Talk:Hawk

Anyone have references

Anyone have references for both the Lefebvre mention and the claim in the proceeding sentence? I've heard about the Lefebvre thing, but I've seen that last one - "eight times more acute than humans" - in many places, with nary a primary source in cite. (hehe) Metanoid 00:41, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

don't know a primary source, but How animals see gives some reasons, which I've added. jimfbleak 07:08, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

religion

I've taken out the "hawks as religious symbols" since most of these species don't even occur in the US - if any are, the comments should be on the page for the relevant species, but I'd be surprised if eg the Sharp-shinned Hawk is venerated.

The main aim of that section appears to be to justify the link to the religious freedom campaigning group, which I've removed also, since hardly about birds.

I've amended the hawks and humans to make more US-centric. Birds of prey are protected outside the US, and ranchers don't occur in Europe.

Falconers mainly use falcons - hence the name.

jimfbleak 05:21, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

RE: I don't understand why someone would remove reliable information in this manner because they themselves do not know about the topic in the way it is being discussed. this is like saying you would be surprised that lakota people exist because you've never met any. just because you lack knowledge and experience does not justify your censoring information that is reliable. hawks and their feathers and parts are used as religious obejcts by native americans. go to any pow wow and you'll see hawk feathers on peoples' bustles, on their dance staffs, on their roaches (porcupine headdresses)... some people use hawk feathers to pray with as well... hence the inclusion of this relevant information. i don't understand why someone would remove/censor this information just because they don't know about it themselves. is it just about the sharp-shinned hawk or the feruginous or the red tailed hawk? of course not. all hawks and falcons and eagles are used as religious objects by native american people. please don't censor something just because you yourself don't know about it.

RE: falconers also use eagles and hawks, hence the inclusion in the note.

please have the courtesy to sign your comments, and also to read what I actually said. The world is not just the US, and I don't believe that native americans use the Sulawesi Goshawk or most of the others in the list as religious objects because they don't occur in your country.

I didn't take eagles and hawks out of falconry, if you read that, I just changed the emphasis to reflect the facts.

Also, don't put on links to websites with spy links, that comes close to vandalism.

jimfbleak 06:52, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

RE: i agree, the world isn't just the u.s.--yet you've edited the content of article, in your own words, to make it more "u.s. centric".

you didn't just change emphasis, you censored information pertinent to the article. also, being native american myself, and knowing lots of others, i can vouch that native american people would still use hawks and eagles from other countries as religious/ceremonial objects. that goes for wedge tailed eagle in australia, harpy eagle in mexico, and those are just from people i've known personally. the link was included to give people more pertinent information regarding the birds as religious objects and their current status as such. hence, it was all pertinent. before you go challenging people on what you yourself know nothing about, GO GET YOURSELF AN EDUCATION!!

you want references for hawks as religious objects, and their comparison to christian religious objects? well, check below. i'm done with this wikipedia stuff. people here are too bent on others knowing and thinking only what they think. this isn't about knowledge or access to information--it's become all about what you want.

REFERENCES: Feathers as religious objects

Feather Law By Stephen Cook (references eagles, hawks, and other birds) http://www.pequotmuseum.org/Home/CrossPaths/CrossPathsSpring2003/FeatherLaw.htm

Indian Feathers (references crows, eagles, hawks…) http://www.indians.org/articles/indian-feathers.html

East Goshen Elementary Celebrates Native American Day (refers to bustle with hawk feathers) http://www.wcasd.net/news/news042406c.htm

Migratory Bird Feathers(refers to lack of FWS services to provide feathers of non-eagle migratory birds to Native Americans for ceremonial purposes) http://library.fws.gov/Pubs2/nativeamerican01.pdf

Alaska's Birds of Prey: Historical and Contemporary Perspectives by Karen Lew (refers to owls, hawks and eagles as ceremonial/spiritual objects to Native Americans) http://www.wildlife.alaska.gov/index.cfm?adfg=birds.raptors

Protecting Religious Freedom and Sacred Sites, by Friends Committee on National Legislation. (refers to eagles and animal remains as religious ceremonial objects) http://www.fcnl.org/issues/item.php?item_id=1475&issue_id=96

REFERENCES: hawks/eagles/etc. comparison to Christian objects

eagle feathers confiscated (compares eagle feathers to the cross) http://www.newschannel5.tv/2006/3/30/7039/Eagle-feathers-confiscated-

