) 02:25, January 12, 2007 (UTC)

I agree that "de la" should be capitalized. First, Oscar is an American, so Spanish grammatical conventions concerning the non-capitalization of "de", "del" or "de la" are not dispositive. The fact is that Oscar himself spells his name "De La Hoya" [1]. That should decide the issue itself. Furthermore, the mainstream media sources are consistent in referring to him as "De La Hoya": [2] [3] [4] [5]. In short, both Oscar and the mainstream media capitalize the "De La" portion of his surname. I don't see any basis for deviation.-PassionoftheDamon 17:11, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

I've moved page back to 'Oscar De La Hoya'. GoodDay 21:42, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

Inconsistencies with article...

...Mentions ODLH status as one of boxings "All-Time Greats" but does not do so for other equally, if not more accomplished fighters of lesser commercial exposure. Also adds note describing controversial victory over Pernell Whitaker & loss to Felix Trinidad but not his victory over Ike Quartey. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.193.80.173 (talk) 19:54, 21 March 2007 (UTC).

Lack of neutrality

The section about the Mayweather fight is clearly biased in favor of De La Hoya.--Davidbillig 09:23, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

If I was a boxing judge, I would of definitely gave the fight to De la Hoya. He charged at Mayweather the whole fight. Mayweather had a look of fear in his eyes from the time the fight started to the very last round. And I did watch it over again. The majority of boxing fans are shocked by the decision also. And by the way....did you all see Mayweather come out in Mexican garb?? Wonder why there was no controversy there? Want to know why? Because there is more important things to the Mexican culture than to look at someone and make a big deal out of an "African American" wearing thier colors on thier day. If it was Oscar wearing African attire on Martin Luther King Jr's birthday....Oh boy...look out world. He would have so many lawsuits against him that he would no longer be called the "Golden Boy"68.102.168.208 15:39, 8 May 2007 (UTC)Maria de la Luz!!

Thank god you aren't a boxing judge, because what Oscar exhibited all night is called ineffective aggression. In other words, he was aggressive, but didn't really accomplish anything during his spurts of aggression. Not only that, but he fell asleep at the wheel during the last five rounds. Yes, he earned some rounds based on the fact that his aggressiveness outweighed Mayweather's accurate punching at times, but not more than 4 (5 at the most) of the 12 in the opinions of naerly everyone. According to ESPN's Dan Rafael, no one on press row had De La Hoya winning, but a few did have the fight scored a draw. BoxingNut 20:11, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

Oscar lost and I have no idea what fight people that think he won was seeing!71.198.169.119 16:38, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

PPV $$

His Pay-per-view money total needs to be updated to include recent fights, or at the least it needs to be said that the total is only through a particular date.

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.229.26.210 (talk) 16:08, 8 May 2007 (UTC).

Fox sports reports le hoya may make $35 million and Mayweather $20 million. http://msn.foxsports.com/boxing/story/6791828

Personal Life?

What happened to his personal Life section? (MgTurtle 01:41, 23 May 2007 (UTC)).

I was required to remove it because it wasn't sourced. (WP:BLP) I left the least dubious information though. Sancho 06:10, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Nationality

As I see it, Oscar should be classified as a "Mexican-American" boxer, not American. I've tried to change it a couple of times, but it always get changed over to "American" by someone with no strong basis at all. Oscar de la Hoya was born in California to Mexican parents; if you look up the definition of Mexican-American in wikipedia, you'll find out that that's excactly what he is. If you don't agree with wikipedia's definition, you might as well not agree with Oscar's article. Don't contradict yourselves. It seems to me that calling him "American" without futher thougths is part of some user's pro-American bias. Oscar was born to Mexican parents, he acquired Mexican citizenship in 2002, he speaks fluent Spanish with a Mexican accent, he used to fight with both an American and a Mexican flag on his shorts. There really is no room for denying his "Mexican-American" character. I'll refrain from editing his nationality in the article for the third time, for it'll probably just get changed back by "user0202398.239" or by "batman202" or whatever. I just hope that the great majority of people who have been watching Oscar fight since the beginning will agree that he is in fact a Mexican-American boxer. An just by the way, I do agree that "de la" should not be capitalized. It might be that way in posters or TV ads, but the way it is written on his birth certificate and passport is "Oscar de la Hoya". And that is his name.

He's American. Fought for and won gold medal for the United States. Not Mexico. 74.142.90.195 00:32, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Frenec Puskás played and scored for the Spanish National Football Team. However, there is no need to argue if he was a Spaniard or not: he was Hungarian. Mauro Camoranesi was born in Argentina and won a World Cup for Italy. When asked about his nationality, Camoranesi will always remark on his DOUBLE NATIONALITY as an Argentinian and Italian (look him up, wikipedia correctly describes him as an "Italo-Argentinian footballer"). So, not only does Oscar de la Hoya have Mexican citizenship (which makes him automatically a Mexican), but he also has an enormous Mexican cultural and liguistic background that can't be taken away. Not even if he won a dozen medals for the United States. Your national pride seems to be blinding you. I never believed it, but I see it is actually true that some wikipedia articles are heavily distorted by people with no desire to know.

Crossdressing?

Crossdressing?