Talk:Timothy Dalton

Birth Year: 1946

Dalton was born in 1946. Theres a lot of misinformation on this on the Internet (including IMDb) that claims 1944, but it is wrong. See CommanderBond.net, Dalton's authorised website, The Ian Fleming Foundation, MI6.co.uk, Universal Exports, The James Bond International Fan Club, The BBC. I can go on and on here. K1Bond007 04:25, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

I'm not completely convinced. We're only going by which websites say what - nothing exactly concrete. I suspect that 1944 may indeed be correct, as a lot of actors aren't completely honest about their age.--Fallout boy 12:04, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Dalton did fudge his age. He claimed 1944, but he was born in 1946. I'm sorry, but I doubt the people that known Dalton best are wrong here. K1Bond007 19:03, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

1944 sounds more believable as that would make him 42 in "The Living Daylights" and 44 in "Licence to Kill", but then Dalton was a heavy smoker which may have caused him to look older. I would be surprised if the well-respected Internet Movie Database got it wrong. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 195.93.21.72 (talk • contribs) .

IMDb is wrong all the time. The information on that site can be added by anyone just like Wikipedia. IMDb just has a check in place so that blatant vandalism never happens. Case and point: [1], IMDb lists Michaël Youn as being in Casino Royale. He's not in the film. It also obviously lists Sebastien Foucan twice for two different spellings of his character's name. K1Bond007 20:30, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

IMDb is not "just like Wikipedia". Their information is reviewed and requires sourcing before addition. As for Michaël Youn, he isn't in the credits.--Fallout boy 03:57, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

You mean like the sources I just gave you? Anyone can add information, but yeah you're right it gets reviewed, but that doesn't mean the reviewer knows anything either. Don't begin to think that IMDb is infallible. When I made that point about Youn, they were listing him. They also previously listed Michael Giacchino as the composer for the same film a while back and didn't even list Paul Haggis who has been known since 2005 until maybe a couple weeks ago. Look at IMDb: "Staff members gauge the validity of contributed data based on the past reliability of the contributor, as none are themselves experts in all of the significantly varied areas of film history to know what is valid themselves. Given the volume of submissions and the number of volunteers who submit information, it's little wonder that errors abound." -- Even in this interview Dalton claims he was 15 or 16 in 1962. You do the math. K1Bond007 06:46, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

I never meant to imply that I thought IMDb is infallible, but of all the databases I use I almost never see birthdates there that I am certain are wrong. I checked on of the bonus features on The Living Daylights, and he said in an interview that he thought he was too young at 24 in 1968 to play James Bond. As for Pierce, as far as I can tell 1953 is correct, it even says that on his official site (that doesn't make it an undisputable fact, by lying about his age on such a visible place is unlikely).--Fallout boy 23:27, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for clearing up the Dalton age controversy. There have been many celebrities who have knocked a year off their age (Bing Crosby, Charlton Heston etc), but it makes you wonder why somebody would add two years on!

Because the misinformation about Dalton's birth year seems to be extremely pervasive around the Internet (and, I have noted, it has been incorrectly cited in places elsewhere on Wikipedia), I thought it was worth including the briefest of notes, in the main body of the article, not just in the footnote. Your mileage may vary. --A user.

Marital status

I am not sure how to source something that is simply background information and probably shouldn't be included in the actual article; but, as someone recently added "wife" to "Oksana Grigorieva," which I edited out, I thought I would put down here the sourcing for the information that Dalton is not married to her. Source of information is a 24 February 2007 interview with him (Daniel Craig doesn't know what he's in for, by Rebecca Hardy) in the London Daily Mail, which says: "Despite reports to the contrary, Dalton remains unmarried." I think that should settle it. 24.58.169.119 02:55, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

Endured?

I changed the line "endured the task of playing Rhett Butler" to simply "played Rhett Butler". Dalton was paid five million dollars for that assignment, so it was hardly a matter of endurance, regardless of the reviews.

Licence To Kill revenue losses

Would it be possible for the person who stated that Licence to Kill had lost $22 to cite their source. Allow me to stress that I've read such an article somewhere before so I'm not disputing the validity of the statement. Isn't it odd, however, that a film that cost $36m and grossed $156m at the theatrical box-office made a loss of $22m. Even when you consider that a studio only recovers 40-50% of box office takings (which, in LTK's case, would be $70m-$80m) its still preposterous to think that only $14m of that found its way back to the studio. Even if it did, you can hardly blame Timothy Dalton - its not his fault that only $14m of a $156m+ gross ends up in the hands of the financiers.

The Living Daylights cost $30m and grossed $191m. So, again, how could that make a loss? Given that the Dalton bond films actually grossed a better percentage of their budget than the Brosnan films (ie $191m is over 6 time of $30m - no Brosnan film has grossed 6 times its budget), I find it hard to believe that the Dalton films made losses and the Brosnan ones didn't.

As I said, I've read such assertions before. I just find it very hard to believe. Does anyone else? In light of my argument, wouldn't it be possible for the article to dispute the assertions made? Dar2020 00:01, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Opinions vs. facts

Re the following line in the text: Film critics and fans of Fleming's original novels welcomed a more serious interpretation after more than a decade of Moore's approach.[8] Do we really need (a) an opinion here which is hard to factually quantify, and moreover, to (b) have it be sourced to someone's fan site? Personally speaking, I welcomed it too, but that's just my opinion, and not quantifiable and doesn't belong in the article, in my opinion. Will seek further feedback on this here before going ahead and trimming it. 24.58.169.119 03:10, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

Opinions should not be found in an ecyclopedia. But it happens. Refering to fan sites is a big no no.--Puppy Zwolle (Puppy) 20:19, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Ascending desending lists

Maybe my lack of knowlwedge but it look weird that the filmography and the theater work listing do not follow the same template. Shouldn't both be the same order: starting with the oldest work and ending with the newest?--Puppy Zwolle (Puppy) 20:16, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Nationality

Part italian?

in many sites, there is written he is part Italian, but I don't know if it's true or not...

