User talk:Grobtak: Difference between revisions
Replying again |
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Ok, I can't say I'm quite happy with some of your changes. First of all, the lotr campaigns link now doesn't direct to anywhere. Also, there are several |
Ok, I can't say I'm quite happy with some of your changes. First of all, the lotr campaigns link now doesn't direct to anywhere. Also, there are several inaccuracies: The dark council was not the result of a merging of councils, they were there from the beginning and were unrivalled. The taskforces idea was not a major part of evil's success, most players were directed without strike forces. |
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I was going to extend it later on. But agreed, some of the information I wrote on the campaign is better fitting there. |
I was going to extend it later on. But agreed, some of the information I wrote on the campaign is better fitting there. |
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Yes, the "lotr" |
Yes, the "lotr" abbreviation was confusing. You're right about that. |
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Also, good did win with 3 victory points. My fault, sorry. |
Also, good did win with 3 victory points. My fault, sorry. |
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Revision as of 19:46, 11 March 2006
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Grimhelm 14:12, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
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Style of Articles: War of the Ring Campaign and Dark Council
Nice to see you've joined Wikipedia. I can see you've made a long edit to wikipedia's War of the Ring Campaign article, but these edits seem a little too detailed and not in the standard Wikipedia style. The article was fine beforehand, but now it is full of superfluous information making it (unneccessarily) longer than the War of the Ring article. It is also quite opinionated, in comparison to the neutral stance the article formerly held. I'd like to inform you that some other Wikipedians may mistake it for vandalism, just to give a warning. I'm not sure exactly what to do with this, but it'll definately have to be shortened. Perhaps you should move most of this to the Dark Council article, to which it more specifically relates (you failed to establish its notability, by the way), and take a good long read of Wikipedia's Manual of Style. I'll come back for the task of cleaning up these articles later. Grimhelm 22:52, 10 March 2006 (UTC) (yes, that is me from the War of the Ring)
Replying to Grimhelm
"I can see you've made a long edit to wikipedia's War of the Ring Campaign article, but these edits seem a little too detailed and not in the standard Wikipedia style. The article was fine beforehand, but now it is full of superfluous information making it (unneccessarily) longer than the War of the Ring article. "
I just added some information, what's wrong with that? If you want information you don't need to read it all, you can always just skim it. And what do you mean, different style? I just edited the original page and added information, and I don't think I used a different style.
"It is also quite opinionated, in comparison to the neutral stance the article formerly held."
Is it? It looks quite neutral to me. What I said was either based on hard facts, or the opinions of the players. For example, the "Ruthless efficiency of the dark council" bit was picked directly from the good forum. I admit that I can't be sure just how much influence the alliance of Light had, but that was also taken from what the good players said. Most of them were under the opinion that they didn't need a council, and few listened to you. The dark council however, was widely seen as the leaders of evil, according to what was said on the forums of both good and evil. Also, I did say that good copied the strike forces idea from evil. This might make it seem biased, but if I remember correctly good didn't deny this. They did say, however, that since evil got it from Storm of chaos, good was allowed to use it too. Which is true. If my information is incorrect, please say so, but be more specific. Or if you want, I can remove that part entirely, since it is not that relevant anyway.
"I'd like to inform you that some other Wikipedians may mistake it for vandalism, just to give a warning."
Vandalism? According to Wikipedia, vandalism is intentionally adding false information or remove existent info. What I did was add unbiased information to an existing article. I fail to notice how anyone could see that as vandalism.
"I'm not sure exactly what to do with this, but it'll definitely have to be shortened. "
Once again, why? Just read what information you wish, skip the rest. it is impossible to read everything that is on wikipedia, but the idea is that you can find it if you want to. So if someone wants a detailed report on the war of the ring, it is there now. What's wrong with that?
"Perhaps you should move most of this to the Dark Council article, to which it more specifically relates"
Not really. What I wrote is about how the campaign went. I think it is a lot more logical to put it in the War of the Ring article.