A Troubling Chapter in the Bald Eagle's Success Story, by Steven Bodzin. Los Angeles Times, July 18, 2005 (compares requirement for eagle feather same as if required permit for a cross) http://www.stevenbodzin.com/shtml/clips/eagle.shtml

Group claims bias over prayer feather. Arkansas Democrat Gazette. (compares feathers to the cross or rosary) www.ardemgaz.com/ShowStoryTemplate.asp?Path=ArDemocratNW/2005/10/28&ID=Ar00302&Section=Arkansas

Use of Indian mascots is a big deal . Asheville Citizens-Times Saturday Nov. 14, 1998 (compares eagle feathers to crucifix) http://www.main.nc.us/wncceib/ACT111498.htm

Plays (compares eagle feather to crucifix and star of David) http://www.encompass.org/compassionplays/plays.html

WHAT SIZE PREY CAN A HAWK LIFT?

I live just outside of Atlanta, and I believe we have red-tail hawks here. I keep seeing three hawks circling my property when my three dogs are out in the field. The dogs are smallish... between 14 and 25lbs. Is it possible that the hawks are considering my dogs as prey?? It seems unlikely to me, but this has happened several times.

8=============D —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.130.87.160 (talk) 23:50, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

There are few birds of prey that are large and powerful enough to take even a cat, let alone a small dog. Only the Snowy Owl and a couple of large African and Asian Eagles spring to mind. Hawks spend a lot of time circling because that's how they find their prey (We regularly have Common Buzzards over), but they are looking for more manageable and less well armed food items like rabbits, mice and carrion, jimfbleak 06:18, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Where is Buteo?

The Buteo Genus should be listed here, correct? http://ctd.mdibl.org/detail.go;jsessionid=9D994DAE0DB7BF984C51E11A3112A517?type=taxon&acc=8955 It seems there are a few that are missing. Earthsound 03:22, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Nevermind. I just read too quickly and didn't realize that was the Falconiformes Order. Earthsound 03:45, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

my recent edits

to any concerned: took out a lot of info already found on the Accipitrinae under the article of that name; the term "hawk", ambiguous as it is, seem more fit for a disambig page. much of the info here could/should be found under the various entries of the individual taxa concerned. information on sensory systems should probably go to the Falconiformes page under the proper heading. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Metanoid (talk • contribs) 19:57, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

wth? could've sworn there was a separate article for the Accipitrinae. hmmm. maybe there should be; "hawk" seems too ambiguous. comments? - Metanoid (talk, email) 19:43, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Merge proposal

see also any discussion at Talk:Bird of prey, the proposed destination. there are similar terms, and this entry might do more work as a fleshed-out section of t'other. --Μετανοιδ (talk, email) 07:03, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

see also Talk:WikiProject_Birds#Merge_proposal. - Μετανοιδ (talk, email) 07:23, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

cleanse

I've tidied this up a bit to remove repetition I've removed the image which was positioned contra MOS, and given the dozens of good images we have, a captive bird seemed inappropriate. jimfbleak (talk) 06:33, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

Biology Project

• Log in when editing your project. Otherwise I am unable to determine your contributions.
• Place the potential list of references on the talk page - not in the article until you are prepared to actually cite them. --JimmyButler (talk) 10:12, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

Potential Sources

1. Sutton, Clay; Dunne, Peter Masten. Hawks in Flight : The Flight Identification of North American Migrant Raptors. Houghton Mifflin. ISBN 0-395-51022-8. {{cite book}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors= (help)CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link)
2. Johnsgard, Paul A. (2001). Hawks, eagles, and falcons of North America: biology and natural history. Washington, D.C.: Smithsonian Institution. ISBN 1-56098-946-7. {{cite book}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors= (help)
3. Price, Anne J. Raptors: The Eagles, Hawks, Falcons, and Owls of North America. Roberts Rinehart Publishers. ISBN 1-57098-405-0. {{cite book}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors= (help)

Cheers! Wassupwestcoast (talk) 03:28, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

would hawks snatch up a kitten?

I had a little kitten about 10 weeks old that was very playful and loved to climb trees. I'm in the central Texas area. Is it possible that a hawk may have taken my little kitten and killed it?