Welsh AND English?

Gah. Sorry all, I've just made a change and only after pressing save did I notice the HTML comment (out of place at the top of the infobox) about Englishness. But, having apologised, I actually think it's much better to just say "Welsh-born British" because "Welsh-born English" is inherently confusing. – Kieran T ^{(talk | contribs)} 16:38, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Not to mention that he's an American as well, through his mother. ProhibitOnions ^(T) 17:28, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

He's a British citizen, as such, he can freely live in Wales or England, so it's a bit strange to call him Welsh-born English. What if he decided to move back to Wales? He'd stop being English? Regardless, why not just say he's a British actor who was born in Wales? Oh, and his mother was an American, but he isn't. -24.149.193.49 (talk) 18:09, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

If Dalton was born in Wales and spent the first four years of his life there that makes him Welsh, whether he thinks of himself as Welsh or not. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.145.240.148 (talk) 23:00, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Some people will think the fact that Timothy Dalton was born in Wales and spent the first half-decade of his life in that country makes him Welsh. Others will think the fact that he moved to England before his fourth birthday means he must have become English by the time he reached adulthood. You could make a perfectly reasonable argument either way. There is no absolute rule that governs these things. Like Timothy Dalton, Monty Python’s Terry Jones was born in Colwyn Bay. Although he moved to England aged four-and-half, he has always felt “100% Welsh”. Tony Blair, on the other hand, was born in Scotland and only moved to England when he went to university aged 18: yet he has publicly stated that he regards himself as English.

In the eyes of the law, there is no such thing as English, Welsh, Scottish or Northern Irish nationality – only British citizenship. If Dalton had been an international-class footballer, he would have been eligible to play for Wales (land of his birth), England (land of his father) or the U.S.A. (land of his mother). Ryan Giggs, on the other hand, although he moved to England aged seven and speaks with a Manchester accent, was not eligible to play for England because neither he, his parents, nor any of his grandparents were born there. As far as international football is concerned, living in England from a young age and speaking with an English accent has not made Giggs an Englishman any more than living his entire life up to the age of 16 in Wales except for being born in Chester has made Michael Owen a Welshman.

The point is, there are no objective criteria for determining how Welsh or English someone with Timothy Dalton’s background really is. Any judgement made on the matter would be a subjective opinion and Wikipedia Policy absoloutely forbids personal opinions being presented in articles as if they were facts. Stating that Dalton is "a Welsh actor" or "an English actor" in the introduction is definitely presenting an opinion as if it were an indisputable fact.

The only fact that we know about Timothy Dalton’s nationality is that he is legally a British citizen. I think the most sensible solution is to give Dalton his legal nationality in the intro and leave the reader to make up their own mind about how English or Welsh he is according to the facts presented in the main text. In other words, we should stick to presenting the facts: not try to tell the reader what to think about them.

Conval 11:32, 15 September 2007 (UTC)

He's obviously British, as he was born in Britain. It just so happens that he was born in Wales. So he's Welsh AND British. I suppose he's Welsh, English AND American, too. Could someone please change the opening blurb to reflect his Britishness. Peesemould (talk) 20:30, 12 February 2009 (UTC)

He seems to think he's Welsh!

The online version of an article from Prevue Magazine in 1987, “Introducing Timothy Dalton" by Glenn Fuller, contains the following quotation from Timothy:
"Richard Burton was Welsh; Tom Jones is Welsh, and we Welshmen like to think of ourselves as heroes - on screen and off!"
This article is to be found at http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Film/7518/Bond_Eng/Bond_Eng.htm There are several other articles before it on the page, so you have to scroll well down in order to get to it.
Flonto 18:27, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

Website unavailable

Mr. Dalton's official website, linked in the Infobox, has now been unavailable for at least a couple of months. If it does not re-appear within a reasonable time-period, it will have to be deleted from this article. 81.145.242.119 (talk) 12:31, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

The picture of him in License to kill

Okay, some asshole got rid of his picture. That is total nonsense and someone needs to do something about it. Footballfan190 (talk) 08:19, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Image

Can someone add a free image of Dalton available in Commons? David Pro (talk) 13:48, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

I've proposed this image to be copied to Commons given that in Commons there aren't pics of him. David Pro (talk) 14:08, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

Mainly Theatre Actor

Sincere apologies if I am doing this wrong, but the section on "Early Life and Career" confuses me. It states (beginning of second paragraph) that Dalton took time off in 1971 and did mostly theatre work thereafter until 1978, the single exception being the 1975 film "Permission to Kill". However, Dalton had a pivotal role as Henry Stuart, Lord Darnley, in the 1972 film "Mary, Queen of Scots", and is better remembered in that role than for the 1975 work. Thank you for your kind review. Ellendare (talk) 20:59, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

If it is wrong, please fix it. And if you would be so kind, add a reference or two for it. IP4240207xx (talk) 03:02, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Doctor Who?

As the page stands now, Timothy is listed as being the next in line for playing the role of the Master on Doctor Who. Does anyone have a source for this? The BBC is notoriously tight lipped about casting for this series, so I would be skeptical that they would declare something like this so far in advance. Still, if there is a reliable source for this I'd love to see it. Monkey Bounce (talk) 22:34, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

As seen in a screencap from RTD's leaving video, Timothy Dalton is dressed in Time Lord apparel alongside David Tennant and current Master (probably until the New Year's episode), John Simm: io9. 80.177.217.162 (talk) 15:45, 16 June 2009 (UTC)