"and take a good long read of Wikipedia's Manual of Style."
I did, but I don't seem to have done anything wrong. If I have, could you please be more specific?
Please reply soon.
Grobtak, 10:51, 11 March 2006
Further Comments
First of all, your reply is like a forum reply - you have to get into the habit of using unfragmented wikipedia replies (that took me a while to get used to too). It might also save you some time if you sign your name with 4-tildes (a tilde is this symbol: ~) - Wikipedia will automatically sign your name for you if you do this (it also took me a while to figure that one out). Aside from that, I suppose I'm being a bit to hard on your first edits (mine were pretty messed up on the War of the Ring when I first joined). Okay, so maybe people might want to skip past them, but it could be confusing to people who weren't actually in the War of the Ring, and a lot of it also seems more relevant (but then that's just my opinion) to articles on the various councils.
I suppose "vandalism" might be taking it a bit too far, but the Dark Council Article is definately in need of cleanup, and you have to establish notability not just for the GW Community, but for people who were not participants of the War of the Ring. Another editor (not me) tagged the Dark Council Article with "An editor has expressed a concern that the subject of the article does not satisfy one of the following guidelines for inclusion on Wikipedia...", naming various missing criteria. Here's what I think should be done. Mention the information briefly on the WoTR article, and move most of it to the DC article, so if someone wants to read further they can click on the link to the Dark Council. Another problem with the DC article is its lack of internal wiki-links and its use of abbraviations the casual reader may be unaware of, but I'll clean it up later.
And on the issue of neutrality, despite being a good player, I was not a member of any forums outside the GW one, despite actually being invited to the Alliance of Light Council. Why? Because I wanted to maintain neutrality. I'll admit that not many people would listen to me (I definately know a few did - CaptainIngold is an example), but that is merely because I was only one person offering roleplay as either an alternative to (or a reason to follow) the AOL. My advice was somewhat redundant, though, when the Grand Host of Light took over the task of roleplay.
I played a good amount of Good games, and even a few as Evil, but I had fun at it. While I learned a good bit about the DC from your edits, I still think it focuses too much on the interior workings of the DC rather than the WoTR Campaign as a whole; this is why I feel it is more relevant to the DC article, unless you want to comment also on the interior workings of The Alliance of Light (which is impossible for either of us to do first-hand). Grimhelm 11:18, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
- Okay, I just cleaned up both articles. I moved most of what you added on the War of the Ring Campaign to The Dark Council. I left some of your relevant edits on the WoTR article, and generally expanded the DC article using the left over material. One of the first things I noticed was the use of abbreviations such as "lotr". Firstly, it is important to avoid using abbreviations as they might confuse readers, and secondly, the "lotr" abbreviation applies to Tolkien's Lord of the Rings, whereas I think you meant to use "LoTR SBG" - id est "The Lord of the Rings Strategy Battle Game". Hopefully you will find the edits I made to The Dark Council useful, and perhaps you might have a relevant picture or logo for the article (though that could be some what difficult to procure for a forum article!). I also added the standard formal introduction to Wikipedia at the top of the page. Grimhelm 14:12, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
Replying again
Sorry for not replying in wikipedia style, as you know, I'm still a newb here. Please bare with me.
Ok, I can't say I'm quite happy with some of your changes. First of all, the lotr campaigns link now doesn't direct to anywhere. Also, there are several inaccuracies: The dark council was not the result of a merging of councils, they were there from the beginning and were unrivalled. The taskforces idea was not a major part of evil's success, most players were directed without strike forces.
Also, yes, the dark council article wasn't very good. but previously, you linked to a dark council article, but there was nothing to link to. So I thought I'd write a bit up for the dc.
I was going to extend it later on. But agreed, some of the information I wrote on the campaign is better fitting there.
Yes, the "lotr" abbreviation was confusing. You're right about that.
Also, good did win with 3 victory points. My fault, sorry.